Developer shelf life

[leica dream]

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Having returned to film in recent months I have been using labs for processing my FP4 rolls. Many years ago back in the 1960's I had my own fully equipped darkroom and was a prolific shooter. Nowadays much less sol and maybe shoot perhaps 3 or 4 rolls per year. Even so, straight develop and postage ( not scanned) via lab is about £10/11 per roll so I have been considering home processing again - presumably Ilfotec DD-X. However, with such low activity I wonder whether the shelf life once opened could mean that, in my circumstances, home precessing might turn out to be counter cost effective against Labs. It looks like Ilfoterc concentrate lasts 4 months once openned.

Any views?

[david strachan]

One can get concertina bottles to exclude air.  In old days some would make up lost volume in ordinary bottles, with marbles.

...

[Pieter12]

I use Rodinal. It lasts forever.

[Einst_Stein]

3 hours ago, leica dream said:

Having returned to film in recent months I have been using labs for processing my FP4 rolls. Many years ago back in the 1960's I had my own fully equipped darkroom and was a prolific shooter. Nowadays much less sol and maybe shoot perhaps 3 or 4 rolls per year. Even so, straight develop and postage ( not scanned) via lab is about £10/11 per roll so I have been considering home processing again - presumably Ilfotec DD-X. However, with such low activity I wonder whether the shelf life once opened could mean that, in my circumstances, home precessing might turn out to be counter cost effective against Labs. It looks like Ilfoterc concentrate lasts 4 months once openned.

Any views?

I guess your choices would be:

1: use longer shelf life chemistry, such as Rodin SL, HC110, etc. These two are cheap enough and last very long. 
2: use small quantity per package. I found Adox XT3 1L package works fine (~usd 7)

3: shoot more. 

I am reluctant to lab develop. There is noth8ng wrong, but I just prefer to develop myself. Hey, that is the major part of the fun!

[250swb]

DD-X doesn't have a very long shelf live after it's opened, but then again at 1+4 dilution it doesn't take long to get through a one litre bottle. Rodinal lasts forever but it's a bit grainy if you are shooting with FP4, and HC110 is best kept for medium format negatives because it's not the sharpest of developers although it's tonal qualities are excellent. Out of those my preference would be DD-X, but I'd add one to the list with Adox FX39 II. This can be bought in 100ml or 500ml bottles and is diluted 1+9, so a 100ml bottle is going to do three 35mm films or two 120. A 500ml bottle is more cost effective however. In practice FX-39 is like a combination of the acutance of Rodinal and the fine grain and tonal range of Xtol.

[TomB_tx]

I use DD-X as a one-shot and just keep the stock in its original bottle. usually takes about a year to use up, and I notice no adverse effects - but some darkening of solution. I also use Rodinal on fine-grain films for its nice tonality, but it does emphasize grain. Now that I'm shooting and processing color more it will take longer to use up the DD-X, so I'll need to watch it.

[BernardC]

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6 hours ago, 250swb said:

Rodinal lasts forever but it's a bit grainy if you are shooting with FP4, and HC110 is best kept for medium format negatives because it's not the sharpest of developers although it's tonal qualities are excellent.

Rodinal can be a bit grainy, but not at higher dilutions. I don't find it too grainy with other ISO 100 films, but I don't use FP4. You can do an image search for "FP4 Rodinal" to see if it's too grainy for you. 

My standard dilution is 5ml per 300ml (Paterson tank), which is 1+59.

[leica dream]

I guess everyone has preferences for their own needs, but all that information you have given is really helpful and has encouraged me to identify associated STOP and FIX options which I think will not be so critical.

Grateful thanks for the encouragement.

[erl]

On 3/19/2025 at 7:05 AM, david strachan said:

One can get concertina bottles to exclude air.  In old days some would make up lost volume in ordinary bottles, with marbles.

...

That's how I lost my marbles! 🙄

[erl]

Give consideration to 'One Shot' processing. That way you can keep the remaining dev spread over a series of smaller bottles and only need to open one for immediate dev, storing the others indefinitely. 

[Doug A]

For someone starting film developing from scratch and wondering about what developer to start with I usually recommend Rodinal. It is inexpensive, has amazing shelf life, is used one-shot, and gives the user a baseline look at the highest acutance and most obvious grain of all the standard developer choices. 

Flickr is a good place to see how various films work with various developers. Do a search with keywords <film> and <developer> such as "FP4 Rodinal", "Tri-X Ilfosol", etc. And because the negative size matters too I include the keyword "35mm", "Nikon" or "Leica" for 35mm or the keyword "120" or "Hasselblad" for medium format. 

[LocalHero1953]

Reigniting this thread rather than start a new one.......

I've started using Adox XT3, for its benign environmental chemistry. I bought a 1 litre kit, made it up, diluted it, and distributed it between four amber glass bottles; they are notionally 500ml, but filled to the brim, with no air space, they are 670ml. So I ended up with four batches of 1:1.67 developer to be used as one shot. One bottle is good for two films in a Paterson tank, or four sheets of 4x5 in a Stearman tank. I used two bottles about 7 weeks ago.

I took out a third today and saw it had quite a lot of white flakes in it. I chose to risk using it, and the negatives have turned out fine.

From what I've read here, XT3 stored in this way could have a shelf life of six months, so I was surprised to see the flakes. I can see the fourth and last bottle also has them.

Does anyone know what the white precipitate might be? And how much precipitate is too much before I should just throw it away?

[250swb]

6 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Reigniting this thread rather than start a new one.......

I've started using Adox XT3, for its benign environmental chemistry. I bought a 1 litre kit, made it up, diluted it, and distributed it between four amber glass bottles; they are notionally 500ml, but filled to the brim, with no air space, they are 670ml. So I ended up with four batches of 1:1.67 developer to be used as one shot. One bottle is good for two films in a Paterson tank, or four sheets of 4x5 in a Stearman tank. I used two bottles about 7 weeks ago.

I took out a third today and saw it had quite a lot of white flakes in it. I chose to risk using it, and the negatives have turned out fine.

From what I've read here, XT3 stored in this way could have a shelf life of six months, so I was surprised to see the flakes. I can see the fourth and last bottle also has them.

Does anyone know what the white precipitate might be? And how much precipitate is too much before I should just throw it away?

I've not used XT3 but it's possibly temperature related, either where stored or not warm enough when mixed, try warming it up and see if the crystals dissolve again.

[LocalHero1953]

It certainly all dissolved when originally mixed. It was stored in a cupboard, not a fridge, and might have got warm at the end of August (not direct sunlight though). I'll try warming the last bottle before use (probably not for a few weeks now).

Edited October 15 by LocalHero1953

[leica dream]

Interesting that this thread has reopened at this time because I have decided I shall go ahead and get back to self processing.  I have just had a roll of Adox CHS 100 11 back from lab processing and am most disappointed as every shot looks over exposed and absolutely flat and lifeless lacking any contrast so there is nothing there to even improve by manipulation. I have used the lab many times previously with excellent results so I guess ADOX is just not suited to standard lab development regimes.

As I re-equip I shall need to choose a developer. I shoot slower ISO 100 film (FP4 or Adox) so maybe Rodinal or FX-39 11 for finer grain ............... unless you experienced guys advise otherwise.

[Pyrogallol]

When I loaded some plastic cassettes with bulk HP5 the other day I made the mistake of not attaching the end to one of the cassettes correctly. In case it was fogged I put the film through my Alpa Reflex 11 in the hope that the film might be ok.

So I used Rodinal 1:25 for 8 minutes, which I have not used recently. Some negatives are printable, some overexposed due to the aperture engravings on the lens being very feint resulting in the wrong aperture being used and some fogged due to the cassette end letting in light for a few seconds before I reattached it correctly.

Back to the subject, Rodinal is very long lasting, months if not years and a reliable developer. 8 minutes seems to be the right time for any film from Pan F to HP5, 20c at 1:25.

Another reliable developer is Moersch Tanol, if you can get it. As it is two part it doesn’t go off in the bottles, 1+1+100 for 18 minutes.

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[Stuart Richardson]

42 minutes ago, leica dream said:

Interesting that this thread has reopened at this time because I have decided I shall go ahead and get back to self processing.  I have just had a roll of Adox CHS 100 11 back from lab processing and am most disappointed as every shot looks over exposed and absolutely flat and lifeless lacking any contrast so there is nothing there to even improve by manipulation. I have used the lab many times previously with excellent results so I guess ADOX is just not suited to standard lab development regimes.

As I re-equip I shall need to choose a developer. I shoot slower ISO 100 film (FP4 or Adox) so maybe Rodinal or FX-39 11 for finer grain ............... unless you experienced guys advise otherwise.

I tried CHS 100 II and was not impressed. I mostly use Tmax 400, 100 and Acros (the old one...less so the new one). If you process 4 rolls a year, I would recommend Rodinal. You can just buy one bottle and use it the rest of your life. Literally. I rarely use it and have a 15 year old bottle that still works just fine. It joins my 25 year old bottle of PhotoFlo 200 that just lasts and lasts. In response to your original post, however, I would not recommend DDX. It is a nice developer, but not necessarily for long term storage. 

I also would advise against using concertina bottles. The type of plastic used is semi-permeable to oxygen, and they have to make them rather thin so that they compress. It seems like they would work, but their utility is a bit limited. Glass bottles filled up is the best way. Marbles (as long as they are clean) also seems like a good solution. You can also use something like Tetenal Protectan, which I believe was butane. Basically an inert gas heavier than air that you can spray into the bottle and displace the oxygen. Sadly Tetenal is no more, so not sure you can still get it in a photo specific version. I probably would not muck around with some general purpose one because of potential adulterants that might have an effect on the film. 

Paul: Your storage plan seems good, but white crystals in your XT3 is probably not a good sign. Personally I would discard. Film is just too expensive these days. When did you mix it? It could be contamination in the water or bottles. But whatever it is, it is not supposed to be there. If you do want to use it, I would either do a clip test (process just part of a roll) or a sheet or two if you shoot LF. 

For reference, I keep my developer in a plastic tank with a floating lid, and 4-6 months is usually fine but I seldom go any longer. If I want to use it when it is old, I do test it (and frankly just look at it, because I can kind of tell by the color). Most of what I shoot is large format, and honestly the sheets are so expensive now and they opportunities are precious, so I think there is no reason to push one's luck with the one of the cheapest parts of the whole process (developer). 

Edited October 15 by Stuart Richardson

[LocalHero1953]

30 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Paul: Your storage plan seems good, but white crystals in your XT3 is probably not a good sign. Personally I would discard. Film is just too expensive these days. When did you mix it? It could be contamination in the water or bottles. But whatever it is, it is not supposed to be there. If you do want to use it, I would either do a clip test (process just part of a roll) or a sheet or two if you shoot LF. 

 

I mixed it at the end of August - so not that long ago.

I might have been more risk averse, but I'm still feeling my way with 35mm B&W film, working out what sort of shots I want it for, as opposed to digital where I'm confident. It's a steep and long learning curve (but enjoyable), so a lot of my shots are experimental or just trials with different subjects. If I lost some degree of quality because of oxidised developer it wouldn't be a tragedy! 

Do you know what the stuff is that precipitates out? Looking at recipes for so-called Mytol, an XTol clone, the greatest proportion of constituents by weight are the preservatives, pH buffers and stabilisers. As a semi chemist, I'm curious about what's happening. Given that the bottles were well filled and sealed, I would be surprised if it was oxidation, but less so if something precipitated because of high or low temperature.

Edited October 15 by LocalHero1953

[250swb]

18 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

I mixed it at the end of August - so not that long ago.

I might have been more risk averse, but I'm still feeling my way with 35mm B&W film, working out what sort of shots I want it for, as opposed to digital where I'm confident. It's a steep and long learning curve (but enjoyable), so a lot of my shots are experimental or just trials with different subjects. If I lost some degree of quality because of oxidised developer it wouldn't be a tragedy! 

Do you know what the stuff is that precipitates out? Looking at recipes for so-called Mytol, an XTol clone, the greatest proportion of constituents by weight are the preservatives, pH buffers and stabilisers. As a semi chemist, I'm curious about what's happening. Given that the bottles were well filled and sealed, I would be surprised if it was oxidation, but less so if something precipitated because of high or low temperature.

The stuff that precipitates out is likely to be the solution re-crystallising, due to low ambient temperatures in storage, or not being at a high enough temperature when mixing it. As I've said I haven't used XT3 (the Xtol clone), but I have used Xtol in the past, and I like Xtol. But now I'd rather use one shot liquid developers and Adox FX-39 is a crossover between Xtol and Rodinal, so fine grain with acutance and also very good with 'T grain' films.

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[Stuart Richardson]

3 hours ago, LocalHero1953 said:

I mixed it at the end of August - so not that long ago.

I might have been more risk averse, but I'm still feeling my way with 35mm B&W film, working out what sort of shots I want it for, as opposed to digital where I'm confident. It's a steep and long learning curve (but enjoyable), so a lot of my shots are experimental or just trials with different subjects. If I lost some degree of quality because of oxidised developer it wouldn't be a tragedy! 

Do you know what the stuff is that precipitates out? Looking at recipes for so-called Mytol, an XTol clone, the greatest proportion of constituents by weight are the preservatives, pH buffers and stabilisers. As a semi chemist, I'm curious about what's happening. Given that the bottles were well filled and sealed, I would be surprised if it was oxidation, but less so if something precipitated because of high or low temperature.

My guess would be that it is not the Xtol, but something in the water. Either from a precipitate mineral in the water, or perhaps even an algae, mold or bacteria. But I am not an expert on the chemistry of it. 

I have not had a precipitate in Xtol much over the years. It is more common for me in fixer. Old concentrate can precipitate out sulfur in the form of crystals. That is a sign it is dead, as it reduces the thiosulfate content and efficacy of the fixer. Or black particles which are silver coming out of solution. That can still work if it is minor, but a sign the fixer is dying (or dead). 
 

Basically, if the work is not that important, then by all means try it. It may be fine. But if it is important, XT3 is not expensive and for me at least it would be hard to justify keeping the developer given the price of film. Tmax 400 is 21 dollars a sheet at B&H in 8x10 and even 35mm is 11 dollars a roll. 1L of xt-3 is 6.79 and it will process at least 10-15 rolls. Honestly, that’s less than a coffee costs at some places here. For me at least the risk is not worth it. 

Edited October 15 by Stuart Richardson