Thinking of Pairing 85mm prime with 50mm prime instead of 24-70 or 24-90 zoom.

[lencap]

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Greetings!

I recently (2 weeks ago) got the Leica SL2-S camera with the new 50mm f/2.0 ASPH lens bundle.  Very happy with the combo, as I've written in other posts.

I had the original SL 601 with the Leica 24-90 zoom, and sold the combo because of the weight.  Since then I miss the flexibility that the 24-90 zoom provided, as well as the overall quality and enjoyment of the SL platform.  That's why I purchased the new bundle.

Now I'm trying to decide if I want to repurchase the 24-90 zoom, or maybe the 24-70.  I'm a senior and my typical film lens combo for many years was 28-50-85.  The Leica 24-70 and 24-90 zooms are tempting, but the weight issue combined with my preference to use the 50mm lens for most tasks has me wondering if a 85mm prime would be better than lugging the weight of the L mount zoom.  Another thing that bothers me a bit is that the Sigma version of the 24-70 is far less expensive, and, yes, I do realize that the Leica version is different lens with typical Leica quality/construction, but at my age and with my eyesight the benefit of Leica glass isn't always visible to me.  And unlike in the film days, I don't print nearly as often as I should.  Digital has taken over and since selling my M mount Leica film cameras years ago (M-A, M7) I've not shot film except on older Nikon gear (Nikkormat/F3) mostly out of nostalgia.  

The 24-90 felt amazing when I had it, but frankly I found that I left it home quite a bit, largely because of weight.  I also bought an iPhone 14 Pro, and while it's not a Leica or even a dedicated camera, it does a great job of casual shooting, blends seamlessly into the Apple ecosystem and is always with with with no weight or other issues to consider.  I envision using the SL2-S primarily for the joy of shooting, and, truth be told, the enjoyment of ownership.  I've had several other camera brands, but I always seem to come back to Leica.

So, the question: Do I get a 85mm for the few times I'll need that focal length (portraits primarily), and if so, should it be an 85mm Sigma ART or the Sigma DG/DN 90mm Contemporary, Panasonic Lumix 85mm f/1.8, or a Leica L mount 75 or 90 prime?  I expect this to be an occasional use lens, not a primary choice - that's why I'm considering non Leica glass.  I'm not sure how that will work, because I've "drunk the Kool-Aid, and enjoy the Leica gear very much.  Does it make me a better photographer?  No, not really, but it makes me want to shoot, and that's something intangible but real.  The haptics, overall feel and quality are impossible to ignore. 

The Leica Summicron-SL 50mm f/2.0 lens that's bundled with the SL2-S will be my primary lens.  That is my preferred focal length.  I am also wondering if just using the iPhone for those no 50mm focal length shots may be a long term solution without any additional lens.  

With a 28-50-85 kit historically the 50mm is my workhorse over the decades shooting film.  With digital things have changed, and the iPhone's wide angle default lens has been used more frequently.  In fact I bought the original Q years ago because I was using the wide angle perspective.  In the end though, I still prefer the 50 and other than capturing shots in cramped spaces I relied on the 28 very rarely.  In particular I never got the hang of composition and minimizing distortion with the 28.

Thanks for being patient as I ramble on with my thoughts, but I'm honestly unsure about what to do.  From my perspective the Leica bundle with the 50mm will take care of the vast majority of my intended needs, but there will be times that I will likely take out my iPhone for a wide/telephoto shot and wonder why I'm not shooting with the Leica.  Then again, spending $2-4K (near mint used prices) for a Leica zoom, along with the weight and bother of changing lenses is why I wonder if using the 50mm and calling it a day is the best solution.

PS: I moved to the SL platform from the M because at my age cataracts and overall vision issues are a constant in my life.  I could no longer get critical sharpness with M lenses, and missed too many shots, especially candids with family.  The SL fixes that, as does the iPhone (sad, but true).

By the way, forum members should charge me for psychological counseling.  I find the answers to my posts informative, friendly, and provocative in changing my thoughts/opinions.  I GREATLY appreciate everyone's help.  Thank you!

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[Olaf_ZG]

Personally I prefer primes over zooms, so I would take a prime. One thing I didn’t get from your story, does it need to be AF or not?

If not, I would suggest the VL nokton75 (i have the 1.5) which renders great and is not too sharp which why I bought it for portraits.

If AF is a must, the Sigma 90dn would do. It is not 1.4, but much lighter and smaller than a 1.4 version.

Or a 2nd SL75, but that would be significant more expensive.

[huwm]

Hi

I vacillate a lot between zoom prime choice too

I have the 24-70 VE which is at my weight limit and I use it less than my primes, better than the Sigma which it replaced it mainly gets to go out when the weather really is appalling

Currently I use new SL 35 ASPH, my preferred focal length most of the time, superseding the Sigma Art and Sigma F2 

Next most used is the Lumix 85 F1.8 superseded the Sigma Art and Sigma 90 F2.8

My 50 is currently the Lumix 50 F1.8 having finally let go of my Sl 50 APO but I may succumb to the ASPH, not sure

My choice is mainly governed by size, aesthetics and weather sealing as tbh all of these lenses have been superb image wise

The Art lenses and APO were a touch better and naturally the APO rather special but were all just too bulky for me to really enjoy using

Honourable mentions to Sigma 45 F2.8 and 65 F2 for my '50' but the weather sealing just not as convincing as the Lumix/Leica 

 

Edited May 6, 2023 by huwm
typo

[dpitt]

If it was me I would not hesitate using an older R or M lens for any FL that I do not use often.
A small 90mm Tele-Elmarit M can produce excellent results when you do not mind using MF. The old Summicron 90 R is one of my favorites on the SL. I use a simple mechanic adapter from URTH to use those old lenses. This was shot with the Summicron 90 R on the SL.

 

Edited May 6, 2023 by dpitt

[huwm]

17 minutes ago, dpitt said:

If it was me I would not hesitate using an older R or M lens for any FL that I do not use often.
A small 90mm Tele-Elmarit M can produce excellent results when you do not mind using MF. The old Summicron 90 R is one of my favorites on the SL. I use a simple mechanic adapter from URTH to use those old lenses. This was shot with the Summicron 90 R on the SL.

 

In good weather for a bit of fun I concur 

40mm summicron(old CL), 50mm 1.4 LTM(urth) Canon and a tatty 90mm Elmar most used and easy to focus with the SL2S

[lencap]

I’m leaning toward L mount lenses, preferring the option of autofocus.  

[Boojay]

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2 hours ago, lencap said:

I’m leaning toward L mount lenses, preferring the option of autofocus.  

We are almost spoilt for choice now, amazing given the relatively short timeframe for l mount.   I have several of the Sigma Contemporary i series primes including the 90mm you ask about, it is a really nice lens in a small package, I was also recently gifted the 85mm Pan 1.8 don't think you'd be disappointed with either given the description of your needs.

Just to add to your confusion, have you considered the Sigma 28-70 2.8 zoom, smaller and lighter than the Art 24-70, @hofo100 shares some wonderful images using it, or maybe the Panasonic 24-105 f/4 giving you image stabilisation and some macro capability, it was the zoom I settled on and I've always been happy with results and preferred having the 70-105mm f/4 to the faster lens.  

Happy shopping😊.

 

[tangosix]

I switched from the M system for the same reasons ... manual focus and critical focus versus my eyesight. 

In my journey and classes in Los Angeles, more than a few accomplished men constantly say how the 24-70 is their favorite lens for usefulness.  That will be my choice for a variable lens. 

I am a prime guy however and love shooting at f2 or below, so I have been exploring primes. 

I use the 50 the most for work product type images.  However, my biggest discovery has been how useful the sl75apo is.  It is a stunner for people images.  The sl75 is possible my favorite lens. 

[Simone_DF]

I think the Pana 85mm is the obvious choice here, given you already have the Panaleica 50mm. 
The 85 has the the same size and filter thread, it’s slightly lighter, and most likely has a rendering more similar to your 50. 
 

The Sigma 90mm is smaller, but also 2.8. 
Basically, pick your poison, but you cannot go wrong in either case. 

[Sohail]

How about getting a Leica CL? The 50mm gets to double as an 85mm. 

[lencap]

I'd rather keep to only one platform - the SL, although the CL is a good alternative.  Still don't know why they stopped supporting it.

[tom0511]

I still own it and its a nice lens but somewhat over my comfort zone...the 2890. I now most often use primes (35 or 50) with my sl2s. If not I prefer the 2470 over the 2490 because of its smaller size. Theoretically the 2490 might be the better lens and goes to 90 which is an advantage. I liked it at the beginning but have used it less and less.

 

[keeping_a_balance]

I have the ART 85 and love the lense, not too heavy, but heavy enough I would think twice before taking it out all day.  I also have the i series 90mm dgdn, which is nice and much smaller and lighter and cheaper and since like you I am more a 35-50mm shooter I tend to take the 90mm as a just in case for the obvious reasons.  It's not as you say Leica so there is something there, but personally between the ART and the i series - I would go i series, the aperture control ring and nice build quality are fantastic in my opion and closest to Leica... Pana feels plasticy and cheap - looks it too - but the images are great, at least on the 50mm 1.8...

Would sway away from the 24-70 Leica as it is heavy and you will leave it at home even though much lighter than the 24-90.  

good luck

[lencap]

Thanks again for the comments and suggestions.  I’ve been considering the 85, but I’m going slowly.  The 50 is still my primary tool.  I noticed that there are several Panasonic Lumix S 20-60 zoom lenses offered on eBay by people selling them as part of a dismantled kit purchase.  Sales seem to be in the $300-$375 range for unused lenses.  

I bid on one yesterday, but it sold for a higher price, and I wasn’t convinced that I had to have it.  At the discounted price it seems worth considering, but my wide angle shooting is really limited - mostly for people shots with limited space and framing.  
 
And, as noted, the feel/haptics of Leica gear is at a different level from most other brands.  I love how the SL2-S/50mm kit lens feels and operates.  It makes me want to shoot.  Not sure the Lumix lens  will get much use, and clearly won’t give me the same haptic experience.

Does anyone have experience with the Lumix 20-60 zoom?

Edited May 16, 2023 by lencap

[BernardC]

1 hour ago, lencap said:

Does anyone have experience with the Lumix 20-60 zoom?

It's a great little zoom, excellent value for money. I use it as a "walk around" lens when I don't want to carry a heavy kit. You shouldn't expect it to feel, like a Leica zoom that sells for much more money, but it is quite a bit better than any other kit zoom that I've used in the past.

[huwm]

4 hours ago, BernardC said:

It's a great little zoom, excellent value for money. I use it as a "walk around" lens when I don't want to carry a heavy kit. You shouldn't expect it to feel, like a Leica zoom that sells for much more money, but it is quite a bit better than any other kit zoom that I've used in the past.

Agree

Have just bought it again, for just £180, for when I don't want the weight of the 24-70 Leica(sigma)

[Tailwagger]

Funny, I'm going the other way.  My initial kit was the 16-35 (Lumix), 35 and 75 APOs.  After a four years with the system it is abundantly clear to me (after about a year in) why Leica introduced the SL with a family of zooms and a single prime.  The primes are epic, no doubt, but carrying more than two of them is cumbersome.  And as my primary kit is an M, I have no psychological need to shoot primes on the SL except in special circumstance.  So while I intend to keep the pair of crons, I finally acted on this and after a multi year debate over which of the standard range zooms to grab, I finally picked up a lightly used 24-90. Of them all, it seems to be the most magical.  As for the weight, there's virtually no difference on the shoulder between the SL2 with 24-90 vs the M with WATE, 28 and 50 'luxes.  More to the point, the day I'm more worried about carrying 3.5 vs. 4.5 lbs over lens character, is the day I pack it in.  

[lencap]

I decided to buy the lens from a highly rated eBay seller.  It was a dismantled kit, never used.  Price a bit high, but the seller has over 7,770 sales, all without a single complaint.  Peace of mind is worth a few dollars more, so I bought it.  It gives me lots of wide angle options, as well as a 50mm option.  Even if it's used occasionally seems versatile, and reviewers seem to appreciate the image quality.

Still, I expect the Leica kit 50mm ASPH will be my workhorse, everyday lens.

Thanks to all for the help/comments/suggestions.

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