The Leica SL3 - A Review by Jonathan Slack

[Sandokan]

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I will return to reading feedback after more people have used the camera for a longer period and there is more fact and less opinion. 

[Photoworks]

I am doing some comparison testing between SL2 and SL3

I have noticed a few points that surprised me.

1. Same framing, same POV on a tripod, the SL2 has a wider view 😳
2. The noise levels of ISO 4000-3200 and 25000-25000 are so close to the 2 cameras that there is no need to upgrade for that.
3. The images on the SL2 a slightly brighter even at 3200 vs 4000 Iso on the SL3
4. SL3 can now set ISO with 1/3 stop up and down
5. The SL3 menu is still a little confusing to me, but there is  less need to create profiles, icons on the side are not great to use, I would imagine ever harder with gloves 
6. Customizing the quick menu is not sticky, you have to save it into a profile, but you need to apply the changes to every profile because they go away. I have little use for DNG resolution since i will most likely use always 60MP, i like to use it for profiles, since the side icons require "FN FN touch hold and then swipe select, FN again to hide side icons"

 

NOISE levels at SL3 at 4000ISO and SL2 3200ISO 200% in C1P with Noise and sharpening turned off.

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SL3

SL2

 

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ISO 25000  in C1P Noise and sharpening off

SL3 left

SL3

 

SL2 

 

Download here

 

[Chaemono]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb Photoworks:

I am doing some comparison testing between SL2 and SL3

I have noticed a few points that surprised me.

1. Same framing, same POV on a tripod, the SL2 has a wider view 😳
2. The noise levels of ISO 4000-3200 and 25000-25000 are so close to the 2 cameras that there is no need to upgrade for that.
3. The images on the SL2 a slightly brighter even at 3200 vs 4000 Iso on the SL3
4. SL3 can now set ISO with 1/3 stop up and down
5. The SL3 menu is still a little confusing to me, but there is  less need to create profiles, icons on the side are not great to use, I would imagine ever harder with gloves 
6. Customizing the quick menu is not sticky, you have to save it into a profile, but you need to apply the changes to every profile because they go away. I have little use for DNG resolution since i will most likely use always 60MP, i like to use it for profiles, since the side icons require "FN FN touch hold and then swipe select, FN again to hide side icons"

 

NOISE levels at SL3 at 4000ISO and SL2 3200ISO 200% in C1P with Noise and sharpening turned off.

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

SL3

SL2

 

----------

ISO 25000  in C1P Noise and sharpening off

SL3 left

SL3

 

SL2 

 

Download here

 

Thanks so much for these. If you find the time, could you, please, try ISO 100 on both cameras in high contrast scenes where you need to increase exposure in post by five stops and lift the shadows all the way, pull back the highlights as much as necessary and see what the results look like?

Very much appreciated would also be ISO 3200-6400 in high contrast scenes and increased exposure by 1.5 stops and shadows at +50%.

[Olaf_ZG]

28 minutes ago, Chaemono said:

Thanks so much for these. If you find the time, could you, please, try ISO 100 on both cameras in high contrast scenes where you need to increase exposure in post by five stops and lift the shadows all the way, pull back the highlights as much as necessary and see what the results look like?

Very much appreciated would also be ISO 3200-6400 in high contrast scenes and increased exposure by 1.5 stops and shadows at +50%.

Why would one do that? Instead of metering off correctly? Really curious about the need, as I can’t imagine needing this.

[jonoslack]

1 hour ago, Eclectic Man said:

I enjoyed your review, and the photographs you took, (although I have to say I expect you take very fine photographs with whatever equipment you use).  But the comments are not all, 'enlightening'.

I would be interested to know if you used the sensor cleaning function, and whether the shutter can be closed when changing lenses.   But £5920 is beyond my budget at the moment, even if I did sell my SL2.

Edit: Oh, and does the manual cover the whole camera this time?  The SL2 manual omitted the connections on the left hand side.

Well, I'm glad you enjoyed the review - truth to tell my primary intent (personally) is to entertain - and to show off my snaps! 

I didn't actually try the sensor cleaning function - forgot about it completely and cleaned the sensor with a sensor swab (which worked fine)

As for the manual - I've never seen it - Leica never sent me one 😂

All the best

Jonathan

[adrianh]

6 hours ago, Smogg said:

After reading the SL3 reviews, I realized how much I love my X2D😂 The most frequently used cameras I had were two M11s before the problematic firmware. When I wanted super color, I used X2D. When I need speed and instant, tenacious autofocus - Sony A7rv. It was Sony that I planned to replace with SL3 because of my dislike for the Sony interface and grip. But after the reviews it turns out that SL3 falls more into the X2D category, and the clear favorite for me is X2D

Same here. As Gordon rightly pointed out, it might become everything one wished for, it is just not quite there yet. I'll keep my A7RV for ultimate AF, X2D for the IQ and Q3 for portability. Unfortunately, the SL3 has (as per today) an underwhelming AF and tracking capabilities in order to replace my Sony.

[Stuart Richardson]

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10 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

Why would one do that? Instead of metering off correctly? Really curious about the need, as I can’t imagine needing this.

Because it shows base level sensor noise and characteristics and highlight recovery. Basically showing you what comes up in extreme processing. Generally the things that are not am everyday occurance, but can be useful/problematic at times. No one would do this as a normal shooting practice, but you can get into situations where you need a lot of recovery. 

Edited March 10, 2024 by Stuart Richardson

[Chaemono]

vor 12 Minuten schrieb Olaf_ZG:

Why would one do that? Instead of metering off correctly? Really curious about the need, as I can’t imagine needing this.

There are some correctly metered sample pictures here https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-tzdLng SL2 vs. mostly α7R III where exposure needed to be increased by 2.8, shadows by 100, and highlights pulled back by 100. The Sony ISO 100 pictures get this over-the-top HDR look whereas the SL2 pictures look really nice. Maybe I was pushing it when I asked for 5 stops of exposure adjustment.

Edited March 10, 2024 by Chaemono

[jonoslack]

6 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Thank you for the very helpful review Jono! I had my hands on the SL3 in London for just a moment, and perhaps because of several years with the SL2 in my hand, it felt like a change...unfortunately for me, a not so welcome one. I will note that I had the opposite impression when switching from the SL to the SL2. That felt immediately like an improvement. I recognize that you overcame most of your grumpy reactions after some time. I think that is all well and good, but I do think it is worth noting that you were given this camera for testing. It takes a special kind of Leica lover (or maybe Leica truster?) to swap out a camera for one where the initial few weeks of impressions are negative. I am sympathetic to the people who worked on this camera. I am sure that their level of professionalism and skill are far greater than anything I have ever exhibited. I am less willing to let Leica off the hook as a whole. They had their most profitable year in history this year, and their recent launches have been seemingly full of glitches, bugs and features that seem to land flat with customers. This is combined with the absolutely abysmal service times which have plagued the company for years.

Leica has not convinced me with this camera. Here are some reasons that go beyond the spec sheet alone:

1. The power switch is a strange choice and a huge downgrade for me. The antithesis of their corporate philosophy of das Wesentliche. It went from a simple, tactile and binary switch to one that has no tactile impression and requires active thought (mental counting to do the right action) rather than muscle memory or instinct. My sense is that the light was added not only for functionality (charging?) but because it was much harder to find the button in the dark. As someone in the great north who is in gloves most of the year, this also looks like a step backward from the extremely well thought out and ergonomic design trend that Leica initiated with the S2. I think it is quite telling that you do not see a lot of other cameras going this route...there is a reason.

 

Hi There Stuart

I hope you're flourishing, nice to hear from you

Your response is so similar to my initial response that I thought that I'd bite

So - the power switch drove me crazy - but I realise now that it's actually rather clever and useful. . . . and it works well with gloves on too. The point being that a short tap puts the camera to sleep - you normally wake it by a short press of the shutter - wake up time is very fast.

This is good - as it reduces power consumption whilst still allowing the camera to remain connected to Fotos (so the GPS will remain accurate for instance). A long press will shut the camera down

The light is good as it can be different colours (green charging - red look for message) etc. etc. 

My only criticism of it is that more could be done with it

 

6 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

 

2. The smaller body felt cramped to me and less well balanced than the SL2. I also think the design itself is significantly less attractive as an object. Laugh as some might, I would like to enjoy look of the camera as well, and the design is noticeable busier and less attractive, given the bulky rear screen, odd timecode port and an additional left side top dial that is disproportionate to the space available at that side of the camera. The camera is also shorter and fatter. Something which I can say with experience is not the way to win over too many suitors.

 

Well, I really like the fatter body and grip - it means that my index finger doesn't bang against the body of the camera. I also like the design better than the SL2 (not as much as the SL1 however). I'm with you on the timecode port and the rear screen - but not with the extra dial, which balances the look (I think) even if it's an unnecessary addition (I still don't use it much).

 

6 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

 

3. The new icons and interface are to me at least, less legible and visually distinct. Just tiny things...like the drive mode icon is no longer a perfect rectangle, it is more square and has rounded corners. I know this is nitpicky, but I think it is more difficult to read and less distinct in use. I fear they are going the Apple route of endlessly tweaking for the sake of tweaking, rather than realizing that they had already perfected it. The SL2/S had black bars behind the icons and they were clear and distinct, easily legible. The SL3 has gone transparent, which may be nice for immersiveness, but it is at the expense of legibility.  I am not sure if it is possible to turn off the rotation of the interface on portrait mode. If not, I hope they implement it in firmware. Count me out. It makes me miss the actual physical information bar on the R9 and S cameras. This was the area I had hoped most for customization: to be able to deselect some of the information on the viewfinder while shooting. There are basically three choices: No information at all, a little too much information and information overload. I would love to turn off some of those icons, such as for wifi and bluetooth connection, flash curtain, DNG/JPG selection and style etc. I just want the bottom bar with the mode, ISO, aperture, shutter speed, and ev compensation. The rest is less important for me. I realize that everyone has their own taste here, but that is why I think the customization would be nice.

 

Nobody likes new software - I've been writing it for 40 years, and radical interface updates are ALWAYS met with irritation and dismay - even if they're inspired! I still have my SL2, and going back to it the interface seems both less functional and less attractive. The fact that you can change the functions on the quick screen is really valuable - and that you can save those to different user profiles is even more valuable. The icons now seem to me to be a great simplification and a definite improvement - and I think they look better. 

The rotation of the icons and the base information in portrait mode starts to become really useful.

You can configure what you see fairly thoroughly, and if you have one of the info profiles clear, then when you half press the shutter you get exactly what you want: ISO, aperture, shutter speed and EV compensation 

 

 

6 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

 

Anyway, I have already gone on too long. I think my main impression has been "wait, why did they do this?" "oh no!! I loved that!" and "really? 5 years and this is what they came up with?". I am indeed a grumpy old(ish) man, but it is hard for me to get excited about this camera at all. In fact it does the opposite...fills me with fear for what direction Leica might be headed to after this.

Well Stuart - I understand your response only too well, and the garden isn't all rosy - but it took me several months to really come to grips with the camera, and especially the interface, but now I'm certain that it's an improvement - and I'm pretty sure that 2 of your 3 grievances are actually mistaken, and that the other one would at least be neutralised with time. 

Which doesn't mean the camera is worth the upgrade necessarily . . . . . . . . but I'm sure that your problems are the inevitable responses to someone daring to be visionary about refreshing an interface. 

All the best

Jono

 

[jonoslack]

Hi There - interesting stuff - a couple of points

1 hour ago, Photoworks said:

I am doing some comparison testing between SL2 and SL3

I have noticed a few points that surprised me.

1. Same framing, same POV on a tripod, the SL2 has a wider view 😳
2. The noise levels of ISO 4000-3200 and 25000-25000 are so close to the 2 cameras that there is no need to upgrade for that.

I did lots of comparisons - it's slightly complicated by the change in resolution, but when that was corrected for I thought that the SL3 had about a 1 stop advantage, whether that's worth upgrading for is entirely moot!

1 hour ago, Photoworks said:

 

1. The SL3 menu is still a little confusing to me, but there is  less need to create profiles, icons on the side are not great to use, I would imagine ever harder with gloves 
2. Customizing the quick menu is not sticky, you have to save it into a profile, but you need to apply the changes to every profile because they go away. I have little use for DNG resolution since i will most likely use always 60MP, i like to use it for profiles, since the side icons require "FN FN touch hold and then swipe select, FN again to hide side icons"

Here I think you have misunderstood the concept - which I now think is brilliant.

Everything that can be adjusted can be saved into a profile. That's why if you change something it isn't sticky - so although there might be less use for profiles, the profiles themselves have become really useful - being able to have a different set of quick screen options for different Scenarios is really fantastic. The Capture Assistant allows you to decide what you want in the information and you can switch on/off different setups for different user profiles. So you might have a preset for Architecture which defaults to showing the gridlines, and another one for Monochrome which shows nothing but the monochrome image. 

So unlike the Sony or pretty much any other camera where some things can be saved to a profile and some things can't, with the SL3 everything is, and it might be a pain changing it an all the profiles if you decide you would like something different globally, but it only takes a couple of minutes, and if you've set up the profiles then normally you'll find a mind change will be appropriate for one or two profiles but not all of them. 

The Leica Design group in Munich had a beta of this interface (which ran on a computer) a couple of years ago, and I disapproved then . . . and really until I sat down in Wetzlar and talked about it with them last month I was still not convinced, but now I think it's inspired.

best

Jono

 

 

[Stuart Richardson]

Thank you for taking the time to respond so thoughtfully and thoroughly. I hope I have the same trajectory as you have. At least for the moment I suspect it will not be with the SL3, but whatever the next generation comes for the S or SL. Most of this is because I love the SL2 so much that I cannot really think of any particular areas where it is letting me down. At least to my mind, Leica set the bar so high that they could not even clear it themselves. But I am glad that you feel that I am mistaken and I hope that the people that buy the SL3 are equally as satisfied.

 

P.S. You really don't want to know when last I updated most of my software...

Edited March 10, 2024 by Stuart Richardson

[jonoslack]

7 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Thank you for taking the time to respond so thoughtfully and thoroughly. I hope I have the same trajectory as you have. At least for the moment I suspect it will not be with the SL3, but whatever the next generation comes for the S or SL. Most of this is because I love the SL2 so much that I cannot really think of any particular areas where it is letting me down. At least to my mind, Leica set the bar so high that they could not even clear it themselves. But I am glad that you feel that I am mistaken and I hope that the people that buy the SL3 are equally as satisfied.

 

P.S. You really don't want to know when last I updated most of my software...

😂

Well Stuart - having been so careful describing my epiphany with the SL3 I couldn't leave your initial response (so much like mine) to stand unchallenged!

But I do agree that if the SL2 is doing the job, then the argument for upgrading is quite difficult to sustain!

All the best

[SrMi]

5 hours ago, Jeff S said:

I think some have mentioned that the printed manual is included this time, unless I misunderstood.

Jeff

Yes, it is included.

[SrMi]

7 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

1. The power switch is a strange choice and a huge downgrade for me. The antithesis of their corporate philosophy of das Wesentliche. It went from a simple, tactile and binary switch to one that has no tactile impression and requires active thought (mental counting to do the right action) rather than muscle memory or instinct. My sense is that the light was added not only for functionality (charging?) but because it was much harder to find the button in the dark. As someone in the great north who is in gloves most of the year, this also looks like a step backward from the extremely well thought out and ergonomic design trend that Leica initiated with the S2. I think it is quite telling that you do not see a lot of other cameras going this route...there is a reason.

I have always found the power switch on SL2 to be the worst ergonomic element of the camera. I like the power switch on X2D and SL3. It has the advantage of quickly putting the camera to sleep, though that is more important with X2D. Both X2D and Leica are famous for their simplicity, and that switch still embodies it.

I never looked for the location of the power button on SL3; it is tactile and in a good location. Therefore, I do not think the light is there for anything but an optional status display (error, charging, on/off).

 

[SrMi]

26 minutes ago, jonoslack said:

The Leica Design group in Munich had a beta of this interface (which ran on a computer) a couple of years ago, and I disapproved then . . . and really until I sat down in Wetzlar and talked about it with them last month I was still not convinced, but now I think it's inspired.

I also had doubts when testing it, but I am glad Leica implemented it in SL3. The good thing is that Leica listens to its testers and users, but they decide what they believe is the right thing to do. 

[Stuart Richardson]

4 minutes ago, SrMi said:

I have always found the power switch on SL2 to be the worst ergonomic element of the camera. I like the power switch on X2D and SL3. It has the advantage of quickly putting the camera to sleep, though that is more important with X2D. Both X2D and Leica are famous for their simplicity, and that switch still embodies it.

I never looked for the location of the power button on SL3; it is tactile and in a good location. Therefore, I do not think the light is there for anything but an optional status display (error, charging, on/off).

 

Fair enough. I disagree. Moving away from a switch on the shutter dial or a rocker switch is swimming upstream against the flow of nearly all professional camera manufacturers -- Canon, Nikon, Sony, Fuji, Panasonic and up until now, Leica themselves. The ones who do have it seem to be the ones most influenced by consumer electronics design, rather than photography -- Hasselblad, Phase (which have a bit of an excuse, as it is on the back itself) and Leica's new direction. It makes sense to me on the Ricoh as it is such a tiny camera that such a switch would stick out, but for me at least I would much rather have a rocker switch or switch on the shutter button, preferably with as few lights on the camera as possible, and the ability to turn all of them off (as a night photographer I find illuminated switches and buttons do more harm than good...rather than kill my night vision give me controls that can be felt clearly in the dark). I found it easier to use my view camera in the dark than the Panasonic S1, for example.

[Photoworks]

24 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Fair enough. I disagree. Moving away from a switch on the shutter dial or a rocker switch is swimming upstream against the flow of nearly all professional camera manufacturers -- Canon, Nikon, Sony, Fuji, Panasonic and up until now, Leica themselves. The ones who do have it seem to be the ones most influenced by consumer electronics design, rather than photography -- Hasselblad, Phase (which have a bit of an excuse, as it is on the back itself) and Leica's new direction. It makes sense to me on the Ricoh as it is such a tiny camera that such a switch would stick out, but for me at least I would much rather have a rocker switch or switch on the shutter button, preferably with as few lights on the camera as possible, and the ability to turn all of them off (as a night photographer I find illuminated switches and buttons do more harm than good...rather than kill my night vision give me controls that can be felt clearly in the dark). I found it easier to use my view camera in the dark than the Panasonic S1, for example.

well, it is good for you to have so many other choices.

The functionality of the new switch is good and can be used in all different modes, and you don't have to take your gloves off when doing it.
and the implementation is intended to expand to other functions you may have not been taught about.

[tom0511]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb adrianh:

Same here. As Gordon rightly pointed out, it might become everything one wished for, it is just not quite there yet. I'll keep my A7RV for ultimate AF, X2D for the IQ and Q3 for portability. Unfortunately, the SL3 has (as per today) an underwhelming AF and tracking capabilities in order to replace my Sony.

I also keep my Canon for action but sold my X2d and lenses. For my needs I rather give up a little IQ of the x2d but therefore have the flexibility and speed of the SL-system. The SL-system might not be as fast as the Sony or IQ like the x2d, but it is a great all-round system with very good IQ for 35mm sensor.

What I didn't like too much about the x2d were the blackout when taking an image and the on/off button  .

[lencap]

I believe that the power switch is also accessible through the new Leica App.  When you tether the app to the camera you also gain the ability to turn it on and off through the app.  That isn't possible with a physical switch.  It also allows for future features to be created that can use the on/off switch in new ways.  Perhaps time lapse photography, turning on or shutting down after a pre-determined time/number of shots?  

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Hallo,

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[tom0511]

vor 7 Minuten schrieb lencap:

I believe that the power switch is also accessible through the new Leica App.  When you tether the app to the camera you also gain the ability to turn it on and off through the app.  That isn't possible with a physical switch.  It also allows for future features to be created that can use the on/off switch in new ways.  Perhaps time lapse photography, turning on or shutting down after a pre-determined time/number of shots?  

With the Hassy switch you never knew if the camera is on/off or in sleep mode. This was kind of confusing to me. With the Leica SL3 you see at least what's going on, even if I am not sure if I would like that light in each situation.

Personally I prefer a mechanical switch, where I see and know what I just did. Ok, you don't see, if it is in sleep mode and you can't set it to sleep mode. But usually you set a time anyways for the camera going to sleep. I usually choose 5 or 10 minutes. Anyways, for me the new switch is not the point to buy or to not buy the camera.