bill Posted September 10, 2009 Share #61 Posted September 10, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I never bought an M8, for the following reasons: 1. crop factor 2. uv/ir 3. form factor I never saw it as an improvement over my film Ms. It was compromised. Flawed. I shall buy an M9, before the end of the year. I just need to liquidate the funds. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 10, 2009 Posted September 10, 2009 Hi bill, Take a look here Who hasn't bought an M9 and why?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Jeff S Posted September 10, 2009 Share #62 Posted September 10, 2009 . My M8 isn't broke and I am. That's a good line. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted September 10, 2009 Share #63 Posted September 10, 2009 TBH - I want one and I told the dealer to add me to his list yesterday, but today I'm less committed. I can't see any reason why Leica won't upgrade the M8 firmware with the improved high ISO algorithms of the M9. It would cost little to do, I presume, and it would make a lot of existing customers very happy and follow-up on the Leica perpetual upgrade promise. I have zero expectation for a hardware upgrade, so just improve via coding what we have please. The M9 images shown so far don't embarrass the M8 IMO, so given better M8 ISO performance, the main M9 difference would be working with FF lenses and better quality extra-large prints from a single frame. Valuable, but no way will it open a door to image improvement for me. I do have MF digital for the BIG shots, so that might be influencing me, especially as I might need to sacrifice it to get two M9's, or to keep the M8 and an M9. I'm not convinced that the M9 top plate changes are for the better - I like the small LCD. Using the cropped centre of the Leica lens must provide improved sharpness across the frame and reduce unwanted vignetting. So, for this afternoon at least, I remain an M8 user. Rolo--all excellent points. One thing for me... I just don't have a wide fast prime solution right now. I mean, Nikon has nothing in the 24mm range worth having except a (large) zoom. The M8 requires an 18mm lens (the 21 is a wee bit too long on the M8), which is too slow. Canon has nothing worth having in that range either for distortion though I have a manual Oly 21 f2 that, stopped down to 3.2, is truly awesome and well corrected. However, that means a Canon brick again. On the DMR I have a 19mm Elmarit. Brilliant... absolutely brilliant, even with the crop it's a 26-ish FOV. But as I get older I don't want to carry the R9/DMR, as much as adore that thing. Can you tell I was hoping for an R10? So the M9 is the only way I'm going to get a fabulous 24mm (either Elmarit or Lux, it doesn't matter) and be able to work in some of the cramped conditions I (we?) work in with anything like context. That, plus *at least* another stop on the M9 and a quieter shutter, and that's why I'm considering selling, um, something. Could be the M8, but more probably the D3 and I'll take the plunge into the Riccis zone and shoot weddings exclusively with M bodies, film and digital. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lxlim Posted September 10, 2009 Share #64 Posted September 10, 2009 My accountant said 2011. I said hokay! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted September 10, 2009 Share #65 Posted September 10, 2009 Rolo--all excellent points. One thing for me.... Could be the M8, but more probably the D3 and I'll take the plunge into the Riccis zone and shoot weddings exclusively with M bodies, film and digital. Thanks Jamie, The wide end is obviously the Achilles heel of most quality system cropped sensor cameras. I use the 16-35 on my 1D MkII N, which will remain my workhorse, at every event, for 10/15%. I really don't want a £5,000 M9 to put 900 shots a wedding on, do I ? With the M8, I have the 24mm f2.8 Elmarit which at 640 ISO is just a bit short of being an all day lens. I'm prepared to compromise a little and change style to suit what's in my hand, but know that a decent 1250 iso performance, ala M9, would me all I'd need for a top performing wide open 24 Elmarit. Our friend Brett uses the M8 + 50mm Elmar-M all day with good effect, so it must be about style at the end of the day. ? . Think I'm unlikely to have two M9's on wedding assignment at £10k + lenses, so for a while I'll manage with a mix of gear. Alternatively for an all Leica day, I'll also shoot M8/M9 plus FF wide on my film M's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trs Posted September 10, 2009 Share #66 Posted September 10, 2009 Like many, M8 has been good enough for me and will be for a while. M9 does not jump out and say "buy me now" to me. M8 did And there is the bank account factor, too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted September 10, 2009 Share #67 Posted September 10, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) The M9 adresses pretty well my constant criticisms of the M8 at first glance. The way it adjusts vignetting with uncoded lenses looks almost incredible to me. I've got very good results with raw files and default settings of my old Capture One v 4.1 converter already, which is quite reassuring from my view point. Looks like the camera is still sensible to IR from time to time though and most raws i've developped seem to have oversaturated reds. Perhaps it comes from my C1 version as it doesn't support the M9 by now, i don't know. Also i dislike the mandatory chimping to count my frames, check batteries or change iso where i can do this in a glance or a snap with my Epsons. But all in all the M9 is pretty well what i've been expecting for 4 years from Leica. Finally a true digital M! So why don't i buy it right now? For the same reason i've always preferred the M3 over my other film Ms: the VF magnification. For me the 1:1 VF of my Epsons is a must and the ability to shoot both eyes open has become more or less a necessity. I think i'll wait for a HM version if Leica plans to offer it as a new model or under the a-la-carte program accordingly. Not sure if i will resist GAS much longer though. Anyway, congrats to Leica for what appears the best DRF ever made... so far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overgaard Posted September 10, 2009 Share #68 Posted September 10, 2009 I have because I want to be part of the fun right from the beginning. This camera is the digital M I have been waiting for. I'm sure there will be others and improvements made, and even flaws found. But I want to be part of the fun of having it from the very beginning, and that alone is worth half the price paid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisatge Posted September 10, 2009 Share #69 Posted September 10, 2009 My M8 is still alive and kicking and I'm more interested in getting a 90mm Summicron APO and a 18mm Super-Elmar....and M10 will definitely be more sexy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apitong Posted September 10, 2009 Share #70 Posted September 10, 2009 Happy with my M8 & 28 & 50 - no need to upgrade. I'm just an amateur Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pointcolville Posted September 10, 2009 Share #71 Posted September 10, 2009 514 million people in North America (8% of the global population). Why? because they haven't cleared customs yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sclamb Posted September 10, 2009 Share #72 Posted September 10, 2009 I used an M9 for a couple of hours at the dealer with the latest 1.002 firmware loaded and viewed a few pics on screen rather than on the LCD. I decided for now not to go with the M9 for a few reasons: a) I like my M8.2 and it does fine for me at the moment. In fact I REALLY like my M8.2. I like my 18mm f/3.8 and there being no framelines I would need another accessory finder to go with the 24mm one that I bought for using that lens on the M8.2 (I can use the 24mm one for my 24mm f/3.8). The alternative is to spend £550 on the combined 18/24mm Leica finder, so more expense. c) the WB in mixed light was a bit wacky, even using a custom WB. I am sure this will be a firmware fix though. d) I really don't like the angles created by the flat edge now present on the left of the top plate. Not an important thing (and obviously doesn't affect the camera usage) and one I am sure I would get used to over time. e) It won't hurt to see how things pan out over the next few weeks with regards to bugs and fixes. f) I would like an M9 and may eventually get one but for now I actually managed to leave the dealer and not feel as though I wanted to go back and get the M9. I guess I may be satisfied with what I have got and that doesn't happen often to me Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asher Kelman Posted September 10, 2009 Share #73 Posted September 10, 2009 Rolo--all excellent points. One thing for me... I just don't have a wide fast prime solution right now. well how about a zoom on a Nikon or Canon DSLR? I mean, Nikon has nothing in the 24mm range worth having except a (large) zoom. The M8 requires an 18mm lens (the 21 is a wee bit too long on the M8), which is too slow. Canon has nothing worth having in that range either for distortion though I have a manual Oly 21 f2 that, stopped down to 3.2, is truly awesome and well corrected. However, that means a Canon brick again. Well the answer is simple, here, if you are indeed willing to go for a non-prime. This is the Nikon S 14-24mm f/2.8 G ED for either the Nikon or with an adapter to a FF Canon DSLR. Or, Jamie, is that the Zoom you call the "heavy Zoom" or the next one up? So the M9 is the only way I'm going to get a fabulous 24mm (either Elmarit or Lux, it doesn't matter) and be able to work in some of the cramped conditions I (we?) work in with anything like context. That, plus *at least* another stop on the M9 and a quieter shutter, and that's why I'm considering selling, um, something. Could be the M8, but more probably the D3 and I'll take the plunge into the Riccis zone and shoot weddings exclusively with M bodies, film and digital. Jamie, The reason for you to get the M9 is that it's a FF Leica dream come true, even with all its blemishes. It's the sort of camera that any fussy LF photographer or M8 pioneering color mavin like you can master with aplomb. However, it's not for the press in riots or war zones where some guard might demand the SD card and you have to fumble to remove the baseplate before palming and delivering an alternate one. It's not a camera for rough handling because the line of buttons on the left can be hit accidentally. It's not for shooting music performances with the orchestra lit from above. However for you, this will be a pleasure and why not have that joy using some of the very best lenses on earth. That's how I see it. It's not about pixels and noise in the shadows under poor lighting conditions at high ISO, non of that. This is something experiential like appreciating poetry, fine art of the 15th century, special wines, great music and high cuisine. Of course one can replace all these with rap, snapshots, $4 Gallo wine, rap again and McDonalds, and still enjoy life. However, the finer can be savored longer. Asher Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankA Posted September 11, 2009 Share #74 Posted September 11, 2009 I have not purchased yet because I am $6,950 short. Finding pennies on the ground every day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted September 11, 2009 Share #75 Posted September 11, 2009 I just disqualified myself from further posting in this thread! My dealer rang and said He had ONE M9! I had only casually remarked to him a week a go that I would be interested in the M9. He offered it to me! I know a number of other photogs slathering over it so I have no idea why he offered to me. I collect it in the morning. So much for sitting back and considering. I only live once and I'm not sure for how long now, so...............M9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noah_addis Posted September 11, 2009 Share #76 Posted September 11, 2009 ...However, it's not for the press in riots or war zones where some guard might demand the SD card and you have to fumble to remove the baseplate before palming and delivering an alternate one. Asher Actually the time you spend fiddling with the baseplate gives you a better chance at palming and switching cards. Don't ask me how I know this... I shoot everything from wars to weddings, and I plan to do it all with the M9, just as I have been doing with my trusty M8s. The M8 wasn't perfect for weddings or other low-light situations, but it is workable. And, unlike some photographers, I have trouble shooting with more than one system at a time. I admire people who can do it, but I really do best with one system...maybe two cameras and two or three lenses. Too much gear distracts me. So the M9, with it's full-frame sensor and improved low-light performance, is a big improvement. Having said all this, many people here have good reasons to keep their M8 and not switch to the M9. The M8 is still a great camera and can still take amazing photographs. And I'm not just saying this to boost sales, my M8's are both sold already:D Though I didn't think I'd sell them so fast, now I REALLY need those M9s:confused: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted September 11, 2009 Share #77 Posted September 11, 2009 I can confirm the easability of 'palming' an SD card from the bottom of a M8! Three weeks ago I got sprung shooting a live show from the audience. Stupidly, I did not switch off the LCD screen and the 'glow' lit my face in the auditorium and the usher saw me. At the end of the show I was asked to delete the card. Quickly I feigned 'stupidity' (not hard for me), slapped my head and said; "damn, I forgot to put the card in! Here have a look for yourself." I took the baseplate off and flicked the card into the palm of my hand, covering it with the plate, then handed the camera over. There is a bit more fun to the story but the point is I kept my card, intact, and got some nice pics. It all comes down to being familiar with handling your gear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted September 11, 2009 Share #78 Posted September 11, 2009 As I've already mentioned, I'm too cheap to buy an M9. However, I might consider buying one of your dust gathering Epson R-D1s which occupy the cupboard space now needed for a not so frequently used M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted September 11, 2009 Share #79 Posted September 11, 2009 {snipped}Of course one can replace all these with rap, snapshots, $4 Gallo wine, rap again and McDonalds, and still enjoy life. However, the finer can be savored longer. Asher Hi Asher--nice to hear from you! Well, you're right about the zooms, if I wanted to use them. Nikon's in particular are outstanding. I've never ever warmed to Canon's ultra wides. But they're just too freaking big for my rapidly aging back. When I used a 24-70 or any of the ultra wides I was always in despair about how big there were and how difficult it really is to carry more than one around at any time. It's a lot better, of course, with a dSLR / M combo. But still not optimal I also just don't like zooms. Sounds dumb, but I don't "see" as well with them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lotw Posted September 11, 2009 Share #80 Posted September 11, 2009 Like many, M8 has been good enough for me and will be for a while. M9 does not jump out and say "buy me now" to me. M8 did And there is the bank account factor, too. Can't imagine how/why an M9 can or should be better than this (M8 with Voigtlånder 15mm), foooor instance Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/96093-who-hasnt-bought-an-m9-and-why/?do=findComment&comment=1030222'>More sharing options...
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