Spots on image question

[250swb]

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6 hours ago, Pieter12 said:

As far as this hoo-ha about f-stops affecting the ability of the sensor to record dust, the f-stop affects the image coming through the lens, it has nothing to do with the sensor's susceptibility to record surface dust. Of course, the sharper the photo, the easier it is to see where sensor dust is present in the image.

A smaller f/stop will project a more acute angle of light onto the sensor and this in turn casts a shadow of the dust on the sensor and makes it look much bigger than it really is. This is why when people see dust in the image they look at the sensor and often see nothing, hence inventing ideas it must be the lens that has dust on it (lens dust never shows up).

For perspective anybody with a modicum of common sense can dry clean or wet clean a sensor, and photographers have been doing it safely for decades. And anybody who owns a digital camera that doesn't clean itself by shaking the sensor using the IBIS should really have both a gel stick and a wet cleaning kit because dust isn't always 'dust' but liquid in origin like spots of oil etc. I don't really agree with the idea of blowing dust off the sensor because you don't actually know where you've blown it to, so it's best to remove it directly and given using a gel stick takes only a minute it's hardly a chore. 

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[jaapv]

10 minutes ago, 250swb said:

A smaller f/stop will project a more acute angle of light onto the sensor and this in turn casts a shadow of the dust on the sensor and makes it look much bigger than it really is. This is why when people see dust in the image they look at the sensor and often see nothing, hence inventing ideas it must be the lens that has dust on it (lens dust never shows up).

For perspective anybody with a modicum of common sense can dry clean or wet clean a sensor, and photographers have been doing it safely for decades. And anybody who owns a digital camera that doesn't clean itself by shaking the sensor using the IBIS should really have both a gel stick and a wet cleaning kit because dust isn't always 'dust' but liquid in origin like spots of oil etc. I don't really agree with the idea of blowing dust off the sensor because you don't actually know where you've blown it to, so it's best to remove it directly and given using a gel stick takes only a minute it's hardly a chore. 

That is why that Green Clean vacuum cleaner is so effective. Make sure your camera has no IBIS  or at least locks the sensor when using a gel stick - and use the correct type. 

[FlashGordonPhotography]

2 hours ago, 250swb said:

A smaller f/stop will project a more acute angle of light onto the sensor and this in turn casts a shadow of the dust on the sensor and makes it look much bigger than it really is. This is why when people see dust in the image they look at the sensor and often see nothing, hence inventing ideas it must be the lens that has dust on it (lens dust never shows up).

For perspective anybody with a modicum of common sense can dry clean or wet clean a sensor, and photographers have been doing it safely for decades. And anybody who owns a digital camera that doesn't clean itself by shaking the sensor using the IBIS should really have both a gel stick and a wet cleaning kit because dust isn't always 'dust' but liquid in origin like spots of oil etc. I don't really agree with the idea of blowing dust off the sensor because you don't actually know where you've blown it to, so it's best to remove it directly and given using a gel stick takes only a minute it's hardly a chore. 

I don't like gel sticks. First with IBIS you need to be REALLY careful as you can damage the IBIS mount. Even if you get the less sticky *Sony* one it's possible.

Second every gel stick I've used has left a tiny residue on the sensor. I'd rather use an Artic Butterfly and then wet clean. Also, you can use an AB in the field.

If you face the lens mount down you won't have any blower issues. Haven't ever had a problem since the D30 Canon I got 20 years ago.

Gordon

[SrMi]

1 hour ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

I don't like gel sticks. First with IBIS you need to be REALLY careful as you can damage the IBIS mount. Even if you get the less sticky *Sony* one it's possible.

Second every gel stick I've used has left a tiny residue on the sensor. I'd rather use an Artic Butterfly and then wet clean. Also, you can use an AB in the field.

If you face the lens mount down you won't have any blower issues. Haven't ever had a problem since the D30 Canon I got 20 years ago.

Gordon

I also did not have good results with gel stick and instead use a blower, Arctic Butterfly, and wet cleaning (in that order and I stop once no dust is visible). I use a Mini Quasar sensor loupe to check for dust and whether I need to go to the next stage

[250swb]

3 hours ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

I don't like gel sticks. First with IBIS you need to be REALLY careful as you can damage the IBIS mount. Even if you get the less sticky *Sony* one it's possible.

Second every gel stick I've used has left a tiny residue on the sensor. I'd rather use an Artic Butterfly and then wet clean. Also, you can use an AB in the field.

If you face the lens mount down you won't have any blower issues. Haven't ever had a problem since the D30 Canon I got 20 years ago.

Gordon

I was saying that if you don't have a camera with IBIS get a gel stick.... and facing the lens mount downwards sort of assumes that dust drops like a stone when loosened with a blower and doesn't float around in the air (which is how it most probably got on the sensor). There are enough ways to clean a sensor that everybody can contribute variations on likes and dislikes and what works for one person may not work for another,

[Jonathan Levin]

Question related to this: what is the best way to tell if there is dust/dirt on sensor? I know that the test should be taking a photo of something like blue sky or  some evenly light paper.

But what combination is best and with which lens? Wide angle, telephoto? Should focus be at infinity or closest focus? And finally smallest aperature (22) or widest (<2.8)? Am I forgetting anything. 

This would be great to know and avoid a lot of unneeded testing. So how do you do it? Thanks. Jonathan

[jaapv]

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See it on my image remove it in the camera what I don’t see doesn’t bother me. 

[SrMi]

1 hour ago, Jonathan Levin said:

Question related to this: what is the best way to tell if there is dust/dirt on sensor? I know that the test should be taking a photo of something like blue sky or  some evenly light paper.

But what combination is best and with which lens? Wide angle, telephoto? Should focus be at infinity or closest focus? And finally smallest aperature (22) or widest (<2.8)? Am I forgetting anything. 

This would be great to know and avoid a lot of unneeded testing. So how do you do it? Thanks. Jonathan

When I don't notice dust in my images, I use the Mini Quasar sensor loupe to check whether the sensor needs preventive cleaning.

In rare cases, I use an image in LrC to visualize any spots, taken as follows:

- white surface, out of focus

- a clean lens, long enough that only the white surface is in the frame

- close the aperture to the smallest value

- overexpose so that the dust stands out easily

I would not be bothered by tiny specks that can be seen only at f/32 or f/22.

[Jonathan Levin]

1 minute ago, SrMi said:

When I don't notice dust in my images, I use the Mini Quasar sensor loupe to check whether the sensor needs preventive cleaning.

In rare cases, I use an image in LrC to visualize any spots, taken as follows:

- white surface, out of focus

- a clean lens, long enough that only the white surface is in the frame

- close the aperture to the smallest value

- overexpose so that the dust stands out easily

I would not be bothered by tiny specks that can be seen only at f/32 or f/22.

Thanks SrMi.

Out of focus- does that mean you focus at closest or furtherest away?

Clean lens, long enough- I get that I would need to fill frame, but are you using a tele for this test?

 

[SrMi]

Just now, Jonathan Levin said:

Thanks SrMi.

Out of focus- does that mean you focus at closest or furtherest away?

Clean lens, long enough- I get that I would need to fill frame, but are you using a tele for this test?

 

Every choice is driven by the need to fill the frame with a white surface. I.e., I have to be close (out-of-focus means infinity focus), and the focal length must be sufficiently long to fill the frame. I am often 20cm from a white wall using a 50mm lens.

 

[Jean-Michel]

Any lens, any plain surface, be it a cloudless blue sky or evenly painted wall, or a mat board, or whatever. Manually focus, well not focus and close the lens to the smallest aperture, set the ISO to 100 (you do not want to add noise), it does not matter if the exposure is long and you can't hold the camera steady. Just make sure that you don't include some shadows if you get very close to a wall or such.

Dust and some wet spots (oily or water-based) will happen, it is an absolute guarantee. Sending a camera to have a sensor cleaned is a waste of money and time. Just take a few minutes to learn how to do it. You will need to do it every so often.

Really, it is very easy and simple to do. No magic involved. Even wet cleaning is easy enough and not scary, just don't use dishsoap😆

I use Visible Dust (other systems are surely as effective and easy to use) VD has a kit with two types of liquids for wet cleaning (water or oil spots), again easy to use.

Most of the time, using a blower, and maybe the Arctic Butterfly brush is all it takes.

[Guest]

Lots of opinions and methods on how to clean a sensor. Good information. I personally have never touched the sensor on any of the cameras I currently own or have owned. It’s simply never been an issue beyond what a quick blast of air will do from a Giottos blower or the self-cleaning feature on Nikons. If I see anything in the final image I’ll just clone it out. Call me scared but I never touch the sensor with anything other than air. 

[ALScott]

Just now, TwentyEighthParallel said:

Lots of opinions and methods on how to clean a sensor. Good information. I personally have never touched the sensor on any of the cameras I currently own or have owned. It’s simply never been an issue beyond what a quick blast of air will do from a Giottos blower or the self-cleaning feature on Nikons. If I see anything in the final image I’ll just clone it out. Call me scared but I never touch the sensor with anything other than air. 

This is how I am leaning.  My original question was so I could understand the source of what I was seeing when looking through the viewfinder but it's nice to now have all of this cleaning info.  The info was in the forum here and there but now a lot in one thread.  These two spots were a bit distracting for me so I will do something about them.  I believe I have gotten rid of one of them from cleaning off the 1.4x.

[Jonathan Levin]

I love you all. I just ordered a Giotto Medium Rocket blower.and a Ruggard 2 DSLR battery pouch that I hope will fit my SL batteries.🫣 Like TwentyEighth Parallel, I've been a bit apprehensive regarding full sensor clean. The Giotto will be a good start. Time to start watching sensor cleaning videos....

And back when I was young and dumb(er), I managed to all but destroy one of my D series Nikons by using a can of compressed air to try and blow off some dust on a sensor. Every picture I took looked like a Jackson Pollack painting after that. One vey! Serviced by Nikon who no doubt were laughing their a**es off while counting the money I paid to have this fixed.....lesson learned, the hard way.

[Jean-Michel]

Hi again,

Just more info. Nick Rains from Leica Australia posted this video a couple of years ago. He describes his method, — note the "Leica Warning" disclaimer, which is just that. Just to show that today you can use any of the legit products or systems without fear. Again, most of the time a simple blow-off is enough.

Here is the link: 

 

 

[SrMi]

28 minutes ago, Jonathan Levin said:

I love you all. I just ordered a Giotto Medium Rocket blower.and a Ruggard 2 DSLR battery pouch that I hope will fit my SL batteries.🫣 Like TwentyEighth Parallel, I've been a bit apprehensive regarding full sensor clean. The Giotto will be a good start. Time to start watching sensor cleaning videos....

And back when I was young and dumb(er), I managed to all but destroy one of my D series Nikons by using a can of compressed air to try and blow off some dust on a sensor. Every picture I took looked like a Jackson Pollack painting after that. One vey! Serviced by Nikon who no doubt were laughing their a**es off while counting the money I paid to have this fixed.....lesson learned, the hard way.

Yes, compressed air can is a big no-no for sensors.

[Jonathan Levin]

35 minutes ago, Jean-Michel said:

Hi again,

Just more info. Nick Rains from Leica Australia posted this video a couple of years ago. He describes his method, — note the "Leica Warning" disclaimer, which is just that. Just to show that today you can use any of the legit products or systems without fear. Again, most of the time a simple blow-off is enough.

Here is the link: 

 

 

Thanks. Just watched. Nick is great. His video on SL3 settings was really helpful too. 

[jaapv]

Note that the wet cleaning bit of this 24 minute video takes only two and a half minutes - that should tell you enough about the "difficulty" of the procedure. 😉

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Hallo,

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[Jonathan Levin]

After some learning, looks like I'll be getting some Type 3 Photographic Solutions Swabs and the Eclipse Optic cleaner soon. Stuff is exspensive!

[FlashGordonPhotography]

7 hours ago, 250swb said:

I was saying that if you don't have a camera with IBIS get a gel stick.... and facing the lens mount downwards sort of assumes that dust drops like a stone when loosened with a blower and doesn't float around in the air (which is how it most probably got on the sensor). There are enough ways to clean a sensor that everybody can contribute variations on likes and dislikes and what works for one person may not work for another,

Absolutely. I don't like gel sticks. I know of others that swear by them. It's your camera. You do what works for you.

Gordon