vanhulsenbeek #81 Posted May 20, 2008 The British know that a large number of Nederlanders speak fluent French, German and English, and we are very jealous! Hmm...fluent French? That stretches your admiration a little too far IMHO. Most school children nowadays - is my impression - keep far away from anything difficult and taking too much of their precious time! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaapv #82 Posted May 20, 2008 however, in the houses of ill repute it was a language of business. Having no experience there myself, could you please post some pictures? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bill #83 Posted May 20, 2008 Some of these responses are a riot. Bill for your first reference you cite a Wickepedia article that fails to cite any references and is applicable to UK jurisdictions by its own statement. Please. For the second you rely on the Wickepdia and cases from the 1700s. I hope you use these kinds of argument in court if you ever go against me as you will make me very wealthy indeed and then I can buy the M9. Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Bless. John, I have wine in my cellar older than the US legal system. In the free world an 18th century legal precedent is still valid, especially in Tort. I wouldn't dream to impose my view of the US legal system, gained from watching old reruns of LA Law, Perry Mason and The Dukes of Hazzard, upon you. Perhaps you could accept in turn that you represent a minority here and sweeping generalisations of this sort really don't get you very far. Regards, Bill Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vanhulsenbeek #84 Posted May 20, 2008 Perhaps you could accept in turn that you represent a minority here and sweeping generalisations of this sort really don't get you very far. In short: can we agree that the US legal system does not rule the world? That would mean a tremendous relief to me! Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaapv #85 Posted May 20, 2008 Your relief is slightly misplaced:p Actually, there was an act of Congress a few years ago empowering the US miltary to free any USA serviceman by force that might appear before the International Court for war crimes in the Haque. Can you just see it? American marines storming the beach in Scheveningen between the sun umbrellas and herring stalls? Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SJP #86 Posted May 20, 2008 American marines storming the beach in Scheveningen between the sun umbrellas and herring stalls? That I look foreward to & will take a picture as I live in The Hague (Den Haag for local scum, 's-Gravenhage for the posh - I am the former). Presumably they will drive their tanks past my house or I might take the tram to Scheveningen if it is a nice day. This is worth doing even if the Americans do not land - preferably outside the main holiday season unless you like crowds. Note: the only reason the USA speaks (mainly) (sort of) English is due to their former status of being part of the British Empire. To quote GB Shaw about USA and the UK " two great nations divided by a common language'. This is also credited to Winston Churchill and Mark Twain, if I believe Google it was Churchill with 54 hits (Shaw 20, Twain 3). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaapv #87 Posted May 20, 2008 I went to Florida last year and English did not get me very far. Spanish would have been more handy Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vanhulsenbeek #88 Posted May 20, 2008 Your relief is slightly misplaced:p Actually, there was an act of Congress a few years ago empowering the US miltary to free any USA serviceman by force that might appear before the International Court for war crimes in the Haque. Can you just see it? American marines storming the beach in Scheveningen between the sun umbrellas and herring stalls? Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Yes: "Send the Marines! John Wayne and Randolph Scott; remember those exiting fighting scenes?" (Tom Lehrer, in the 60-ties) But when they clean that beach and everything on the Boulevard (leave the Kurhaus standing) I would not really object. Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
woodyspedden #89 Posted May 23, 2008 It was confirmed as a rumour yes. The only way you'll ever regret buying the 24mm Elmarit is if you're an idiot. Trust me, it's spectacular. Daniel I am so confident in your choice of this lens that I will buy it back less 15% for restocking. You will never be disappointed with this product. That is not to say that there will never be a better lens. (Although Erwin Puts puts it in the highest echelon of performance). So somewhere down the road there will be improvements......if not then Leica, like others, will have missed the boat. Let's wait and see. In the meantime if the lens is still in the like new in box category I will buy it back in a heartback. I was not convinced that I should have sold it in the first place. Best Woody Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Ortego #90 Posted May 23, 2008 Daniel I am so confident in your choice of this lens that I will buy it back less 15% for restocking. You will never be disappointed with this product. That is not to say that there will never be a better lens. (Although Erwin Puts puts it in the highest echelon of performance). So somewhere down the road there will be improvements......if not then Leica, like others, will have missed the boat. Let's wait and see. In the meantime if the lens is still in the like new in box category I will buy it back in a heartback. I was not convinced that I should have sold it in the first place. Best Woody Oh no, I do miss the 28-cron I sold, although the silver 24-Elmarit is a solid keeper' in my Leica set!!! Thanks anyway. ~ Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chris_livsey #91 Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name=charlesphoto99;563939. Otherwise' date=' a film camera 50 years old can shoot the same film as a film camera 5 days old. per (imo).[/quote] A Leica certainly but pity the owners of cameras taking: 35, 101,102.103,104,105,110,up to 119 Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. then 121 on to 126, 127, up to 130, 616, 620, 828 formats and sadly yes I can quote dates of discontinuation Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. Moral: Choose carefully which 50 year old camera you buy, then remember 110 cameras how many of those were sold ? At least, given good storage the negatives of all these formats still exist. I wonder how many failed storage systems for our 1s & 0s will make the list in another 50 years ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlanG #92 Posted May 31, 2008 ...Your interpretation of "staying current with technology" is so vague that your claim or a lawsuit based on this would hold no water - again, definitely not in the EU, but then again nobody in their mind would grant anything to anybody who got burned by hot coffee over here, and we wouldn't see warnings such as "Caution: the content is hot" on a coffee cup, which honestly makes me think all the time I am in the US that something is very wrong with your legal system there. A judge here would laugh at such a lawsuit where I come from - infact, they might grant something in the opposite case, if the coffe would be cold Hello guest! Please register or sign in to view the hidden content. I don't know where you live. Let's at least hope your judge won't laugh at such a case. Although it seems a similar case in the UK failed. The McDonalds hot coffee case is not as far out as you think. The woman was hospitalized for 7-8 days. "the judge called McDonalds' conduct reckless, callous and willful". I found it interesting to read the facts about it. The Actual Facts about the Mcdonalds' Coffee Case http://www.vanosteen.com/mcdonalds-coffee-lawsuit.htm As for the "Future Proof" statement. It must mean something. What is it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marknorton #93 Posted May 31, 2008 Ultimately, Leica are on safe legal ground here. They are making no claims as to the cost of the upgrades and if they found themselves painted into a corner, they could just offer to upgrade an M8 to an M9 by transferring the red dot from your M8 to a new M9. Cost?, Let me think, $0.01 less than buying a new M9? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rwfreund #94 Posted May 31, 2008 That is what in the mainframe business we used to call a forklift upgrade. The only part that was carried over to the new box was the serial number plate. -bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fotografr #95 Posted May 31, 2008 I wonder how many failed storage systems for our 1s & 0s will make the list in another 50 years ? I can tell you with certainty it won't make a bit of difference to me, unless I happen to still be shooting at the age of 113. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chris_livsey #96 Posted May 31, 2008 I can tell you with certainty it won't make a bit of difference to me, unless I happen to still be shooting at the age of 113. I would like to think that some of my work, like that I cherish from both my fathers and grandfathers photographic endeavors, will survive me. So, no, I agree it won't make a difference to me personally in that time frame but I would like to feel more secure in the future of my storage systems now so that my heirs and successors won't be cursing me for not leaving some of my work in a future proof format, whatever that may be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Black #97 Posted June 2, 2008 Has Leica said when the new M8's will come with the new shutter and LCD glass? Surely, they don't expect us to buy a brand new one and send if off Solms... or do they...?... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marknorton #98 Posted June 2, 2008 John, crazy as it may sound, there's been no information from them on when, or even if, modified cameras will be available from the factory to order. It's clearly much less expensive to install the alternative parts than it is to upgrade - no shipping, no wasted parts, no duplicated warranties, no additional labour. In theory, the extra cost would be just for any additional parts cost. The whole thing has been ill-thought out and that grinding noise you can hear is the Leica Bicycle being furiously back-pedalled... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Black #99 Posted June 4, 2008 Thank you for the reply. My concern was buying a used M8 for around $3800 USD only to see new ones selling for ~$5000 with the upgraded components. At that point it would have cheaper (and arguably smarter) to buy new. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fotografr #100 Posted June 4, 2008 I would like to think that some of my work, like that I cherish from both my fathers and grandfathers photographic endeavors, will survive me. So, no, I agree it won't make a difference to me personally in that time frame but I would like to feel more secure in the future of my storage systems now so that my heirs and successors won't be cursing me for not leaving some of my work in a future proof format, whatever that may be. Didn't mean to be taken seriously, Chris. I was just being my usual smartass self. IMHO, the best way to assure your favorite work survives is to print it on media with a good archival rating and properly store it. I have little faith in the longevity of the 1s and 0s. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
