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Chaemono

Chaemono

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vor 7 Stunden schrieb jaapv:

I bet it wouldn’t. Sensors for Leica M cameras are configured for the specific use, as are SL sensors. They cannot be swapped around without impacting image quality"same 

You took "same" literally. Sony Semicon is adapting the IMX455 for the M11 and M11M. They will likely adapt the "same" sensor for the SL3. The IMX410, a version of which is used in the SL2S, could be adapted for an M11S. The Maestro-II processor would suffice (that's what the M10M has). The price point of a 24 MP M11S could be, I'm guessing, 6,500 €, an entry camera into the M system for new users with a modern BSI sensor and a low-light option for existing users who want/need one. It would make the used prices of my M10-P drop precipitously, though.

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jaapv

jaapv

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Yes, but given the same basic quality and technology - after all, most if not all sensor makers use the same ASML printing machines - the real differences between sensors is determined by the microlens/filter stack and subsequent firmware.

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Virob

Virob

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That IMX366 sensor is interesting. It has a very fast read out rate, combined with PDAF could make for a very fast camera unlike anything Leica has produced. If it uses the same technology as the IMX455, we could expect even better high iso performance at 44 vs the IMX410 or IMX455. This could make for a very interesting SL3S.  

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Chaemono

Chaemono

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vor 21 Stunden schrieb Virob:

That IMX366 sensor is interesting. It has a very fast read out rate, combined with PDAF could make for a very fast camera unlike anything Leica has produced. If it uses the same technology as the IMX455, we could expect even better high iso performance at 44 vs the IMX410 or IMX455. This could make for a very interesting SL3S.  

Or for just an SL3 with equal consideration given to video specs. But then there is the dilemma how to cater to photographers, too, especially since the SL lenses are designed with a 100 MP sensor in mind. 

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frame-it

frame-it

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On 6/3/2023 at 4:44 AM, Virob said:

That IMX366 sensor is interesting. It has a very fast read out rate, combined with PDAF could make for a very fast camera unlike anything Leica has produced.

provided Leica uses a more powerful, really fast processor and updates the main board for the faster read/write and other operations etc etc etc ;) cant keep slapping new sensors and stuff onto a possibly older generation board, that's where the speed bottlenecks will occur

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Virob

Virob

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11 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Or for just an SL3 with equal consideration given to video specs. But then there is the dilemma how to cater to photographers, too, especially since the SL lenses are designed with a 100 MP sensor in mind. 

I haven’t found the SL2 wanting in terms of resolution and would be quite content with 44MP. With a faster sensor and some improvements with IBIS, handheld multishot might be possible for higher resolution images, partially compensating for not using a higher res sensor. 
 

5 hours ago, frame-it said:

provided Leica uses a more powerful, really fast processor and updates the main board for the faster read/write and other operations etc etc etc ;) cant keep slapping new sensors and stuff onto a possibly older generation board, that's where the speed bottlenecks will occur

I wasn’t thinking A1 or Z9 faster, just faster then what Leica has put out. Maybe Leica could use 2 Maestro IV processors in the SL3, similar to what Olympus did with the OM1x. You are right though, it isn’t Leica’s strong point but then there is that increased collaboration with Panasonic.

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frame-it

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4 minutes ago, Virob said:

 

I wasn’t thinking A1 or Z9 faster, just faster then what Leica has put out. Maybe Leica could use 2 Maestro IV processors in the SL3, similar to what Olympus did with the OM1x. You are right though, it isn’t Leica’s strong point but then there is that increased collaboration with Panasonic.

why should there be any compromise in 2023-2024? it should be crazy fast. most Leica digital cameras are and still feel under-powered.

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LocalHero1953

LocalHero1953

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I have never found speed of focus a problem with Leica cameras, but always ability to identify the target and keep tracking. With spot/field/zone focus, they move to focus more than fast enough for my needs. This tells me it is better sensory and processing power that is needed, not faster AF motors.

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Geoff C. Bassett

Geoff C. Bassett

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On 6/2/2023 at 12:21 PM, Chaemono said:

You took "same" literally. Sony Semicon is adapting the IMX455 for the M11 and M11M. They will likely adapt the "same" sensor for the SL3. The IMX410, a version of which is used in the SL2S, could be adapted for an M11S. The Maestro-II processor would suffice (that's what the M10M has). The price point of a 24 MP M11S could be, I'm guessing, 6,500 €, an entry camera into the M system for new users with a modern BSI sensor and a low-light option for existing users who want/need one. It would make the used prices of my M10-P drop precipitously, though.

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Hope they go with the IMX455, want to use the SL3 for video and that seems like a very fast sensor and a higher throughput. Have never felt the SL2 files lacked detail, just give me that resolution with the low light performance of the SL2s and I am all set. 

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beewee

beewee

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33 minutes ago, Geoff C. Bassett said:

Hope they go with the IMX455, want to use the SL3 for video and that seems like a very fast sensor and a higher throughput. Have never felt the SL2 files lacked detail, just give me that resolution with the low light performance of the SL2s and I am all set. 

IMX455 has a pretty slow readout compared to most other camera sensors on the market. The jello effect in video is quite apparent on the A7Riv, A7Rv, and Q3, all of which uses some variant of the IMX455.

If Leica were to design the SL3 for high resolution photography and an SL3-S optimized for video, the IMX455 would fit the bill for the SL3 but the choices are more limited for the SL3-S. For low-light, high ISO performance, high burst-rate, fast readout sensors there still isn’t all that many options available. The one in the SL2-S, S5, and the PDAF variant in the S5ii is still probably the best compromise seen to date unless Leica can get their hands on whatever sensor is in the Sony A7iv.

If Leica were to make a no-compromise, price-be-damned, do everything SL3, they would probably go with the sensor in the Sony A1 but that’s assuming Sony would be willing to sell them that sensor. The A1 sensor would also cost a hell of a lot of money which would likely drive up the cost of the SL3 by at least a couple thousand dollars. Probably in the $9-10k USD range, priced similar or slightly higher than the M11 or M11 Monochrome. I don’t know if that many SL system owners would be willing to drop that kind of money for a no-compromise SL3.

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frame-it

frame-it

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36 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

Blabla bla bla. Am I the only one wondering when it will come?

probably 1st quarter of next year, the Type 8262, [a Hybrid Instant camera] is possibly coming first later this year

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