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M9 versus M8.1 tests

Doc Henry

By Doc Henry
in Leica M9 / M-E

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adan

adan

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Let me point out something. LUF allows images up to 960 pixels wide/tall - but they also have a file size limit of 240 K. A 960 x 640 image is about 2 Mbytes, so it gets almost a 90% compression to be shown here.

 

Throw away 90% of the data in a file, and what, realistically, do you think you'll see?

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lct

lct

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....For photos taken with the M9 and M8, as i said above, it's : DNG-RAW-TIFF and posted in PNG (but no JPEG i don't like it)...For the size of the photos, i usually post photos average (700x. ..) because when i post too great you are not happy...

OK it's fine to post small pics as they are easier to view on little screens but they can hardly show anything usefull if you want to compare sharpness for instance. Then you might wish to post 100% crops as well, with 240KB they can show a lot of things despite the small size of the crop. And/or you might wish to post a link to a larger file like this one on Flikr for example: http://tinyurl.com/qusf39 (4.8MB). As for raw files, converters play a big part in the final result. Which one are you using if i may ask?

 

3877567184_b9ba46a1dd_o.jpg

 

3927402776_344c3dcfd2_o.jpg

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charlesphoto99

charlesphoto99

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Well, so far the conclusion here is one can take really boring photos with BOTH the M8 and M9. :rolleyes:

 

Seriously if you don't need the full frame and extra 8mp and one stop high iso improvement then the M8 at less than half the cost is probably more camera than most people could conceivably use. I think pixel peepers get to hung up on supposed differences in iq which is only important to a point vs how the camera is designed for actual use to make great photographs.

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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Let me point out something. LUF allows images up to 960 pixels wide/tall - but they also have a file size limit of 240 K. A 960 x 640 image is about 2 Mbytes, so it gets almost a 90% compression to be shown here.

 

Throw away 90% of the data in a file, and what, realistically, do you think you'll see?

Andy i would like your expert opinion on these last two photos.

Merci.

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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Well, so far the conclusion here is one can take really boring photos with BOTH the M8 and M9. :rolleyes:

 

Seriously if you don't need the full frame and extra 8mp and one stop high iso improvement then the M8 at less than half the cost is probably more camera than most people could conceivably use. I think pixel peepers get to hung up on supposed differences in iq which is only important to a point vs how the camera is designed for actual use to make great photographs.

Charles,

Your opinion is precious to me because I hesitate to buy the M9.

It is undeniable that the M9 has many advantages and more, if only the noise of the shutter, almost like M7, but if you buy a M9 ( 5500 Euros or 8100 USD) i must sell the M8.1 (which is a good camera despite its 10MP) or keep it?

That is my question :)

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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OK it's fine to post small pics as they are easier to view on little screens but they can hardly show anything usefull if you want to compare sharpness for instance. Then you might wish to post 100% crops as well, with 240KB they can show a lot of things despite the small size of the crop. And/or you might wish to post a link to a larger file like this one on Flikr for example: http://tinyurl.com/qusf39 (4.8MB). As for raw files, converters play a big part in the final result. Which one are you using if i may ask?

Please see my answer on page 4 :

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/98684-m9-versus-m8-1-tests-4.html

Thanks for your advice.

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Guest Lotw

Guest Lotw

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I will answer now the question I asked you:

The first photo has a filter Ultra Violet / Infra Red

and the second no filter :)

I prefer the first one that is closer to what I see !

 

And I see the second being sharper

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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And I see the second being sharper

Yes, a little sharper but the colour and contrast are a little different !

Lotw, look underneath the balcony with his sculptures at the top of the photo

PS: if anyone is interested I can send you the original photo.

Send me a PM

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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OK it's fine to post small pics as they are easier to view on little screens but they can hardly show anything usefull if you want to compare sharpness for instance. Then you might wish to post 100% crops as well, with 240KB they can show a lot of things despite the small size of the crop. And/or you might wish to post a link to a larger file like this one on Flikr for example: http://tinyurl.com/qusf39 (4.8MB). As for raw files, converters play a big part in the final result. Which one are you using if i may ask?

Ict

Have you taken this port in the same place with a M8 ?

Nice place

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lct

lct

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In colour i don't see obvious differences with Leica lenses of same vintage and the same raw converter (C1 v4). The 5D has a bit less vignetting and is less noisy at 800 iso and on but it is not easy to check when using the default settings of C1. In B&W the R-D1 with Epson raw converter is superior to anything digital i know but it is totally subjective so take this with a big pinch of salt. ;)

Edit: Of course the 5D is better as far as resolution.

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kalina

kalina

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Just out of curiosity, I resampled Adan's 100% M8 crop from here (http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/1038432-post23.html), to make it the same size as the M9 crop. That's a whopping 40% increase in size.

 

For convenience of comparison, I hope Adan doesn't mind if I link directly to his images. The order is M9, M8 resampled, M8 original.

 

After resampling (nothing special - just Photoshop's usual resizing), I sharpened it as much as I dared. I had to be careful of edge artefacts (white edges around around solid areas of colour, like where the sky meets the the buildings).

 

I think the resampled M8 image holds up amazingly well (the advantages of no anti-aliasing filter): there is some loss of detail (look at the side of the yellow traffic light in shadow, and the grey transformers, and the traffic camera), and some fine details suffer from being resampled (e.g. the cable in the top right).

 

The two images differ in colour and contrast (compare sky and the sunlit side of the building; and the M9 shadows are darker), but that's there in the originals: Adan - is this a difference in lighting between your shots or a difference between the cameras and lenses, or a little of all these?

 

However, as far as detail goes, I think you'd be hard pressed to see much difference between M9 and resampled M8 prints going on this test, at least up to A3 (20 inches).

 

PS: I'm aware the images are taken with different lenses, the size difference is not solely down the different sensors. I think the M9 is an excellent camera, so this test was purely curiosity. I'm not saying resampled M8 image = M9 in any way. Taken overall, the M9 is a better camera than the M8, and I'd get one if I didn't have an M8, which meets my needs for the present.

 

PPS: I'm one of those not buying an M9 - I would if I didn't already own an M8 (I think the M9 is an excellent camera, so I'm not knocking it), but for the money, the M9 doesn't provide any major advantages over the way I use my M8.

 

I'm sorry, but I think the resampled M8 image looks very shoddy compared to the M9 image. The image quality of the green sign and the details on the side of the buildings on the M8 image just don't hold a candle to the M9 image. I do think the M8 is a great camera, especially for portraits and images you want to put on web sites, but the M9 with its superior sensor just blows it away. It would be like comparing a Nikon D3 to my D300.

 

If and when I save up $7k (sometime this year), the M9 will be on my list of cameras to get.

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Doc Henry

Doc Henry

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Kalina,

Here are 2 crops 100% of the same building (our town hall)

What is the picture that comes from the M9 :

photo No. 1 or No. 2 ?

Picture uncorrected

same lens Summicron 28mm , f:8 and 160 ISO for both cameras M9 and M8

and taken at the same moment...

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microview

microview

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Kalina,

Here are 2 crops 100% of the same building (our town hall)

What is the picture that comes from the M9 :

photo No. 1 or No. 2 ?

Picture uncorrected

same lens Summicron 28mm , f:8 and 160 ISO for both cameras M9 and M8

and taken at the same moment...

 

Photo no 1:)

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