Is this leica III nickel or chrome?

[mingaun]

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Hello, I am interested in this camera. Can anyone tell me if the knobs and dial is in chrome or nickel? Is there any way to tell if this is original or was it repainted etc. I am very new to all this and would appreciate if someone can help share more information about this camera. I currently own a leica M3 and was looking for something smaller. Like the black paint and nickel parts but some of the cameras I see dont seem to be very nickel like. Not yellowish enough. They almost look like chrome. Any advise is much appreciated, Thank you.

 

Best regards,

Mark Lim

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[romanus53]

Hi Mark, hard to tell from a picture as white-balance can be off. Looking at the serial number the camera is build 1933 and should have nickel knobs. black ones with chrome are rare, if original the serial number must be higher and price too. When black cameras needed a repair chrome parts were used when things had to be changed. the screws in the assessory shoe are corroded, if one wants to restore the camera that would be the first parts swaped. price isn't that cheap but serveced (by Youxin Ye ?, ask him)

[nitroplait]

Black looks original to my eyes. The shutter and collar looks chrome, but the rest looks nickel.

And, I agree with @romanus53 if serviced by YYE, then ask him - he should know.

 

[qqphot]

1 hour ago, nitroplait said:

Black looks original to my eyes. The shutter and collar looks chrome, but the rest looks nickel.

And, I agree with @romanus53 if serviced by YYE, then ask him - he should know.

 

For what it's worth, I once asked him for details about a IIIf he'd serviced that was for sale at Leica Store San Francisco, and he became very incensed and wouldn't answer anything about it saying he doesn't keep records of cameras he's worked on and why would he remember a camera he CLA'd a year ago and a bunch of other things, but at any rate I got the impression that the inquiry was very unwelcome. So if you do this, maybe be very diplomatic and prepare for an earful.

Edited August 11, 2023 by qqphot

[spydrxx]

I'd send a message to the seller asking for a picture of Youxin's invoice, which should confirm exactly what work was done (at least the invoices I've gotten from him on my cameras did).

[nitroplait]

 

1 minute ago, spydrxx said:

I'd send a message to the seller asking for a picture of Youxin's invoice, which should confirm exactly what work was done (at least the invoices I've gotten from him on my cameras did).

That is a must for any claim of a CLA. If there os no paperwork then it didn’t happen.

however OP is asking about something else.

[nitroplait]

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1 hour ago, qqphot said:

For what it's worth, I once asked him for details about a IIIf he'd serviced that was for sale at Leica Store San Francisco, and he became very incensed and wouldn't answer anything about it saying he doesn't keep records of cameras he's worked on and why would he remember a camera he CLA'd a year ago and a bunch of other things, but at any rate I got the impression that the inquiry was very unwelcome. So if you do this, maybe be very diplomatic and prepare for an earful.

It is certainly not his responsibility to comment on authenticity or collectability of his repairs, but with a friendly request and a link to the actual camera one could hope he would comment. It is only 2 months ago after all.

[pedaes]

3 hours ago, mingaun said:

very new to all

I would stick with reputable and knowledgeable dealers until you have some experience, Try https://www.reddotcameras.co.uk or https://www.peterloy.com both of whom give very fair appraisals and will not mis-describe a camera.

That said, this looks like a reputable seller.

Edited August 11, 2023 by pedaes

[qqphot]

3 hours ago, nitroplait said:

It is certainly not his responsibility to comment on authenticity or collectability of his repairs, but with a friendly request and a link to the actual camera one could hope he would comment. It is only 2 months ago after all.

I'm not sure if i touched a nerve or something, I didn't mean any offense. I just thought it would be useful to share my anecdotal experience with just such a friendly request, in case it might help someone else set expectations for their attempt. 

[mingaun]

Thank you all for your comments. I think I might ask the seller for the CLA paperwork just in case. The reason why I am keen on this camera is because it has been serviced. Dont want to spend so much money only to find the camera not functioning accurately. I come from Malaysia and I don't know if there is anyone who can repair a Barnack camera.

 

[alan mcfall]

Your camera, 128963 was from production lot 128751 to 129050, 1934, 300 black cameras with nickle hardware. I have not recorded any model 3 black cameras with chrome trim before the lot 215301-215800, 1936. Any changes or modifications after production, I would not know about. There were many solid all chrome cameras between 1933 and 1936, but it seems Leitz delayed using the chrome hardware on the black paint cameras for a couple of years. Perhaps the cost of dual production/inventory finally drove the black paint cameras to use the chrome hardware in 1936-39. There are varrying opinions as to the attractiveness of Black/Nickle vs. Black/Chrome.

[mingaun]

Thank you Alan for your excellent information. I did not know such information was available.

I read from the net that nickel are more 'valued' compared to chrome parts. Is this true? The problem with nickel is that the modern LTM mount lenses are usually silver in color and don't go well with nickel. 

[nitroplait]

1 hour ago, mingaun said:

Thank you Alan for your excellent information. I did not know such information was available.

I read from the net that nickel are more 'valued' compared to chrome parts. Is this true? The problem with nickel is that the modern LTM mount lenses are usually silver in color and don't go well with nickel. 

I rather think it is originality that is valued - as in; a camera in its original condition is more valuable than a subsequently modified camera - even when modified by Leica. 

To my eyes, the linked camera has a mix of nickel and chrome. The shutter button and the collar may have been replaced a some point when nickel part were unavailable - possibly by Leica. With a nickel shutter release it should have a higher value in theory.

Re: modern lenses:

Voigtländer has just released a 28mm f/2.8 in LTM.
The black paint on brass version has nickelled metal parts. It probably doesn't match the worn 90 years old worn nickel and black paint on the Leica, but I guess it is as close as it gets - short of buying lenses of the same vintage as the actual camera.
BTW: I'd hope they make a matching finder.

 

 

[TomB_tx]

Voigtlander has also made two nickel lenses (ltm mount) in 2009 that would look t-right at home on that camera. The 2009 Nickel Voigtlander 50/3.5 Heliar is a collapsible lens that has excellent performance. The 50mm f/2 Nickel Heliar is NOT collapsible, but looks like the Leitz Summar of the 1930s. I have both lenses and use them on my Leica III models as well as on digital M models. They are worth trying to find.

[mingaun]

Thank you all for the lens options.

https://www.dewitcameras.com/product/leica-ic-camera-converted-to-leica-2a/?lang=en

I am also looking at the above camera. My question is this - Is this black paint original because the letters and serial numbers are too clean to be original? Looks like it was newly printed. Can I know what you all think?

 

[Pyrogallol]

Looks ok to me. It would have had a new top when it was upgraded. I don’t think the description of the model is right, 11a, more like a 11f ? Price seems very high. Nowadays it would be worth more if it had not been upgraded.

Edited August 13, 2023 by Pyrogallol

[jerzy]

camera is genuine Leica, converted after 1954 and it is IIa syn. The owner received completly new camera with original serial. As a collector item not that interesting than if it would have been still IA but for the user it is, with a lot of improvements that were not existing in IA. And red scale Elmar (most probably withour serial number) has been completly renewed during conversion.

[mingaun]

I wrote to them about the lens' serial number. She said they cannot find it on the lens. What am I supposed to make out of this?

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[nitroplait]

7 minutes ago, mingaun said:

I wrote to them about the lens' serial number. She said they cannot find it on the lens. What am I supposed to make out of this?

As Jerzy notes above, It should not have a serial number as the lens on a IA wouldn’t have a serial number.

[mingaun]

I see. Thanks again for all the info. Good stuff.