Thinking of switching M11-P for Q3 43

[DG_MP]

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I appreciate Test Drives are available and I will be enquiring however there is a long wait for one with no date in the near future available. 
 

Has anybody made the switch from M11-P to Q3 43 or considering it?

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[Smogg]

9 minutes ago, DG_MP said:

I appreciate Test Drives are available and I will be enquiring however there is a long wait for one with no date in the near future available. 
 

Has anybody made the switch from M11-P to Q3 43 or considering it?

I tried, I didn't succeed. The rangefinder is unique.

[anonymoose]

Why do you want to switch exactly? I own an M11 (w/ 35mm Lux) and a Q2 (had Q3 previously, sold it to go back to Q2), so I can share reasons why I won't be getting rid of my M11 and relying solely on the Q2 even though they produce remarkably similar images:

1. I really like the rangefinder experience. It's definitely challenging, but it makes the entire process of photography more enjoyable for me.

2. More compact setup. The Q2 is a touch lighter, but the lens is significantly larger and therefore the whole package is quite a bit bigger.

3. Q3 AF is pretty good (not Sony good), but unless I'm trying to get tack-sharp eye focus at f1.4-f2 on a moving child I can actually focus and capture quicker on the M11. With the Q3 I have to poke at the screen at least once where I want to focus, possibly click a bunch of buttons to get out of AF-C and into AF-S, frame the scene, then capture it. Then next time I'm trying to capture a picture of my toddler while she's moving I try to take the picture, it's in the wrong mode, I try to quickly get it back into AF-C face tracking mode, and completely miss the moment. With the M11 I set my focus quickly, reframe, and capture.

I've tried to make EVF focusing on the Q2 a habit, but the experience is simply subpar compared to the M11. Focusing, even with aids, feels more prone to errors with the Q2 than RF focus with the M11. Not to mention how artificial it feels when you're used to seeing the real world through the RF.

Edited April 18 by anonymoose

[DG_MP]

15 minutes ago, anonymoose said:

Why do you want to switch exactly? I own an M11 (w/ 35mm Lux) and a Q2 (had Q3 previously, sold it to go back to Q2), so I can share reasons why I won't be getting rid of my M11 and relying solely on the Q2 even though they produce remarkably similar images:

1. I really like the rangefinder experience. It's definitely challenging, but it makes the entire process of photography more enjoyable for me.

2. More compact setup. The Q2 is a touch lighter, but the lens is significantly larger and therefore the whole package is quite a bit bigger.

3. Q3 AF is pretty good (not Sony good), but unless I'm trying to get tack-sharp eye focus at f1.4-f2 on a moving child I can actually focus and capture quicker on the M11. With the Q3 I have to poke at the screen at least once where I want to focus, possibly click a bunch of buttons to get out of AF-C and into AF-S, frame the scene, then capture it. Then next time I'm trying to capture a picture of my toddler while she's moving I try to take the picture, it's in the wrong mode, I try to quickly get it back into AF-C face tracking mode, and completely miss the moment. With the M11 I set my focus quickly, reframe, and capture.

I've tried to make EVF focusing on the Q2 a habit, but the experience is simply subpar compared to the M11. Focusing, even with aids, feels more prone to errors with the Q2 than RF focus with the M11. Not to mention how artificial it feels when you're used to seeing the real world through the RF.

Thank you for this detailed response! And I completely agree with your first point, one of the reasons I am hesitating with swapping what with the feeling and satisfaction that comes with creating a photograph using a RF

Edited April 18 by DG_MP

[anonymoose]

2 minutes ago, DG_MP said:

Thank you for this detailed response! And I completely agree with your first point, one of the reasons I am hesitating with swapping what with the feeling and satisfaction that comes with creating a photograph using a RF

If you enjoy the feeling/satisfaction of the RF, you will absolutely miss it and have regrets going to the Q3. The Q cameras are amazing (there's a reason I still have one even though I use it much less), but it's a much more detached photographic experience.

You can always rent a Q2 or the standard Q3 to get a feel for the experience vs. M11. The 43mm focal length won't change the experience anything more than marginally.

[Smogg]

30 minutes ago, anonymoose said:

Why do you want to switch exactly? I own an M11 (w/ 35mm Lux) and a Q2 (had Q3 previously, sold it to go back to Q2), so I can share reasons why I won't be getting rid of my M11 and relying solely on the Q2 even though they produce remarkably similar images:

1. I really like the rangefinder experience. It's definitely challenging, but it makes the entire process of photography more enjoyable for me.

2. More compact setup. The Q2 is a touch lighter, but the lens is significantly larger and therefore the whole package is quite a bit bigger.

3. Q3 AF is pretty good (not Sony good), but unless I'm trying to get tack-sharp eye focus at f1.4-f2 on a moving child I can actually focus and capture quicker on the M11. With the Q3 I have to poke at the screen at least once where I want to focus, possibly click a bunch of buttons to get out of AF-C and into AF-S, frame the scene, then capture it. Then next time I'm trying to capture a picture of my toddler while she's moving I try to take the picture, it's in the wrong mode, I try to quickly get it back into AF-C face tracking mode, and completely miss the moment. With the M11 I set my focus quickly, reframe, and capture.

I've tried to make EVF focusing on the Q2 a habit, but the experience is simply subpar compared to the M11. Focusing, even with aids, feels more prone to errors with the Q2 than RF focus with the M11. Not to mention how artificial it feels when you're used to seeing the real world through the RF.

Exactly how I feel. I couldn't describe it better.

[Smogg]

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I also added that the M11 with its generous battery does not need to be turned off at all and is ready to work instantly!

[Olaf_ZG]

Both cameras have their pros and cons. To me, they are a great match together. What I appreciate of the Q is it being weather proof and ability for one hand operation. 

[costa43]

I went the other way. I lasted 3 months with a Q3 and moved on. It’s a great camera but I much prefer the M experience to an EVF based camera, and the ability to use vintage lenses and experiment are a large part of the joy I get from this hobby. I also really enjoy how fluid it is to shoot film and digital with the same mount.

I also found that the sensor on the Q was a bit lacklustre when lifting shadows at slightly higher ISOs. The colour noise came too quick for my liking, the M11 is stronger here. A small thing for some but Iit bothered me enough to mention it.  I did like the weather sealing aspect a lot though and was tempted to keep it just for this but in the end, the 4.5k went towards another M. 

My suggestion would be to buy one without selling the M if you can and just try it out for a couple of months. See how you go. Otherwise that itch may just linger around..

Edited April 18 by costa43

[setuporg]

I got rid of the M11-P/D and then have obtained Q3 43.  However I have all the previous digital M rangefinder pairs (M9P/M, M240/246, M10R/M), and Q2.  But I posit Q3 43 is more suitable for the new sensor, as it's an all electronic camera, and has PDAF too.  It's the best point and shoot also, as @Smogg properly calls it, so if you love rangefinders, I would not replace one by a Q.  But if you have other Ms besides M11-P then I would do it, since the Q3 43 comes late in the cycle while M12 will come sooner.  And as far as Qs go, Q3 43 is the best if you prefer 35-50mm focal length to the iPhone's default 28mm.

[Elliot Harper]

I have m10-r, m11, Q3/43, and something else...

That tells you something, I don't replace one with another.

[jakontil]

You will come back with the M.. so dont get rid of the M 

[Tseg]

I have the M11-D and Q3 43… starting with the Q3 43.  As stated countless times, both are very different experiences, with the Q series closer to an Asian camera experience… yet different enough that it piqued my interest as to what could be, which is what the M is.   I carry my Q when I want to be more brainless about capturing images and just want to be in whatever activity in which I am participating.

[JNK100]

I think you would end up re-buying an M11 as I did. It will only be a matter of time. Inevitably you will end up with both I am afraid 😉

[Gavin G]

They are backup each other, suggest not to replace.

[Velo-city]

Contrary to many opinions here, neither are perfect.

And while there is no competition to a digital M (simply because no other brand currently makes one), there are plenty of similar alternatives to a Q.
Unless there’s something you absolutely love about the brand, you could get a similar spec to the q3 and pocket half its price tag for travel or whatever. 
Not saying it’s a bad camera, but it has its downsides - it’s overpriced, it’s not that compact or light, it’s unergonomic, and it has quirks - seemingly the only things that come free with Leica digital. It takes a decent picture (better than the M11 imo) but so do plenty of other cameras out there for much less money. 
I definitely wouldn’t buy before trying.

[PhotoCruiser]

I have from 2019 on a Q2 and love her including her ergonomics, however this February i bought a mint SL2 and 3 Sigma lenses to have a long macro and a 14mm WA lens what i missed on the Q2.
The Q series push you to live with the focal length you have and that bothers some, others like me it does not, however you can crop the 28/43mm photos surprisingly well but obviously not make them wider.
As long you use one small lens on the M11-P then she will make a good all day, low weight and bulk travel camera, but if you start to buy more lenses then things change and you will haul around a bulky and heavy camera bag.

As i always recommend, make a plan what to photograph and rent the Q2/Q3 for a weekend or more to verify if you like her, the photos, ergonomics, UI, etc
You may look around for a slightly used Q2 instead of the very expensive Q3 with arguable useful and better changes over the Q2.

Chris

 

[mekener]

    The day I got my 28 elmarit asph, I knew the q2 was going to be up for sale. I have an inclination towards the 50mm so the q2 was not cutting it for me. I tried to reason with myself for keeping the q2 for several months; wet weather, stabilization, stay in the work bag camera for everyday use etc... It did't work. I think it's all about the focal length. I feel comfortable with a 50mm and a 28mm in the bag and add a 21mm for comfort(luxury, not necessity). If you think the 43mm does it for you, go for it. If you think you would like to go wider on occasion I don't think its worth the investment once the GAS fades away.

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[JimmyCheng]

you can always add the q3 first and then decide whethe you wish to sell your M down the road. q3 is a great addition, now that I have a baby. I never use it before, M is just much more fun and unique. Q3 shooting exp can be completely replaced by something like a Sony a7cr with a small lens. Actually, that might be a better route since you get to change lenses.

[setuporg]

A Q with the 28mm is like an iPhone.  You'll always document life and fit in a scene, and it will be all in focus and quite boring most of the time.  The Q3 43 takes a lot of photos wide open that are artistic looking out of the box.  So I'd say go for it.