Rainy weekend (2) : guess the 90mm challenge

[Stef63]

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Another rainy day and an opportunity to take some  more indoor shots now with different 90 mm lenses (or 85)

A. Canon EF-L 85 f1.2

B. Leica Vario Elmarit-R 28-90 mm f2.8-4.5

C. Leica Apo Summicron-M f2.0

D. Leica Thambar LTM f2.2

Aperture fixed f4.5 (to accommodate the max aperture of the Vario Elmarit on the long end)

To compensate the slight difference in focal length (i.e. the Vario Elmarit is more a 80 mm than a 90 mm on the long end) I adjusted the distance to the subject rather than cropping.

Focus is on the ruler.  Good luck.

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[Stef63]

And the cropped versions :

 

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[Photoworks]

is it me or A-B-C does not match with 1-2-3...

[Stef63]

The title says, "Guess the 90 mm challenge".  So what lens (letter) is picture 1?  And so on.

[T25UFO]

My best guess:

1 = APO Summicron

2 = Thambar

3 = Canon

4 = Vario Elmarit 

[Hans-Dieter Gülicher]

Little bit sophisticated to evaluate. Provided "your work" was correct I suppose item 4 was the Thambar. Quod erat demonstrandum or quod demonstrandum esse?

Edited January 15, 2023 by Hans-Dieter Gülicher

[Stef63]

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@T25UFO not completely correct, not completely wrong 😀

@Hans-Dieter Gülicher no n°4 is not the Thambar

 

[T25UFO]

10 minutes ago, Stef63 said:

 not completely correct, not completely wrong 😀

Hmm . . . well number 2 definitely looks like the Thambar and I still think number 1 is the APO, so maybe swap 3 and 4 around.

[dpitt]

This is my best guess:

1. B. Leica Vario Elmarit-R 28-90 mm f2.8-4.5
2. D. Leica Thambar LTM f2.2
3. A. Canon EF-L 85 f1.2
4. C. Leica Apo Summicron

 

[dpitt]

@Stef63 I propose that you give all members a day or so to guess before revealing the result...

[Stef63]

@dpitt I'll give it a day !

So do not hesitate to use the 'Like' button if you think another member has the correct sequence. 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2023 by Stef63

[Stef63]

@T25UFO has the correct sequence 👍

1. Leica Apo Summicron-M f2.0
2. Leica Thambar LTM f2.2
3. Leica Vario Elmarit-R 28-90 mm f2.8-4.5
4. Canon EF-L 85 f1.2

Thambar was the easy one, of course.  But I was surprised, the Canon 85 f/1.2 performed really good in this "rainy weekend" snap.  This lens was collecting dust for nearly 13 years (after I made the switch from Canon to Leica).  The Sigma MC-21 adapter will be "my friend" the next weeks.  Looking forward to rediscovering some Canon glass from the past. 

[chris_tribble]

I wasn't surprised by the performance of the Canon 85 1.2.  The series one was my bread and butter portrait lens for a decade.  I never got the mk 2 - apparently AF was a lot faster with this.  I'd be interested to see the performance of the new RF version - a lot lighter apparently, but stellar performance.  However, having bought into SL, I'm also very happy with the SL 35 and 75 apo lens for head shots and contextual portraits, so I won't start messing my head with other systems 🙃

[Stef63]

1 hour ago, chris_tribble said:

I wasn't surprised by the performance of the Canon 85 1.2.  The series one was my bread and butter portrait lens for a decade.  I never got the mk 2 - apparently AF was a lot faster with this.  I'd be interested to see the performance of the new RF version - a lot lighter apparently, but stellar performance.  However, having bought into SL, I'm also very happy with the SL 35 and 75 apo lens for head shots and contextual portraits, so I won't start messing my head with other systems 🙃

Hi Chris, my 85 is the MK 2 version and even on the Sigma adapter the AF is still usable, however not “fast”.  Stepping into the SL2 was a little bit different for me : I wanted longer lenses for my M (longer than 90 mm) and acquired some nice R lenses.  The M platform however is not ideal for long lenses mainly due to the absence of IBIS.  The SL2 was the answer.  And I had a good set of nice Canon EF glass sitting on the shelf accumulating dust.

Very preliminary : the 85 L 1.2 Mk2 is excellent on the SL2 as well as the 135 L 2.0. The 35 L 1.4 and the 70-200 IS L 2.8 Mk2 disappoint compared to equivalent M and R lenses.  

[chris_tribble]

Stefan

This is interesting.  I thought I'd be able to use my Canon glass on SL2, but like you, found the 70-200 unuseable.  Sadly, by then I'd got rid of my 85 1.2.  However, the SL APO lenses are so good, I have no regrets - and combined with the SL zooms (especially the 90-280) I'm  very happy with the SL system.  If I was starting out as a pro and budget was tight, I'd probably do what I did back in the day and stick with Canon - that system never let me down and the 5D4 was always rock solid. But for where I am now, an M10R, Q2 and a couple of SL2s covers every situation I want to cover.

[dpitt]

On 1/16/2023 at 4:46 PM, Stef63 said:

@T25UFO has the correct sequence 👍

1. Leica Apo Summicron-M f2.0
2. Leica Thambar LTM f2.2
3. Leica Vario Elmarit-R 28-90 mm f2.8-4.5
4. Canon EF-L 85 f1.2

Thambar was the easy one, of course.  But I was surprised, the Canon 85 f/1.2 performed really good in this "rainy weekend" snap.  This lens was collecting dust for nearly 13 years (after I made the switch from Canon to Leica).  The Sigma MC-21 adapter will be "my friend" the next weeks.  Looking forward to rediscovering some Canon glass from the past. 

My guess was

1. B. Leica Vario Elmarit-R 28-90 mm f2.8-4.5
2. D. Leica Thambar LTM f2.2
3. A. Canon EF-L 85 f1.2
4. C. Leica Apo Summicron

I liked 1 and 4 the most with slight preference for the 4. So I am surprised I liked the Canon most!
The only lens of this group, that I had once is the Vario 28-90. And I liked it - for a cheap zoom - but never used it indoors. I suppose it will do better when there is plenty of light.

I suspect the fast Canon had an advantage here compared to the medium fast Apo Summicron. Fast lenses seem to shine in low light, even when stopped down.

[Stef63]

1 hour ago, dpitt said:

… - for a cheap zoom - …

Hm, for a cheap zoom in Leica terms, you mean 😀.  This R lens however seems to hold value pretty well.

1 hour ago, dpitt said:

I suspect the fast Canon had an advantage here compared to the medium fast Apo Summicron. Fast lenses seem to shine in low light, even when stopped down.

True.  It was not completely fair to compare a lens like the Vario wide open with a very fast one stopped down.  Of course the Canon outperforms the Vario, and it should, otherwise what could you expect at f/1.2?  And indeed the same applies for the Apo Cron.

This theory of having to step down a lens a little bit to get optimum quality however seems not the case anymore with native SL lenses according to Leica head of lens design Peter Karbe.  

Unfortunately I have no SL lenses to compare.  Would be nice however to do this test. 

[dpitt]

52 minutes ago, Stef63 said:

Hm, for a cheap zoom in Leica terms, you mean 😀.  This R lens however seems to hold value pretty well.

Yes indeed, all is relative. Leica prices too.

54 minutes ago, Stef63 said:

True.  It was not completely fair to compare a lens like the Vario wide open with a very fast one stopped down.  Of course the Canon outperforms the Vario, and it should, otherwise what could you expect at f/1.2?  And indeed the same applies for the Apo Cron.

Indeed, it is hard to compare and I do not mind there was a fast prime in the mix. It was just that I remember it was quite good for a zoom lens. So I think not only shooting it wide open was a disadvantage, but comparing any F4.5 lens with a stopped down F1.2 lens is tricky. My theory is that if you do the same (f4.5) test outdoors the difference in quality will be less, just because of the amount of light available. ( just a theory of mine, because I see similar effects when comparing stopped down Summicron's and Summiluxes and Elmarits for example)
I do not have the optical know how to explain it, but suspect it has something to do with the design and glass needed to make a faster lens, so any faster lens is working more in its comfort zone in low light compared to a slow lens at the same aperture.

Maybe someone with more technical know how can shed more light on this?

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