New Leica M6 Film Camera

[madNbad]

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1 minute ago, Huss said:

It just doesn't make any sense to me that the supplier of the all new M6 parts couldn’t just make parts for the MP.

The five hundred M6s could be a test run for new materials and production changes. Plus cash in on the hot M6 market too.

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[hdmesa]

1 minute ago, 250swb said:

How many parts for the MP are still hard to get given it’s still on sale relative to dealer supply issues? The internals of the ‘new’ M6 are not the same as the old M6, thankfully, so they are ‘brand new’ by definition. But this is based on the MP and was first hinted at in 2002.

I'm confused as to what you're asking me, but in any case I have no idea. I'm just reading reviews and listening to what Leica is saying today.

[hdmesa]

Just now, madNbad said:

The five hundred M6s could be a test run for new materials and production changes. Plus cash in on the hot M6 market too.

There is no "500". The new M6 is not limited nor being first made in a batch of 500 – unless you have a source on that.

[Matlock]

4 minutes ago, madNbad said:

Zinc oxidation happens more often on the TTL cameras. I had an e. arly production TTL that developed a sprinkling of bubbles across the top plate. It was my only camera at the time, always stored properly and I was quite surprised to see them.

As I said, I know that it does occur but very rarely. I have a TTL and it shows no evidence. Zinc is fine providing that the plating is carried out correctly and no series damage to that plating occurs. It is only if moisture creeps into the zinc that the problem rears it's ugly head and, of course, this can be influenced by humidity if there is the slightest flaw in the plating. 

[jsrockit]

9 minutes ago, Huss said:

It just doesn't make any sense to me that the supplier of the all new M6 parts couldn’t just make parts for the MP.

What makes you think Leica isn't doing exactly that for the MP?  They can make the MP, M-A and M6 at the same time no?  

[250swb]

Just now, hdmesa said:

I'm confused as to what you're asking me, but in any case I have no idea. I'm just reading reviews and listening to what Leica is saying today.

You maybe forget taking issue telling me all the parts were new for the new M6.  I was  just explaining to you that yes they are new for a new M6, but based on the MP.

 

[Crem]

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29 minutes ago, Huss said:

Is ‘as I understand it’ a definitive statement, or an assumption.  Because what I do not understand is which parts for the MP are now hard to get?  And why?  And if so, why are parts for the new M6 not hard to get?  Who is making those new M6 parts who could not make the MP parts?
 

It either sounds like a marketing ploy to make it seem like it is a new camera.  Or if it is a new camera, something that I would avoid for a few years to let others be the beta testers.

I definitely get your point and I haven't seen a teardown of the new M6.  I can't speak for mechanical component availability. In terms of the electronics, the new M6 is a perfect time to redesign the circuit boards and make sure they can acquire the individual board components for the next 10+ years. The MP board is an old design at this point. I really would expect Leica to update it. It only takes one key component to go out of production to end up having to do a board redesign. There is also a lot of opportunity to miniaturize or simplify it optimize the assembly process.

This should give you an example of the individual electrical components in the old M6: https://www.dagcamera.com/store/p166/Leica_M6-_Classic-_No_More_Main_Circuit_Boards.html

Edited October 20, 2022 by Crem

[Anbaric]

27 minutes ago, Matlock said:

Whilst I agree with your general points I have to say (2) is very much over egged. I know that it does occur (rarely) but I have NEVER seen any example, other than photos on this forum. Leica made quite a point of the introduction of the zinc top plate for very good reasons at the time and the occurrences were few and far between on one or two early batches.

A few months ago, I looked at all the M6s I could find for sale online in the UK. Of around 20 with photos, at least 4 had some obvious evidence of zinc 'bubbles', though they were only extensive in one case. All were Classics, two were early (Wetzlar), three were black and one was silver chrome. That's a small sample, and perhaps not at all representative, but about 20% were affected to some degree. We could probably do a much better job of estimating the prevalence by polling the members of this forum. My black M6 Classic (Solms) was fine the last time I looked!

[Anbaric]

1 hour ago, delta100 said:

Well for me, the MP is still a better camera.

1 hour ago, Topsy said:

Me too.

Don't worry, guys. You can still hang out with us cool kids.

54 minutes ago, adli said:

I will be keeping my MP -  and my 1990 M6 😊

It's always useful to have an MP as a backup for your cool camera.

[UliWer]

35 minutes ago, 250swb said:

New internals from the old M6

I think you mean: "No internals from the old M6." I also understand Jono's remark that it had "new" internals as it has the internals of the MP - which is newer than the M6. Otherwise I could not imagine what was new: shutter?, lightmeter?, viewfinder? There is not much else in an M for film. 

[Huss]

7 minutes ago, Crem said:

I definitely get your point and I haven't seen a teardown of the new M6.  I can't speak for mechanical component availability. In terms of the electronics, the new M6 is a perfect time to redesign the circuit boards and make sure they can acquire the individual board components for the next 10+ years. The MP board is an old design at this point. I really would expect Leica to update it. It only takes one key component to go out of production to end up having to do a board redesign. There is also a lot of opportunity to miniaturize or simplify it optimize the assembly process.

This should give you an example of the individual electrical components in the old M6: https://www.dagcamera.com/store/p166/Leica_M6-_Classic-_No_More_Main_Circuit_Boards.html

I agree that the electrics may need to be updated.  But the mechanicals?  That bit makes no sense.  If Leica is now taking that work in house, why couldn’t they themselves just make the mechanical MP bits? 

[Huss]

Fyi I am not knocking the new M6.  I think it is awesome - like all film Ms!  It’s just the build/parts explanation does not make sense to me.

[hdmesa]

20 minutes ago, 250swb said:

You maybe forget taking issue telling me all the parts were new for the new M6.  I was  just explaining to you that yes they are new for a new M6, but based on the MP.

 

My understanding is they are new parts based on the M6 not the MP. Some things are of course from the MP like the finder (which I don't think has changed). Listen to Hugh Brownstone's interview on YouTube today.

Edited October 20, 2022 by hdmesa

[hdmesa]

4 minutes ago, UliWer said:

I think you mean: "No internals from the old M6." I also understand Jono's remark that it had "new" internals as it has the internals of the MP - which is newer than the M6. Otherwise I could not imagine what was new: shutter?, lightmeter?, viewfinder? There is not much else in an M for film. 

IDK – conflicting reports. It sounded like to me from the Hugh Brownstone interview with Leica's marketing person that they copied the M6 internal not the MP. Maybe I heard it backward.

Edited October 20, 2022 by hdmesa

[Huss]

1 minute ago, hdmesa said:

My understanding is they are new parts based on the M6 not the MP. Some things are of course from the MP like the finder (which I don't think has changed). Listen to Hugh Brownstone's interview on YouTube today.

Completely off topic, if my name was Brownstone, I’d name my kid Robert.  So he could go by Bobby B and do the finger gun pointing thing to his friends when they greet him at school.

[250swb]

2 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

My understanding is they are new parts based on the M6 not the MP. Some things are of course from the MP like the finder (which I don't think has changed). Listen to Hugh Brownstone's interview on YouTube today.

Well Yippee then, everybody with a broken and unrepairable lightmeter in their old M6 are now able to get new parts! Now, how likely is that?

[Anbaric]

Perhaps one of those influencers who hiked the price of the Classic can buy the original and retro versions and an MP, then take them to bits on YouTube and show us the differences. Then they can make a 12 part series showing them trying to put one of them back together, crying in frustration.

[hdmesa]

Just now, 250swb said:

Well Yippee then, everybody with a broken and unrepairable lightmeter in their old M6 are now able to get new parts! Now, how likely is that?

Jono says not likely since it's a new board for new internals that's probably not compatible. But maybe Leica will address the original M6 board supply issue separately.

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Look here: Leica M

[250swb]

1 minute ago, hdmesa said:

Jono says not likely since it's a new board for new internals that's probably not compatible. But maybe Leica will address the original M6 board supply issue separately.

OK then we have definitively decided that no, the parts are not based on the original M6. Good grief.

[Huss]

28 minutes ago, jsrockit said:

What makes you think Leica isn't doing exactly that for the MP?  They can make the MP, M-A and M6 at the same time no?  

Exactly!  If they can make the mechanical parts for the MP, the explanation that they had to change the mechanical parts for the new M6 compared to the MP because of parts supplier issues for the MP makes no sense!