Panasonic S1 II and S1 IIE

[helged]

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16 hours ago, rim_light said:

The S1RII is the camera I expected to be the SL3. 

Out of curiosity: In which way? 

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[BernardC]

Maybe it's because it offers every feature that one could possibly imagine?

People often assume that camera specifications should be proportional to a camera's price (more expensive = more features), but that is rarely the case. You almost always get more features in the mid-range; entry-level cameras are stripped-down (to encourage you up the range), and high-end cameras omit all the "helper" features that their users have outgrown.

It's not just cameras, of course. Furniture, stereos, musical instruments, appliances, etc.: you pay a premium for simplicity.

 

[balzani_shots]

3 hours ago, BernardC said:

Maybe it's because it offers every feature that one could possibly imagine?

People often assume that camera specifications should be proportional to a camera's price (more expensive = more features), but that is rarely the case. You almost always get more features in the mid-range; entry-level cameras are stripped-down (to encourage you up the range), and high-end cameras omit all the "helper" features that their users have outgrown.

It's not just cameras, of course. Furniture, stereos, musical instruments, appliances, etc.: you pay a premium for simplicity.

 

This is a good point, that`s one of the reasons why I haven`t decided between the S1R II or one of the S5 IIs. I never shoot video, am looking for a camera with EFCS and better auto focus than the SL2, any feedback will be appreciated.

[rim_light]

10 hours ago, helged said:

Out of curiosity: In which way? 

AF speed, speed of data processing,...

[Photoworks]

I had the S1RII for a week and SL3 for 1 year.

Panasonic S1RII:

PRO:

Great sensor, good colors
light
AF in stills and video
TTL flash
Good Video option
HIGH RES capture
Rotating the screen in any position
USB-C iPhone connection for an external monitor
Atomos on-screen controls over USB
Open Gate
EVF
IBIS
DUAL CARDS
Weather sealed
Auto upload images
LUT support
great APPs
Good Buffer
tether

 

CONS:

Feels like a toy camera
too small in hand
LCD small
On-screen text in many places to small to read
The menu gets lost every time
Learning a specific function is just as complicated as the Sony
battery life
Battery grip or external power for USB recording
Every time the camera wakes up, it asks what M lens is mounted
DR is better in the shadows, highlights can clip easily.
No timecode for video
 

I still have to test and compare different lenses, L and M mount, to see the differences.

Leica SL3

Pros:
Good Looking
Good Build Quality
60MP sensor, great image quality
high DR
PDAF in AFC
great EVF
Large LCD
Dual Card
Menu design is very good, but needs improvements, and is still faster on SL2
Flip LCD
Heavy
tether
Better support for M-lenses

 

Cons:
price
Flash system is terrible and often stops working with SF-60
Flash SF-60 is old
TTL not great
Paint chips too fast
Battery Prices
Touch menu to the side is stupid and slow
AFs are mostly contrast-based
Most video options are with a crop
No open gate
No great audio input
Buffer Slow, or data to card slow, even to CF Express

 

[oculaii]

On 4/19/2025 at 5:03 AM, Photoworks said:

I had the S1RII for a week and SL3 for 1 year.

Panasonic S1RII:

PRO:

Great sensor, good colors
light
AF in stills and video
TTL flash
Good Video option
HIGH RES capture
Rotating the screen in any position
USB-C iPhone connection for an external monitor
Atomos on-screen controls over USB
Open Gate
EVF
IBIS
DUAL CARDS
Weather sealed
Auto upload images
LUT support
great APPs
Good Buffer
tether

 

CONS:

Feels like a toy camera
too small in hand
LCD small
On-screen text in many places to small to read
The menu gets lost every time
Learning a specific function is just as complicated as the Sony
battery life
Battery grip or external power for USB recording
Every time the camera wakes up, it asks what M lens is mounted
DR is better in the shadows, highlights can clip easily.
No timecode for video
 

I still have to test and compare different lenses, L and M mount, to see the differences.

Leica SL3

Pros:
Good Looking
Good Build Quality
60MP sensor, great image quality
high DR
PDAF in AFC
great EVF
Large LCD
Dual Card
Menu design is very good, but needs improvements, and is still faster on SL2
Flip LCD
Heavy
tether
Better support for M-lenses

 

Cons:
price
Flash system is terrible and often stops working with SF-60
Flash SF-60 is old
TTL not great
Paint chips too fast
Battery Prices
Touch menu to the side is stupid and slow
AFs are mostly contrast-based
Most video options are with a crop
No open gate
No great audio input
Buffer Slow, or data to card slow, even to CF Express

 

I agree about the highlights, they clip much easier than the S5II or S1.

[Cronilux]

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Am 18.4.2025 um 14:38 schrieb BernardC:

Maybe it's because it offers every feature that one could possibly imagine?

People often assume that camera specifications should be proportional to a camera's price (more expensive = more features), but that is rarely the case. You almost always get more features in the mid-range; entry-level cameras are stripped-down (to encourage you up the range), and high-end cameras omit all the "helper" features that their users have outgrown.

It's not just cameras, of course. Furniture, stereos, musical instruments, appliances, etc.: you pay a premium for simplicity.

 

That’s nonsense. There are so many high end products out there, that have the latest and best features, but their USP is often the build quality, implementation of said features, UI Design, longer testing and development, which ensures stability and usability and lastly better customer services. All that obviously generates more costs to produce these products and then results in higher costs. 

What you described is often the road Leica is going. Which is mostly caused by less resources for development and not solely for simplicity reasons. Leica is amazing at reducing all the fuss, but that doesn’t need to equal to not catch up to the recent technology the competitors are using. 

 

[Cronilux]

Am 19.4.2025 um 05:03 schrieb Photoworks:

Every time the camera wakes up, it asks what M lens is mounted

You can turn that off. 

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I got the S1Rii for the EFCS. That’s all.

I don’t mind the smaller size. But it’s not as good with larger standard zooms. The SIgma DGDN primes are great on it.

The menus suck but I know them as I have other Lumix cameras.

IQ is excellent. Same for rear screen.

Really it feels like any of my Sony’s and Canons. I vastly prefer the SL3 for everything else except the EFCS.

Gordon

 

[chrismuc]

On 4/19/2025 at 11:03 AM, Photoworks said:

I had the S1RII for a week and SL3 for 1 year.

Panasonic S1RII:

PRO:

Great sensor, good colors
light
AF in stills and video
TTL flash
Good Video option
HIGH RES capture
Rotating the screen in any position
USB-C iPhone connection for an external monitor
Atomos on-screen controls over USB
Open Gate
EVF
IBIS
DUAL CARDS
Weather sealed
Auto upload images
LUT support
great APPs
Good Buffer
tether

 

CONS:

Feels like a toy camera
too small in hand
LCD small
On-screen text in many places to small to read
The menu gets lost every time
Learning a specific function is just as complicated as the Sony
battery life
Battery grip or external power for USB recording
Every time the camera wakes up, it asks what M lens is mounted
DR is better in the shadows, highlights can clip easily.
No timecode for video
 

I still have to test and compare different lenses, L and M mount, to see the differences.

Leica SL3

Pros:
Good Looking
Good Build Quality
60MP sensor, great image quality
high DR
PDAF in AFC
great EVF
Large LCD
Dual Card
Menu design is very good, but needs improvements, and is still faster on SL2
Flip LCD
Heavy
tether
Better support for M-lenses

 

Cons:
price
Flash system is terrible and often stops working with SF-60
Flash SF-60 is old
TTL not great
Paint chips too fast
Battery Prices
Touch menu to the side is stupid and slow
AFs are mostly contrast-based
Most video options are with a crop
No open gate
No great audio input
Buffer Slow, or data to card slow, even to CF Express

 

If used with CAF and face/eye detect for street photography with fast Leica or Panasonic or Sigma L-Mount lenses or Canon/Sigma EF lenses with MC-21 (at open aperture), and eventually at 5 fps, which of the two cameras achieves more images in focus and which achieves more reliable sharpness? 
Would be great if you could share some experience for that use case. Thx. 

[chrismuc]

On 4/27/2025 at 12:45 PM, chrismuc said:

If used with CAF and face/eye detect for street photography with fast Leica or Panasonic or Sigma L-Mount lenses or Canon/Sigma EF lenses with MC-21 (at open aperture), and eventually at 5 fps, which of the two cameras achieves more images in focus and which achieves more reliable sharpness? 
Would be great if you could share some experience for that use case. Thx. 

Gorden, I think you also own these two cameras SL3 and S1RII. Can you eventually share some experience of the CAF PDAF performance, compared each other?

[rim_light]

12 hours ago, chrismuc said:

Gorden, I think you also own these two cameras SL3 and S1RII. Can you eventually share some experience of the CAF PDAF performance, compared each other?

I have both cameras, too. And I'm shooting sports in the German soccer Bundesliga: the S1RII focuses faster when using AFC than the SL3. Plus, when shooting in high frame rates (where the S1RII is significantly faster), the SL3's viewfinder lacks performance. You cannot follow the action anymore because of the SL3's slow readout time. 

The attached picture shows the S1RII with Sigma 500/5.6 in action. It's not an outstanding photo, but a camera has to be able to capture a player in a full sprint in harsh backlighting, which the S1RII does.

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[Photoworks]

On 4/27/2025 at 12:45 AM, chrismuc said:

If used with CAF and face/eye detect for street photography with fast Leica or Panasonic or Sigma L-Mount lenses or Canon/Sigma EF lenses with MC-21 (at open aperture), and eventually at 5 fps, which of the two cameras achieves more images in focus and which achieves more reliable sharpness? 
Would be great if you could share some experience for that use case. Thx. 

THAT IS INTENSIVE TESTING. It may have to wait. 

For now, I feel the buffer clearing faster on the Panasonic.

[Photoworks]

Today I have tested a few M lenses on the M11, S1RII, and SL3

As expected, there is some smearing on the S1RII.

the 6bit coding does not do much on PANA, no lens correction can be applied in camera. Something that the M11 and SL3 do well for the 21 SEM, something that can be adjusted so easily in post.

[chrismuc]

8 hours ago, rim_light said:

I have both cameras, too. And I'm shooting sports in the German soccer Bundesliga: the S1RII focuses faster when using AFC than the SL3. Plus, when shooting in high frame rates (where the S1RII is significantly faster), the SL3's viewfinder lacks performance. You cannot follow the action anymore because of the SL3's slow readout time. 

The attached picture shows the S1RII with Sigma 500/5.6 in action. It's not an outstanding photo, but a camera has to be able to capture a player in a full sprint in harsh backlighting, which the S1RII does.

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Great to hear. I have the S1R and intend to upgrade to a high resolution PDAF L-mount camera with 'good' CAF performance, main for street photography and similar (not so demanding) applications, so eventually the S1RII would be the best choice. For sport I still have my 'young vintage' Canon 1DX, but I will compare the two cameras in the future. If the S1RII does perform there well too, even better.

I have the impression, that the S1RII technology-wise is in most areas on-par or better than the SL3 and the SL3s, in combined photography and video features. In other words, a potential SL3 with the S1RII sensor and equivalent features could have combined the current SL3 and SL3s into one camera, which IMO would have made more sense for Leica. 

[chrismuc]

4 hours ago, Photoworks said:

THAT IS INTENSIVE TESTING. It may have to wait. 

For now, I feel the buffer clearing faster on the Panasonic.

interesting and good to hear

at my quick S1RII test in a Chinese Panasonic store the buffer clearance with the SD card I provided was actually ... strangely ... very slow, slower than using the same card in my S1R

maybe a card type issue, or FW in the camera

[chrismuc]

last weekend I used the Sigma EF 135f1.8 Art with the MC-21 on my S1R 

I love the lens sharpness and rendering at open aperture 

just would wish that CAF would work ... which will be the case on the S1RII  🙂

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[helged]

On 4/28/2025 at 10:22 PM, rim_light said:

I have both cameras, too. And I'm shooting sports in the German soccer Bundesliga: the S1RII focuses faster when using AFC than the SL3. Plus, when shooting in high frame rates (where the S1RII is significantly faster), the SL3's viewfinder lacks performance. You cannot follow the action anymore because of the SL3's slow readout time. 

The attached picture shows the S1RII with Sigma 500/5.6 in action. It's not an outstanding photo, but a camera has to be able to capture a player in a full sprint in harsh backlighting, which the S1RII does.

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Now, that is a fine and encouraging shot! And the ball remains round. As it should... So I assume you use  mechanical shutter with electronic first curtain? (to avoid deformation of fast-moving subjects).

Out of curiosity: For AF I guess the use of body recognition. Do you alter the default AF parameter settings?

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[rim_light]

On 4/30/2025 at 6:31 AM, helged said:

Now, that is a fine and encouraging shot! And the ball remains round. As it should... So I assume you use  mechanical shutter with electronic first curtain? (to avoid deformation of fast-moving subjects).

Out of curiosity: For AF I guess the use of body recognition. Do you alter the default AF parameter settings?

Thank you for your kind words regarding my shot. Yes, I use the mechanical shutter because there is no advantage in using the electronic shutter other than getting 40 frames a second, which leads to more pics I won't use

And yes, I use body recognition with the AF. I used setting three without alternating the settings.

[jaapv]

Very interesting cameras, even open gate 5.1K 

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/panasonic-announces-two-new-full-frame-mirrorless-cameras--lumix-s1ii-and-lumix-s1iie--and-new-lumix-s-24-60mm-f2-8-lens-302454196.html