Do new M10/P/R sometimes have bottom plate wear?

[hdmesa]

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Wondering if it is normal for the clear protective sticker on my M10-R to have come with obvious wear on the bottom plate. My M10-P Reporter bottom plate appeared flawless, but maybe it's the black color on the regular M10-R making the wear show up. Shutter count started around 300. Box had the unbroken, sealed tape on the outer box. Is it possible Leica is re-boxing returns, or do they sometimes come like this from factory testing before packing? I'm hoping the wear is on the sticker itself, but I can't really tell for sure without pulling it off. No other signs of wear or use anywhere else on the body. 

Exactly how it looked straight out of the box:

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[anickpick]

To answer your question: no.

This is either a return or a carelessly used demo camera.

[jaapv]

There is another possibility: It could be one that has been returned into the manufacturing process by the final quality check. The fact that the box was factory-sealed suggests this. The seal rules out a camera returned to a reseller or a demo. It must have left the factory like this.

[dkmoore]

12 hours ago, hdmesa said:

Wondering if it is normal for the clear protective sticker on my M10-R to have come with obvious wear on the bottom plate. My M10-P Reporter bottom plate appeared flawless, but maybe it's the black color on the regular M10-R making the wear show up. Shutter count started around 300. Box had the unbroken, sealed tape on the outer box. Is it possible Leica is re-boxing returns, or do they sometimes come like this from factory testing before packing? I'm hoping the wear is on the sticker itself, but I can't really tell for sure without pulling it off. No other signs of wear or use anywhere else on the body. 

Exactly how it looked straight out of the box:

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Unpeal the tape and find out. 

[hdmesa]

 

9 hours ago, anickpick said:

To answer your question: no.

This is either a return or a carelessly used demo camera.

Then how would we explain the factory tape seal? Customer or dealer has learned to remove without a trace and replace?

 

5 hours ago, jaapv said:

There is another possibility: It could be one that has been returned into the manufacturing process by the final quality check. The fact that the box was factory-sealed suggests this. The seal rules out a camera returned to a reseller or a demo. It must have left the factory like this.

Which begs some questions: Why would they not have replaced the bottom protective sticker as part of the process? Why would they not have simply given it to a dealer to sell as used with warranty?

If they are going to put customer returns back into stock, they should at least be sold as refurbished.

 

1 hour ago, dkmoore said:

Unpeal the tape and find out. 

I did. Thankfully the bottom plate is flawless with the sticker removed. Still bothers me it came that way, though.

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[jaapv]

4 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

Which begs some questions: Why would they not have replaced the bottom protective sticker as part of the process? Why would they not have simply given it to a dealer to sell as used with warranty?

If they are going to put customer returns back into stock, they should at least be sold as refurbished.

Sloppy...   Not a customer return but a back to the production line  by  QC camera.

[UliWer]

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vor 8 Minuten schrieb hdmesa:

Thankfully the bottom plate is flawless with the sticker removed. Still bothers me it came that way, though.

A protective sticker is meant to protect the bottom plate from wear. Obviously it did his job. 

[hdmesa]

47 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Sloppy...   Not a customer return but a back to the production line  by  QC camera.

I see. Or they were one baseplate short of finishing a production run and they grabbed one from the parts bin 🙃 

40 minutes ago, UliWer said:

A protective sticker is meant to protect the bottom plate from wear. Obviously it did his job. 

I wouldn't think the baseplate should need protecting from the hazards of the factory assembly line, but hey, I guess it does work 😉

[hdmesa]

Just to add: Leica Miami says receiving them in that condition is not abnormal and could be wear that happens as the camera moves around in the box during shipping.

[dkmoore]

I've had a a couple of experiences of having to have a brand new lens and camera (different purchases) adjusted so I think you are a happy camper only having to worry about the base plate plastic wrap.

Enjoy,

D

[Pixeleater]

Is the plastic sticker intended to be removed by the owner or left on? What have other owners done?

[david strachan]

I leave the sticker in place because...it's protection.

And doesn't bother me not seeing it on the base plate.

Also the camera spec label just under the protector has important information...like do not throw your camera in the rubbish bin 

...

Edited March 15, 2021 by david strachan

[jaapv]

2 hours ago, Pixeleater said:

Is the plastic sticker intended to be removed by the owner or left on? What have other owners done?

It is well known that removing the sticker takes 17.8% off the value of the camera  This is Leicaland. Tearing off the plastic seal from the box instead of cutting it is another 3.1%. The worst thing to do is opening the manual (that you of course ordered on paper), which might crease it - 19.4% .

[hdmesa]

2 hours ago, Pixeleater said:

Is the plastic sticker intended to be removed by the owner or left on? What have other owners done?

Basically preference – no official word from Leica, but it it is intended to protect the baseplate since Leica will replace it during a CLA. It's definitely not as "meant to be removed" as the plastic over the LCD screen. Removing it leaves behind adhesive, but it's easily removed by rubbing the bottom plate with a rubber glove.

*hushed voice* I've also heard that the rubbing-off of the adhesive has been known to conjure a Leica genie who will grant your wish for one Leica lens. Reportedly this is how most Noctilux users came into their lenses.

 

7 minutes ago, david strachan said:

I leave the sticker in place because...it's protection.

And doesn't bother me not seeing it on the base plate.

...

Yes, and from looking at the threads here about it, seems about equally split for keep or remove., I'm hoping to get some nice brassing eventually, and I want the top and bottom plates to wear at the same rate.

 

Just now, jaapv said:

It is well known that removing the sticker takes 17.8% off the value of the camera

It is also well known that leaving the sticker on removes 17.8% off the credibility of the owner 😂

[adan]

The clear solution here is for Leica to apply a protective skin over the protective skin over the base plate, so that the main protective skin is not damaged in protecting the base plate.

Repeat ad infinitum.....

[jakontil]

On 3/14/2021 at 6:36 AM, dkmoore said:

I've had a a couple of experiences of having to have a brand new lens and camera (different purchases) adjusted so I think you are a happy camper only having to worry about the base plate plastic wrap.

Enjoy,

D

Happened to me too lol, a safari 50mm cron, received and tested it, i dont know how much back focus, sent to local repair do adjustments

 

it was sealed ffs, sometimes so ironic seeing the small card, check by...what on earth did she check on

[jaapv]

Not strange that a handmade process has more QC failures than an automated one. Both humans and machines make mistakes but they make different kinds of mistakes. Human ones are random, machine ones are repeated. So for human work you need to inspect every single product and hope that the inspector finds all flaws (which he won't, being human as well), for a machine product you pull one in thousand off the assembly line and have a team pull it apart to find any flaw.

[Rob L]

10 hours ago, adan said:

The clear solution here is for Leica to apply a protective skin over the protective skin over the base plate, so that the main protective skin is not damaged in protecting the base plate.

Repeat ad infinitum.....

I actually did that! I have an M6 .85 NOS. Cameraleather used to sell low tack fitted black vinyl base protectors.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[calijax]

15 hours ago, Pixeleater said:

Is the plastic sticker intended to be removed by the owner or left on? What have other owners done?

I actually called my Leica dealer and asked if that underlying sticker has any particular use. They basically said, "No, but some Leica nerds get really perturbed by them being removed."

I laughed and took off that cheap plastic immediately! It felt good deep down in my soul 😀

 

Edited March 15, 2021 by calijax

[Good To Be Retired]

I buy a lot of used stuff.  I make a concerted effort to identify used items previously owned by camera nerds.  I don't give a ratazz about the stickers myself, but I figure somebody who does worry about that sort of thing will have been equally nerdy in carefully handling of the camera.

Same thing with the boxes.  If I buy a camera including the original box and it still has the original plastic bags for the electrical cords and the factory packet of silica gel, that's my kind of guy

Edited March 16, 2021 by Good To Be Retired