New S3 owner

[John McMaster]

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45mm (35mm in FF terms) and 180mm (135mm in FF) + elpro......

john

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The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[davidmknoble]

I just picked up a 100 f/2 with Germany CLA and no lens hood.  I understand this lens hood is no longer in production, so I found two new / old stock and bought them both.

I do really love the color on this lens and while not as crisp at the edges as the wider primes, stopped down is still great.  I think the Leica S lenses do the best of any Leica lens series at high f/stops.

The other thing I do with some landscape work if the light isn’t changing crazy fast (read sunrise), is to put a phase one opaque square in front of the lens for a given shutter speed / f stop / iso rating.  It works really well in capture one to set the white balance, but with the added benefit of automatically removing dust spots.  It takes time to use, and isn’t for every situation, but even 2,3,4 dust spots are nuts to try and remove manually.  Speeds up editing…

Just another thought to add to the S3 talk.

[Milan_S]

51 minutes ago, davidmknoble said:

I just picked up a 100 f/2 with Germany CLA and no lens hood.  I understand this lens hood is no longer in production, so I found two new / old stock and bought them both.

I do really love the color on this lens and while not as crisp at the edges as the wider primes, stopped down is still great.  I think the Leica S lenses do the best of any Leica lens series at high f/stops.

The other thing I do with some landscape work if the light isn’t changing crazy fast (read sunrise), is to put a phase one opaque square in front of the lens for a given shutter speed / f stop / iso rating.  It works really well in capture one to set the white balance, but with the added benefit of automatically removing dust spots.  It takes time to use, and isn’t for every situation, but even 2,3,4 dust spots are nuts to try and remove manually.  Speeds up editing…

Just another thought to add to the S3 talk.

For portraits it's a wonderful lens, although a bit softer compared to the 120mm I have both and I think I prefer the 120mm for more crisp sharpness / contrast and the 100mm more for a softer dreamy look. The 100mm will be a classic a legendary lens imho and I feel it's often overlooked by even SL users...

[ynp]

1 minute ago, Milan_S said:

The 100mm will be a classic a legendary lens imho and I feel it's often overlooked by even SL users.

+1.

The 100mm is unique in the S line. 

[Stuart Richardson]

22 hours ago, davidmknoble said:

 

I do really love the color on this lens and while not as crisp at the edges as the wider primes, stopped down is still great.  I think the Leica S lenses do the best of any Leica lens series at high f/stops.

 

Do you think this could be just the comparatively larger sensor? My feeling is that the larger sensor format means that diffraction is not visible until f11 for f13, whereas it is visible already at f8 on the SL2. I do find the SL summicrons to be sharper than the S lenses, even stopped down, but if they were both stopped down to f16, I suspect the S lens file would be sharper, but not because of the lens, but because of diffraction. The given reproduction ratio of the sensor is lower at any equal magnification since the sensor is twice the size of 35mm.

[davidmknoble]

16 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Do you think this could be just the comparatively larger sensor?

Good question Stuart. I recently (last 3-4 months) started playing with 120mm film on a hasselblad, 1980’s equipment a little 1990’s. What I saw right away was high f/stops looked fantastic (landscape work).  I re-read for the 3rd or 4th time some Ansel Adams works, including Negative.  He talked about using f/32 on some of his 8x10 work, but the lenses go up higher in f/stop. 

I’m not sure if it is the sensor size, or if it is a larger diameter lens, so smaller f/stops can be made and controlled.  I don’t pretend to know the science behind it, but on both the S lenses and the Hasselblad CF lenses, high f/stops seem to have more contrast than equivalent f/stops on my M system. 

Had not thought of comparing it to the APO 50/35 on the SL system, but I have the SL2-S and the smaller sensor, comparatively, may be different.

[BernardC]

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9 hours ago, davidmknoble said:

I’m not sure if it is the sensor size, or if it is a larger diameter lens, so smaller f/stops can be made and controlled.

It's the magnification. Diffraction has a size, based on wavelength. Having a bigger sensor/film means that you won't magnify the diffraction as much for a given print size.

[mgrayson3]

6 hours ago, BernardC said:

It's the magnification. Diffraction has a size, based on wavelength. Having a bigger sensor/film means that you won't magnify the diffraction as much for a given print size.

Which is why 8x10 film can be shot at f/64.

 

[djmay]

I have never seen the effects of diffraction in any of my prints; this includes 35mm, medium format and large format film as well as FF and medium format digital. 

[BernardC]

5 hours ago, djmay said:

I have never seen the effects of diffraction in any of my prints; this includes 35mm, medium format and large format film as well as FF and medium format digital. 

People worry too much about diffraction on photo forums. Photography isn't about resolution, it's just one characteristic that you can sometimes use to convey your narrative. Also, no one ever sees the full resolution of your images, outside of large prints in a (well-lit) gallery setting. Even then they may not care to put their noses up against the glass.

 

[Stuart Richardson]

Diffraction can and does make a difference in print sharpness. But as Bernard says, it tends to not be visible until larger sizes. But even if it does not cut into visible detail in smaller prints, it diminishes micro contrast, so your prints can be be less crisp depending on the degree to which you are stopping down. I also have to disagree with Bernard about people not seeing the full resolution of your images. With a good printer, the printer can max out the resolution of the print at more modest sizes than you might think, particularly with lower resolution cameras like 24mp or below...especially in APS-C. 24mp at 300dpi is around 34x51cm (13x20), and most printers can print at 600-720dpi if the file has enough resolution. For 24mp, the printer's resolution maxes out at 6.7x10 inches. Anything bigger is interpolation. 300dpi is a better guideline for clearly visible degradation, but it is still somewhat modest in size. And of course that assumes no cropping whatsoever or changing of the aspect ratio. In my experience both as a printer and exhibiting, I have found that a lot of people do indeed look closely at prints. They start out from farther away to look at the whole print, and then they come in for a closer look at certain areas of detail they are interested in. People are not going to dismiss a print because it is on the softer side, but you do wind up in a scenario where these differences are visible.

 

I remember I had to do a print job once for an advertising shooter using a Hasselblad digital back. I think it was around the 39mp era. I was struck because he had done artwork reproduction of a painting/piece that had some three dimensional features. I remember specifically that he had shot it at f32, which was baffling to me. The files were very soft to the extent that it largely invalidated using what at the time was such an extremely expensive camera. Things are going to be a trade off, but with great lenses like those from Leica, it is generally best to choose the widest aperture that will fully encompass the things you need to encompass within the depth of field. Most modern Leica lenses I have used seem to reach peak performance between f4 and f5.6, sometimes being even sharper at wide open on center. That is the case with the 35mm APO Summicron SL, which is sharper at f2 all the way to the edges than it is at f5.6. That is assuming a flat scene, however, which most are not.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Stuart Richardson

[shanefking]

On 3/6/2023 at 6:00 AM, BernardC said:

Also, no one ever sees the full resolution of your images, outside of large prints in a (well-lit) gallery setting. Even then they may not care to put their noses up against the glass.

As a pixel-peeper, I’m pressed to disagree

 

8 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

. I remember specifically that he had shot it at f32, which was baffling to me. The files were very soft to the extent that it largely invalidated using what at the time was such an extremely expensive camera.

Wow.. I suspect he was coming from film (like everyone else) and I wouldn’t be surprised if he had more experience shooting large format.  Given the nature of bayer arrays, I suspect that digital is more prone to diffraction than on film.

[Sarnian]

On 2/21/2023 at 3:04 PM, Sarnian said:

Leica have said that the red light on doom is a known issue so it will be repaired under goodwill. Fingers crossed that they don't 'find' anything else wrong with it...

Just got my repair estimate back from Leica. All under Goodwill, thankfully. So, my 007 is now practically as good as new. 👍

A complete service would have cost EUR 878.75 which probably isn't too bad as you get all of the below:-

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[ZHNL]

16 hours ago, Sarnian said:

Just got my repair estimate back from Leica. All under Goodwill, thankfully. So, my 007 is now practically as good as new. 👍

A complete service would have cost EUR 878.75 which probably isn't too bad as you get all of the below:-

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Not everyone as Lucky as you. I send my spare 006 to Leica and get estimation of $3950 with sensor cost. I asked if not replacing sensor, cost will be $1950. Compare the list with yours if we remove sensor replacing cost, I don't see much difference.  

So, in other word, if you think S camera is robust for bump and harsh condition, think twice. Though, I didnt see all these problems during use.

Rubber jacket need to be replaced and eyepiece too for sure.   

Edited March 9, 2023 by ZHNL

[Sarnian]

12 minutes ago, ZHNL said:

I didnt see all these problems during use.

Me neither. I was surprised at how long the list of issues was. Prior to the 'red light of doom' it appeared to be working just fine. 🙈

[BernardC]

Most of that long list is just basic service. Adjust some things, replace wearable items (which I presume the mirror bumpers are). We've discussed before how the armoring needs to come-off for service, so it gets replaced.

It's a no-win situation for Leica. They can either provide an itemized list and have people complain that they did more than necessary, or they can skip the list and have people complain that they didn't do anything.

[davidmknoble]

Sometimes things need adjusted because they were removed to get to other components.  Cars used to be easy to change oil in.  There weren’t all the wires and computers.  Same with M3’s..   Leica does impeccable CLA and repair work.  I for one am glad they still do it!

[helged]

12 hours ago, davidmknoble said:

Sometimes things need adjusted because they were removed to get to other components.  Cars used to be easy to change oil in.  There weren’t all the wires and computers.  Same with M3’s..   Leica does impeccable CLA and repair work.  I for one am glad they still do it!

+1.

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[shanefking]

On 3/9/2023 at 6:06 PM, davidmknoble said:

Sometimes things need adjusted because they were removed to get to other components.  Cars used to be easy to change oil in.  There weren’t all the wires and computers.  Same with M3’s..   Leica does impeccable CLA and repair work.  I for one am glad they still do it!

Great point.  I wonder what a digital camera designed for easy repairability (rather than compactness foremost) might look like

[Pieter12]

20 minutes ago, shanefking said:

Great point.  I wonder what a digital camera designed for easy repairability (rather than compactness foremost) might look like

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