Complementary camera to the M10?

[startover]

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Hi all, like many of you, I am committed to the Leica M system (have an M10, a film MP, multiple 21-28-35-50-90 lenses, etc.).  But I have recently had a yearning for video and zoom.  One option is to get the Leica SL2 but it is both very large and expensive.  The TL2 and CL seem a bit dated.  Have any of you had a similar need to complement your M10 with a, dare I say it, non-Leica camera?  I have been eyeing mirrorless cameras from Nikon, Sony, Canon, etc.  But I fear that the ergonomics and experience will significantly fall short of my M10 shooting.  But the need for video and zoom is real, and my latest iPhone doesn't quite satisfy it.  Help!!

Edited May 25, 2021 by startover

[robsonj]

I have a Sony A7rIV. I honestly don't think you can go wrong with the Sonys, which ever model is most appropriate for your needs. The M adapters for them are great - the TechArt Pro even allows M lenses to autofocus remarkably well, and the Voigtlander close focus adapter works great also with M lenses. There is probably more lens choice for the Sony than any other mirrorless system out there.

[startover]

3 minutes ago, robsonj said:

I have a Sony A7rIV. I honestly don't think you can go wrong with the Sonys, which ever model is most appropriate for your needs. The M adapters for them are great - the TechArt Pro even allows M lenses to autofocus remarkably well, and the Voigtlander close focus adapter works great also with M lenses. There is probably more lens choice for the Sony than any other mirrorless system out there.

Very helpful, thanks.  The Sony menu system often get a bad rap from people who otherwise like their cameras.  Curious about your setup--do you have one of those adapters?  

[Le Chef]

“The TL and CL seem a bit dated.” The CL was launched a few months before the M10 in 2017. I hadn’t realize how a few months could make such a difference in terms of aging.

[startover]

1 minute ago, Le Chef said:

“The TL and CL seem a bit dated.” The CL was launched a few months before the M10 in 2017. I hadn’t realize how a few months could make such a difference in terms of aging.

Sorry, I meant dated relative to other mirrorless cameras in the market ... 

[robsonj]

5 minutes ago, startover said:

Very helpful, thanks.  The Sony menu system often get a bad rap from people who otherwise like their cameras.  Curious about your setup--do you have one of those adapters?  

I've used Sony mirrorless since 2013. The menu argument is somewhat bogus imho, especially with the advent of the 'my menu', but it was a weak argument in 2013 imho. Once you set up the camera, you don't need to go into the menu save maybe once a year. The camera's physical button layout is highly configurable and assignable, the auto focus is fantastic. The few things I use in the menu on occasion, I add to the 'my menu' so they're right there.

I have the techart pro and the VM close focus adapter.

[Hans-Dieter Gülicher]

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Think at the Fuji xPro .... (or similar) and adap your Leica lenses. I did so because my M9+DMR chrashed in 2012. It was a good idea at that time. But now I am back to M 10-R and/or S3.

Regards Hans

[Narsuitus]

3 hours ago, startover said:

Have any of you had a similar need to complement your M10 with a, dare I say it, non-Leica camera?

I routinely complement my M10 with an M6. I shoot color with the M10 and b&w with the M6.

I also complement my M10 with a Fuji X-Pro2. I shoot 21/35/90 M lenses on the M10. I shoot a Fuji 50-140mm f/2.8 zoom (75-210mm equiv.) and/or an adapted 400mm f/5.6 telephoto (600mm equiv.) and/or an adapted macro lens on the X-Pro2.

I also shoot video on the X-Pro2 when needed.

[Lee S]

I have Sony a7iii with techart adapter. I use M and canon lenses on it aswell as the lovely 40mm f1.2 Nokton in E Mount. 
 

If you want something compact try the A7C. 

[erniethemilk]

I use a recently purchased Nikon Z6 with 14-30 & 24-70 f4 zoom lenses for the landscape and woodland work I do. 
 

A totally different experience to the M10-P but a seriously good camera.  

[startover]

34 minutes ago, Lee S said:

I have Sony a7iii with techart adapter. I use M and canon lenses on it aswell as the lovely 40mm f1.2 Nokton in E Mount. 
 

If you want something compact try the A7C. 

Funny you referenced it--I am leaning towards an A7C, although its viewfinder seems tiny.  Am planning to get the Voigtlander close focus adapter to go with it.  My idea is to use my Leica lenses ... I saw a video on YouTube that made it seem like manual focusing would be easy on Alpha cameras, with the touchscreen, focus magnification and peaking.  The 40/1.2 looks good.  Ideally I would get a zoom (24-200).  One downside of buying a full-frame versus an APS-C seems to be that the pancake 16 and 20 lenses from Sony cannot be used on the A7C.

[startover]

19 minutes ago, erniethemilk said:

I use a recently purchased Nikon Z6 with 14-30 & 24-70 f4 zoom lenses for the landscape and woodland work I do. 
 

A totally different experience to the M10-P but a seriously good camera.  

Yes, the Z6 has great reviews.  Wonder if you have used your Leica lenses with it.

[startover]

5 hours ago, Hans-Dieter Gülicher said:

Think at the Fuji xPro .... (or similar) and adap your Leica lenses. I did so because my M9+DMR chrashed in 2012. It was a good idea at that time. But now I am back to M 10-R and/or S3.

Regards Hans

Am resisting getting the M10R ... doesn't seem like much of an upgrade from my M10.  Channeling the money towards a mirrorless with zoom and video instead.

[Lee S]

4 hours ago, startover said:

Funny you referenced it--I am leaning towards an A7C, although its viewfinder seems tiny.  Am planning to get the Voigtlander close focus adapter to go with it.  My idea is to use my Leica lenses ... I saw a video on YouTube that made it seem like manual focusing would be easy on Alpha cameras, with the touchscreen, focus magnification and peaking.  The 40/1.2 looks good.  Ideally I would get a zoom (24-200).  One downside of buying a full-frame versus an APS-C seems to be that the pancake 16 and 20 lenses from Sony cannot be used on the A7C.

I haven’t heard about pancake lenses not being compatible with the A7C specifically? The Sony full frame and aps-c cameras make use the same mount and the camera recognises when a Sony ‘E’ mount lens is used and automatically goes into crop mode.

Focus peaking using MF is a doddle on Sony A7’s. I have the Sony FE 24-240 zoom, it’s a decent all rounder although will feel very front heavy on a Sony A7C. I think Tamron and a few others have made superzooms that may be smaller now. 

I have no experience of the smaller viewfinder on the A7C but will check it out soon now that we can actually visit stores. 

Yes the Nokton 40mm f1.2 FE is a joy to use, it’s larger than the M amount version but it size fits perfectly to the camera and it makes the experience feel much more premium, it also automatically activates focus magnifier when twisting the focus ring, you get full EXIF data and full IBIS which needs focal length and distance from the lens. 

 

[cboy]

13 hours ago, startover said: Have any of you had a similar need to complement your M10 with a, dare I say it, non-Leica camera?  

For video its obvious to look elsewehere but probably stay within the L mount ecosystem. Sensor stack thickness could be an issue for wide M lenses on other non L mount systems. For most compact setup the sigma fp is ideal as its also L mount

[Lee S]

3 hours ago, cboy said:

For video its obvious to look elsewehere but probably stay within the L mount ecosystem. Sensor stack thickness could be an issue for wide M lenses on other non L mount systems. For most compact setup the sigma fp is ideal as its also L mount

Yes this is a slight drawback using M lenses on other mirrorless systems. Only affects the corners though with wide angle lenses at wide apertures.

For me personally, weak corners have never ruined a good picture! 

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Lee S

[Mute-on]

Compact zoom digital. I have a Canon G7X MkII. Hardly bigger than an iPhone (though fatter, obviously), very satisfying image quality, nice wide end at 24mm, and was the video bloggers compact camera of choice.  Unfortunately the update MkIII has poor autofocus. MkII may still be available new. 
It just drops into a jacket pocket with the M in a Billingham 72. Fantastic compact pairing that is eminently enjoyable. 

[mmradman]

20 hours ago, startover said:

Yes, the Z6 has great reviews.  Wonder if you have used your Leica lenses with it.

M lenses play nicely on full frame Z cameras, I have experience with Z7. Apparently Nikon Z sensor cover glass is second thinnest after the Leica which help with many M lenses.  I have tried WATE, Lux 21, 28, 35, 50 and 75mm,  Super Elmar 21, APO 50 and 90, all good.

EVF focus is easy and total of 20 non-CPU lenses can be programmed in with focal length and F stop to optimise IBIS. Z6 has minimum ISO of 100 and Z7 of 64. With IBiS capability ISO 64 becomes default. Higher ISO is also good and pretty much grain like if noise reduction is disabled. Body is not much bigger than M body, different shape with the EVF bulge and built in hand grip, sits really well in hand.

 

[jdlaing]

1 hour ago, mmradman said:

M lenses play nicely on full frame Z cameras, I have experience with Z7. Apparently Nikon Z sensor cover glass is second thinnest after the Leica which help with many M lenses.  I have tried WATE, Lux 21, 28, 35, 50 and 75mm,  Super Elmar 21, APO 50 and 90, all good.

EVF focus is easy and total of 20 non-CPU lenses can be programmed in with focal length and F stop to optimise IBIS. Z6 has minimum ISO of 100 and Z7 of 64. With IBiS capability ISO 64 becomes default. Higher ISO is also good and pretty much grain like if noise reduction is disabled. Body is not much bigger than M body, different shape with the EVF bulge and built in hand grip, sits really well in hand.

 

Pictures or it never happened.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[erniethemilk]

22 hours ago, startover said:

Yes, the Z6 has great reviews.  Wonder if you have used your Leica lenses with it.

I haven’t yet, need to get an adaptor for them to try. 
 

Having said that, the Z lenses I have (14-30 f4 & 24-70 f4) are excellent.