New Leica M6 Film Camera

[Jimmyp82]

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1 minute ago, oldwino said:

500 cameras will “increase film production and bring down prices”?

well obviously not. but its better than nothing at all, something which Leica could easily do. Film will remain a niche, but anything that can grow that niche will mean film manufacturers are more likely to keep going!

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The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[Huss]

1 hour ago, madNbad said:

Nikon did learn from the Df hype, they now have the ZFc in the lineup. It really is about the size of the FM series. The best thing about the Df was the ability to use legacy lenses, including non-Ai. I had a Df with some Ai-S lenses that had been chipped. Nice camera, great images but it still felt like carrying a bowling ball.

Don’t get me started on the DF…. Ok, you have.  The DF may be able to use legacy lenses but Nikon threw that all away by fitting it with an awful focusing screen that was terrible trying to focus those lenses accurately.  The manual focus in my much older Auto focus F6 is so much better it’s weird that Nikon did not pay attention to this.

and yes, on top of all that it did feel like carrying a bloated plasticky - but looks like metal! - dslr.  The ZFc is very nice but crop sensor, so all those legacy lenses are cropped.  It needs to be FF at the same size, and have a better EVF.

[oldwino]

My feelings about this, if it indeed comes to pass, are summed up by another commenter in the Leica rumors post: "Why do we keep patting Leica on the back for consistently making decisions that don’t benefit photographers?"

500 cameras. For 500 rich persons. #filmisnotdead ? More like #filmisjustanotherlimitededition 

[Danner]

41 minutes ago, Huss said:

Don’t get me started on the DF…. Ok, you have.  The DF may be able to use legacy lenses but Nikon threw that all away by fitting it with an awful focusing screen that was terrible trying to focus those lenses accurately.  The manual focus in my much older Auto focus F6 is so much better it’s weird that Nikon did not pay attention to this.

and yes, on top of all that it did feel like carrying a bloated plasticky - but looks like metal! - dslr.  The ZFc is very nice but crop sensor, so all those legacy lenses are cropped.  It needs to be FF at the same size, and have a better EVF.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.  And mine is that I love both my Df cameras.  I bought the first the day they became available (2012, I think it was), and the second a few years later.  I shoot a wide range of Nikkors from pre-Ai to AF-G lenses.  I own virtually every AF-D Nikkor.  As for the focus screen, I find the focus indicator dot quite effective at achieving precise focus with non-AF lenses, even with my fussy Reflex-Nikkor 500mm.  Ergonomics are great, viewfinder is conformable for eyeglasses wearers, and the controls are convenient as can be.  BTW, the chassis is mostly die-cast magnesium alloy, not plastic.

Edited October 11, 2022 by Danner

[Frase]

16 minutes ago, Danner said:

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.  And mine is that I love both my Df cameras.  I bought the first the day they became available (2012, I think it was), and the second a few years later.  I shoot a wide range of Nikkors from pre-Ai to AF-G lenses.  I own virtually every AF-D Nikkor.  As for the focus screen, I find the focus indicator dot quite effective at achieving precise focus with non-AF lenses, even with my fussy Reflex-Nikkor 500mm.  Ergonomics are great, viewfinder is conformable for eyeglasses wearers, and the controls are convenient as can be.  BTW, the chassis is mostly die-cast magnesium alloy, not plastic.

I had a Df and thought it was a great camera, not as small as film Nikon but much smaller than most high end DSLRs, didn't feel cheap and was a great walk around camera.

[bags27]

There were many rumors that Nikon would upgrade the Df with a larger sensor, etc. I believe the original designer was all for it, but the bosses were facing a cost-cutting environment and nixed it. It's a camera that has always attracted me (if I shot digital). Not only the design (I still love my FE and FE2), but the rendering is wonderfully filmic.

[Huss]

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56 minutes ago, Danner said:

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.  And mine is that I love both my Df cameras.  I bought the first the day they became available (2012, I think it was), and the second a few years later.  I shoot a wide range of Nikkors from pre-Ai to AF-G lenses.  I own virtually every AF-D Nikkor.  As for the focus screen, I find the focus indicator dot quite effective at achieving precise focus with non-AF lenses, even with my fussy Reflex-Nikkor 500mm.  Ergonomics are great, viewfinder is conformable for eyeglasses wearers, and the controls are convenient as can be.  BTW, the chassis is mostly die-cast magnesium alloy, not plastic.

That focus confirmation dot had way too much play for my liking.  It lights up suggesting in focus.  You keep turning the focus ring, it still stays lit.  The D750 had a much better, tighter focus confirmation area, and the D850 was way ahead.  That camera is really good to focus manually, whether using the dot or the actual focus screen.  While the chassis was metal, the skin was so thin and hollow feeling it felt like plastic.  Touch/turn the shutter speed dial on something like a Nikon FM.  Then compare to the DF.  Anyway, glad it’s worked out for you, you’re right we all have differing opinions.

Edited October 11, 2022 by Huss

[madNbad]

After the initial five hundred M6s are sold to collectors in an afternoon, the next step would be bringing them into production. Maybe even a meter less version, M4-3 anyone?

[Huss]

18 minutes ago, madNbad said:

After the initial five hundred M6s are sold to collectors in an afternoon, the next step would be bringing them into production. Maybe even a meter less version, M4-3 anyone?

This reminds me of the menu at taco bell.  Three ingredients, but 30 items.

[madNbad]

3 minutes ago, Huss said:

This reminds me of the menu at taco bell.  Three ingredients, but 30 items.

But you can't get your chalupa in a Herme's bag.

[ianman]

28 minutes ago, madNbad said:

After the initial five hundred M6s are sold to collectors in an afternoon, the next step would be bringing them into production. Maybe even a meter less version, M4-3 anyone?

Or just buy an M-A?

[a.noctilux]

M6, why not if released with brass top ...

Zinc corrosion was real, some examples in this thread

 

[madNbad]

5 minutes ago, ianman said:

Or just buy an M-A?

LocalHero 1953 has a point, this may be a test run for new materials, electronics and production techniques which may mean moving on from the (more expensive to build) MP platform to a new film body. Leica would then have the opportunity to continue to make the all new M6 and much like the M-A, follow up with a meterless version.

[FrozenInTime]

1 minute ago, madNbad said:

LocalHero 1953 has a point, this may be a test run for new materials, electronics and production techniques which may mean moving on from the (more expensive to build) MP platform to a new film body. Leica would then have the opportunity to continue to make the all new M6 and much like the M-A, follow up with a meterless version.

I was thing of something similar : maybe they want to gauge the market reaction to a film camera with the M10 type rangefinder mechanism.

[oldwino]

Leica has the opportunity to upgrade the M film camera, which would be a good thing, possibly (or probably) discontinuing both the MP and M-A in favor of a new model. That may still happen...

But this limited M6 re-hash is just Leica's typical cash-flow generator. They can't bring the same camera (M6) into "regular production" as it would instantly devalue the first 500. 

[Sunyforreal]

5 minutes ago, oldwino said:

Leica has the opportunity to upgrade the M film camera, which would be a good thing, possibly (or probably) discontinuing both the MP and M-A in favor of a new model. That may still happen...

But this limited M6 re-hash is just Leica's typical cash-flow generator. They can't bring the same camera (M6) into "regular production" as it would instantly devalue the first 500. 

…why can’t they? I don’t think Leica is concerned about devaluing cameras they’ve already sold.

[oldwino]

8 minutes ago, Sunyforreal said:

…why can’t they? I don’t think Leica is concerned about devaluing cameras they’ve already sold.

because it would mess up the cash cow. If you start pissing off your richest customers, the ones who want all the "limited" releases, by devaluing their "investment", they will stop buying. 

Leica will rake in 2.4 million euro on the day this M6 thing is released. Why would they want to mess that up?

[smkoush]

5 minutes ago, oldwino said:

because it would mess up the cash cow. If you start pissing off your richest customers, the ones who want all the "limited" releases, by devaluing their "investment", they will stop buying. 

Leica will rake in 2.4 million euro on the day this M6 thing is released. Why would they want to mess that up?

That's what I used to think, but the limited (500) production of a scalloped black chrome 50mm Summilux-M ASPH points to the contrary (it was released as a special 500 only pieces that turned into a constant production alongside the regular version).  

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[oldwino]

2 minutes ago, smkoush said:

That's what I used to think, but the limited (500) production of a scalloped black chrome 50mm Summilux-M ASPH points to the contrary (it was released as a special 500 only pieces that turned into a constant production alongside the regular version).  

Thats the only instance I can think of. I wonder how much blow-back they got from this. 

[Sunyforreal]

2 minutes ago, oldwino said:

because it would mess up the cash cow. If you start pissing off your richest customers, the ones who want all the "limited" releases, by devaluing their "investment", they will stop buying. 

Leica will rake in 2.4 million euro on the day this M6 thing is released. Why would they want to mess that up?

Maybe I’m wrong. But I’ll bring up an example from another German manufacturer with a similar clientele:

When Porsche released the 991.1 GT3, there were many many people who were upset because Andreas Preuninger and the GT team decided to omit the manual transmission. So naturally Porsche took that as an opportunity and a few years later released the 911R which was basically a GT3 with a manual. They made a limited run of 991 units, and collectors scooped them up at MSRP and they immediately doubled or even tripled in value. To make a very long story short, Porsche saw another opportunity, and released what was basically a better version of the 911R in the 991.2 GT3 with an optional manual transmission. Non-limited model. Of course speculators, collectors and other yuppies were pissed. But Porsche sure doesn’t seem to have an issue selling GT3’s, then or now.

I know cars are a pretty different market than cameras, but Leica people and Porsche people are probably more similar than they are different. And I’d like to think Leica would have the same legendary German response that Porsche would and screw the collectors over. It certainly would make me happy.