Trading SL2-S for SL3

[Smogg]

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9 minutes ago, SrMi said:

A7rV, Q3, and M11 have the same rolling shutter, and their electronic shutter is very usable. Why would it be different with SL3?

The problem is definitely overblown. Do you often need to shoot at speeds faster than 1/8000 to switch to an electronic shutter? And for video there are much cheaper solutions

[SrMi]

4 minutes ago, keeping_a_balance said:

Not sure how legit this video is, little technical details provided:

 

 

That video is spam and does not reflect real camera results.

[SrMi]

4 minutes ago, Smogg said:

The problem is definitely overblown. Do you often need to shoot at speeds faster than 1/8000 to switch to an electronic shutter? And for video there are much cheaper solutions

I also use the electronic shutter to eliminate the shutter sound. It works well handheld but requires little movement from the subject.

[JohnSantaF4]

7 hours ago, nicci78 said:

SL3 is only 4 fps with AF.... 3 sec startup time... turning it off required to press the ON/OFF button 5 sec...

not a fast camera at all. Petapixel is wondering why SL3 has CF Express and 8GB of RAM support for such poor performance. 

https://petapixel.com/2024/03/07/leica-sl3-initial-review-first-impressions/

They are wondering if a faster variant with fewer MP will be release soon aka SL3-S

Just compared to Nikon Z9/Z8 SL3 looks like a an old dinosaure at way higher price

Leica should have skipped the old 60MP sensor for an up to date stacked sensor 

Fun fact : Nikon has a better way to focus manual focus lenses with phase detect eye detect focusing confirmation 

 

It is surprising how many small things are last generation. 

[SrMi]

7 hours ago, nicci78 said:

SL3 is only 4 fps with AF.... 3 sec startup time... turning it off required to press the ON/OFF button 5 sec...

You are spreading misinformation.

Startup time is instant (from shutdown). I must hold the on/off button for 1.5 seconds per manual, or about 1 second in practice.

[PeterBoyadjian]

I've had the camera for 24 hours. 

The new power button is perfect and start and shutdown times are not an issue. 

Go test one with the new firmware 1.1, everything is ok. 

 

[Chaemono]

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vor 8 Stunden schrieb hoolyproductions:

[…]

An example from the SL2-S last week ISO 25000, 1/60s (Lightroom AI noise has been applied). Exposure on the subjects has been lifted one stop and half a stop of shadow.

[…]

Thanks for posting. You won’t be able to do this with the 60 MP sensor. I tried it when the α7R IV came out. 

vor 8 Stunden schrieb hoolyproductions:

[…]

I imagine I'll be keeping the SL2-S but let's see.

If PDAF somehow impairs the ‘push-ability’ of high ISO, high contrast files of an alleged SL3-S, the SL2-S will be the last camera of its kind and a keeper for sure. 

[SrMi]

6 minutes ago, PeterBoyadjian said:

I've had the camera for 24 hours. 

The new power button is perfect and start and shutdown times are not an issue. 

Go test one with the new firmware 1.1, everything is ok. 

I much prefer the new power button and its additional functionality to the old lever.

[Chris Nebard]

I’m sure that with ongoing firmware updates the SL3 will be a very good camera. I hope so because I’m fully invested in the L Mount and ongoing development is essential. That said, I won’t be upgrading my SL2-S in the foreseeable future; none of the improvements are must haves for me. I’ve never had any issue with contrast based a/f as I’m not generally a ‘fast moving subject’ photographer and for some wildlife subjects the SL2-S is more than good enough. IBIS hasn’t been improved and, as a low light camera, the SL2-S probably still shades it and that’s important to me. In fact, from D-Lux to Q via a couple of M’s, the SL2-S is still the best Leica I’ve owned. 

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[nicci78]

13 hours ago, SrMi said:

You are spreading misinformation.

Startup time is instant (from shutdown). I must hold the on/off button for 1.5 seconds per manual, or about 1 second in practice.

It is just the information from Petapixel video review. 
Just take a look. 
I think it may be the same issue as with Q3 and M11. Very first time startup is long. Then subsequent ones are faster. Then once in a while it will require a full long startup. 

[nicci78]

14 hours ago, SrMi said:

A7rV, Q3, and M11 have the same rolling shutter, and their electronic shutter is very usable. Why would it be different with SL3?

Exactly ! That’s the issue their rolling shutter is really bad. Making all 60MP unsuitable for videos and for electronic shutter only (Sigma fp L is notoriously bad for that) 

That’s why Sony still sell 12/24/33MP variants for video works. 
SL2 47MP has one of that fastest readout time among non stacked sensor. 

A 45/47/50MP stacked sensor would have been awesome ! The tiny difference in resolution between 60MP and 45MP did not worth the massive rolling shutter. 
 

Future SL3-S should be the wiser choice. 

 

Edited March 10, 2024 by nicci78

[Chaemono]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb nicci78:

Exactly ! That’s the issue their rolling shutter is really bad. Making all 60MP unsuitable for videos and for electronic shutter only (Sigma fp L is notoriously bad for that) 

That’s why Sony still sell 12/24/33MP variants for video works. 
SL2 47MP has one of that fastest readout time among non stacked sensor. 

A 45/47/50MP stacked sensor would have been awesome ! The tiny difference in resolution between 60MP and 45MP did not worth the massive rolling shutter. 

 

It doesn’t look like Sony sells their stacked sensors to third parties. The IMX366 could be used in an SL3-S.  https://www.sony-semicon.com/en/products/is/camera/index.html

[nicci78]

Sony semi is making customised stacked sensor for anyone willing to pay for it :

- Olympus/OM System 20MP m4/3 

- Nikon Z9/Z8 45MP FF

- Fujifilm X-H2S 26MP APS-C 

All stacked 

[Smogg]

49 minutes ago, nicci78 said:

Exactly ! That’s the issue their rolling shutter is really bad. Making all 60MP unsuitable for videos and for electronic shutter only (Sigma fp L is notoriously bad for that) 

That’s why Sony still sell 12/24/33MP variants for video works. 
SL2 47MP has one of that fastest readout time among non stacked sensor. 

A 45/47/50MP stacked sensor would have been awesome ! The tiny difference in resolution between 60MP and 45MP did not worth the massive rolling shutter. 
 

Future SL3-S should be the wiser choice. 

 

The 60 sensor is the best on the market in terms of photo quality, despite the fact that it has been around for a long time by modern standards. Yes, it is completely unsuitable for video and has limited suitability for the electronic shutter. Apparently, still photos were primarily important to Leica, which makes sense given its positioning in the market, this is the only area where Leica can compete and outperform other manufacturers. Any other solution would not make the most of Leica's exceptional optics

[Smogg]

Maybe it would make more sense for Leica to go the Hasselblad route and remove video from the new camera, as well as the ugly connector on the viewfinder. And then a year later release SL3-S with a fast, lower-density sensor (30-35 MP) for video and shooting in low light

[LocalHero1953]

12 minutes ago, Smogg said:

The 60 sensor is the best on the market in terms of photo quality, despite the fact that it has been around for a long time by modern standards. Yes, it is completely unsuitable for video and has limited suitability for the electronic shutter. Apparently, still photos were primarily important to Leica, which makes sense given its positioning in the market, this is the only area where Leica can compete and outperform other manufacturers. Any other solution would not make the most of Leica's exceptional optics

Leica is one of the most highly regarded makers of cinema lenses as well. Nikon's purchase of Red shows another manufacturer realising that they need video and stills. The SL2-S demonstrated that Leica feels the same. IMO all that the SL3 shows is that Leica realises it cannot satisfy the market for high res stills and good video in one body, and that a SL3-S is probably on its way. 

This forum inevitably sees Leica only through a stills lens😉.

Edited March 10, 2024 by LocalHero1953

[Smogg]

2 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Leica is one of the most highly regarded makers of cinema lenses as well. Nikon's purchase of Red shows another manufacturer realising that they need video and stills. The SL2-S demonstrated that Leica feels the same. IMO all the SL3 shows is that Leica realises it cannot satisfy the market for high res stills and good video in one body, and that a SL3-S is probably on its way. 

This forum inevitably sees Leica only through a stills lens😉.

I already wrote about this before your post😀

[LocalHero1953]

2 minutes ago, Smogg said:

I already wrote about this before your post😀

And it has been written quite a few times in the last few days.......
My comment was not so much about the SL3-S as about still photos not being the only area where Leica can compete and outperform.

Edited March 10, 2024 by LocalHero1953

[mipo]

 

In this video its mentioned that some software updates will still come to SL2S camera / joystick magnification for focus check. I am also in no rush upgarding to SL3. If I will upgrade it might be the Sl3S or even will skip one generation. Sl2S serves me plenty. 

Edited March 10, 2024 by mipo

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[nicci78]

1 hour ago, Smogg said:

Maybe it would make more sense for Leica to go the Hasselblad route and remove video from the new camera

It already exists : the M11