FlashGordonPhotography Posted February 5 Share #61 Posted February 5 Advertisement (gone after registration) There’ no more reason to have IBIS on a 60MP camera than a 24MP one. Resolution has nothing to do with it. The only relevant factor is output size. If you look at images on larger media, including screens, the use case for IS becomes stronger. If you make images on the new fancy 200MP M27 at A4, nothing has changed form the M9. It’s the click of the 1:1 button in LR that’s the issue. Maybe start deciding if you want it at the sizes you view your images instead of at pixel level. More resolution has benefits at smaller output sizes as well (aliasing etc). But to think more resolution increases the need for IBIS is a fallacy. Note: I’m voting for IBIS *IF* they can keep the size the same. But not if it makes the M bigger. Gordon 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 5 Posted February 5 Hi FlashGordonPhotography, Take a look here Why the M needs IBIS. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
evikne Posted February 5 Share #62 Posted February 5 (edited) 1 hour ago, _leicaguru said: It is written in the stars. The future for people who want a simple rangefinder is film. And hopefully Leica doesn't stop making them. I really hope that this is not going to be the only option. And what's the point of a rangefinder camera that is not simple? To me, it seems completely contradictory. Edited February 5 by evikne 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M11 for me Posted February 5 Share #63 Posted February 5 vor einer Stunde schrieb Pelu2010: Yes I know ! These are made with a M240! you wrote that you don’t need shutter times longer than 1/125 or 1/250. So I just wanted to show that sometimes long time exposures can be very nice! And with IBIS you can hold slow shutter much better. I am using a gimbal for more demanding slow shutter. cheers 🥂 Exactly. Seemingly your first post with your image was not understood. Things start to get weird. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyshire Man Posted February 5 Share #64 Posted February 5 49 minutes ago, evikne said: I really hope that this is not going to be the only option. And what's the point of a rangefinder camera that is not simple? To me, it seems completely contradictory. Every now and then I think about getting out my film cameras, I shoot black and white after all. Then about 0.5 seconds later I realise I like the M11M/P/D about a billion times more. So many of the posts on this thread descend into my way or the highway but I suppose that is natural for an internet forum largely populated by middle aged and above blokes! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 5 Share #65 Posted February 5 I imagine that the elderly and the disengaged had a similar conversation when discussing the new Steam Powered Weaving Machine 200 years ago, and the infernal Horseless Carriage 100 years ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markey Posted February 5 Share #66 Posted February 5 21 minutes ago, Corius said: I imagine that the elderly and the disengaged had a similar conversation when discussing the new Steam Powered Weaving Machine 200 years ago, and the infernal Horseless Carriage 100 years ago. You are not wrong. First shots made about `63 . First use of an M mid eighties. I read most of the threads on this forum but very little of the concerns expressed about camera capabilities (or lack of them ) relate to my day to day photography. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyshire Man Posted February 5 Share #67 Posted February 5 Advertisement (gone after registration) 27 minutes ago, Corius said: I imagine that the elderly and the disengaged had a similar conversation when discussing the new Steam Powered Weaving Machine 200 years ago, and the infernal Horseless Carriage 100 years ago. You do realise that if you're on a train which goes into a tunnel your lungs will burst? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyshire Man Posted February 5 Share #68 Posted February 5 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Markey said: You are not wrong. First shots made about `63 . First use of an M mid eighties. I read most of the threads on this forum but very little of the concerns expressed about camera capabilities (or lack of them ) relate to my day to day photography. I'm a broken record on this, I've only been using them for a year and a bit. At no point have I thought if only I had IBIS, EVF or more megapixels. The only things I think would be a real benefit during my usage are most importantly, when in manual shutter speed mode a momentary display of the selected shutter speed 0.5 seconds after the dial has stopped moving so that one can check shutter speed is feasible when the metering says spot on, allowing adjustment of ISO or aperture if not, all without removing ones eye from the viewfinder (it must be possible, it does it for ISO already) and secondly much faster wake up (although standby is a reasonable mitigation at the cost of battery life). There are other things I'd be happy to see but none essential or as important. Edited February 5 by Derbyshire Man have -> after 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
evikne Posted February 5 Share #69 Posted February 5 29 minutes ago, Corius said: I imagine that the elderly and the disengaged had a similar conversation when discussing the new Steam Powered Weaving Machine 200 years ago, and the infernal Horseless Carriage 100 years ago. But we're not talking about a “regular” digital camera, which of course must be allowed to evolve as much as they want. The Leica M rangefinder camera is already a surviving rarity, and must be allowed to continue to be so, because that's the whole point of keeping it alive. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markey Posted February 5 Share #70 Posted February 5 1 minute ago, Derbyshire Man said: I'm a broken record on this, I've only been using them for a year and a bit. At no point have I thought if only I had IBIS, EVF or more megapixels. The only things I think would be a real benefit during my usage are most importantly, when in manual shutter speed mode a momentary display of the selected shutter speed 0.5 seconds have the dial has stopped moving so that one can check shutter speed is feasible when the metering says spot on, allowing adjustment of ISO or aperture if not, all without removing ones eye from the viewfinder (it must be possible, it does it for ISO already) and secondly much faster wake up (although standby is a reasonable mitigation at the cost of battery life). There are other things I'd be happy to see but none essential or as important. I`ve only been using a digital M for a few years (246) before that it was film M`s and on the digital side it was Canon/Sony/Richo and Sigma Foveon. It`s been an interesting journey in as much as you try stuff until you pare it down to the essentials. Unless of course you are doing it for a living and then you have other requirements. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markey Posted February 5 Share #71 Posted February 5 20 minutes ago, evikne said: But we're not talking about a “regular” digital camera, which of course must be allowed to evolve as much as they want. The Leica M rangefinder camera is already a surviving rarity, and must be allowed to continue to be so, because that's the whole point of keeping it alive. Provided its economically viable to do so. The accountants will have the casting vote not the users. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
david strachan Posted February 6 Share #72 Posted February 6 Reckon a shakey sensor cleaner would be a lot more sensible than Ibis. ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tseg Posted February 6 Share #73 Posted February 6 If only my M had AI to make my photos better… 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
costa43 Posted February 6 Share #74 Posted February 6 (edited) It’s quite obvious that most threads involving future M cameras split into two directions. Those who want the most modern version possible and those who want a traditional version. This takes us back to yet another common opinion. There should be more than one line. A 60mp+ beast with ibis and electronic shutter etc and a film box with a sensor version that’s fast and as basic as possible. Having two lines gets rid of a headache for Leica too. I think if the plan is to evolve the M11 model then it should come with IBIS and all the other tech that is available, it seems logical to allow that line to be as modern a version as the tech will allow it to be. That in turn allows a stripped back model to be introduced to appease the traditionalists. It’s the inbetween that is a bit meh. Edited February 6 by costa43 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNK100 Posted February 6 Share #75 Posted February 6 3 hours ago, Tseg said: If only my M had AI to make my photos better… Yes and auto compose... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ko.Fe. Posted February 6 Share #76 Posted February 6 IBIS is cool, but realistically not possible in such compact FF body, where significant part is taken by the thing which makes M very special. A.k.a. rangefinder. EVFs are much more compact, but still. Look at today's crappy release of OM-3. Tiny sensor, huge body for it and weight is not far from M11. No difference between film M and digital M, I think is the key advantage. Rather than some weight adding, battery eating so-so alternative to the tripod, flash. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Besprosvet Posted February 6 Share #77 Posted February 6 I'm not that pessimistic, even if they're going to do an evf/ibis/250mpx/30fps M camera, they're going to make a genuine, simpler version too (that costs more of course 😂) . The reason for not being pessimistic is that there's enough market to the point that even the Pixii brand can survive (despite selling for 4 thousand euro a camera that doesn't allow you to use flash AT ALL, lol), and, Leica just released the M11-D, and keeps releasing Monochrom cameras, which is a niche within an already small niche. There's enough of us, and many more photographers that got tired of these boring mirrorless computers are joining. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegelli Posted February 6 Share #78 Posted February 6 The only reason one might "need" IBIS on a 60 MP camera and not on a 24 MP camera is for pixel peeping affectionadas. At a given output size camera shake is equally good or bad irrespective of sensor MP's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
84bravo Posted February 6 Share #79 Posted February 6 22 hours ago, _leicaguru said: Not me thanks. 90mm at 1/100s is called the reciprocal rule. Anyone who knows how to hold a camera properly can do this. Maybe because of your age your hands aren't steady. In that case maybe you should consider something other than rangefinders. I would stick to your Sony. It's good for bad eyes and shaky hands as you age. It has been my experience that with the electronic shutter that rule is effectively doubled. IBIS would make a huge difference there. Even at high shutter speeds the electronic shutter exaggerates camera movement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
84bravo Posted February 6 Share #80 Posted February 6 1 hour ago, Ko.Fe. said: IBIS is cool, but realistically not possible in such compact FF body... When the M8 was introduced full frame was not possible in such a compact body. Since then the bodies are full frame, smaller, and significantly advanced. Maybe IBIS isn't possible in the current M11, but who knows what will come with the M12 or M13? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now