Nicht immer nur Kaviar ... (English Version)

[willeica]

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8 minutes ago, pippy said:

Co-incidentally as I was clearing out old files from an external hard-drive I came across this odd little snap which has an unlikey assortment of bits'n'bobs including some of my old Nikon stuff - the latter of which dates back to my student days of the mid-late '80s. As it also happens to have my M8.2 that dates it to at least five (but probably more) years ago. I took it for a bit of fun when I was transferring a lot of the old clobber to a different storage box after I discovered that humidity/fungus had started to eat away at some of the SLRs...

Crap snap, I know, and shot at 1/6th second so camera shake is very much present!...

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Philip.

Lovely group, Philip. I have an F2 with a Photomic head which the National Photographic Archives said that they would like to have as it was used to photograph a collection of photos (not mine) of the Middle East which they are taking into the archive. I was given it by the photographer, but then he asked if I would donate it along with the photos which he has.  I am happy to do this, of course. He gave me some other cameras and lenses, which I donated to a photography school. 

A few years ago I did an article for Macfilos based on Michael Pritchard's book on the History of Photography in 50 Cameras. As part of that I showed this small selection from my collection to indicate some of the most significant cameras of the 20th Century. 

Two Kodaks, two Leicas, a Nikon and a Rolleiflex are probably not enough to be truly representative. However, if I was asked to nominate the most significant brand in the history of photography, I would instinctively say Kodak rather than Leica or Nikon as the cameras also had to be 'fed'.

William 

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[sandro]

On 1/3/2022 at 6:45 PM, willeica said:

Two Kodaks, two Leicas, a Nikon and a Rolleiflex are probably not enough to be truly representative. However, if I was asked to nominate the most significant brand in the history of photography, I would instinctively say Kodak rather than Leica or Nikon as the cameras also had to be 'fed'.

William 

William, shouldn't the Asahi Pentax be mentioned in a group of most important cameras of the 20th century? I remember the years that everyone was wanting the Spotmatic in particular, but the brand seems to have lost popularity in favor of others.

Lex

[willeica]

4 hours ago, sandro said:

William, shouldn't the Asahi Pentax be mentioned in a group of most important cameras of the 20th century? I remember the years that everyone was wanting the Spotmatic in particular, but the brand seems to have lost popularity in favor of others.

Lex

Thanks Lex. I never got involved with Pentax either in screw mount or K mount, but I recall many people using Pentax cameras when I first joined a camera club about 40 years ago. For most of my 'photographic life' it has either been Nikon or Leica.

If I was to do a wider selection, I would include many more makes and models such as the Speed Graphic and various folders and also the Hasselblads, the cameras that went to the moon. The FSU and East German cameras were also significant. 

No matter what else I would put in, I still see Kodak as being hugely significant and it should be there to represent the film manufacturing industry. Advances in film were, in the past, as significant as new sensor designs in the current era.

Hope to see you again in Dublin for the LHSA AGM next October.

William 

[zeitz]

35 minutes ago, willeica said:

to represent the film manufacturing industry

Kodak patented roll film in 1884 and began manufacturing the first roll film cameras in 1888.  The case could also be made that Kodak invented digital cameras, if the complete story could ever be made public.  So I would also intrinsically say Kodak in the most significant brands.  

I have never found a book that addresses the significance of Rochester NY to the history of photography.

[willeica]

9 hours ago, zeitz said:

Kodak patented roll film in 1884 and began manufacturing the first roll film cameras in 1888.  The case could also be made that Kodak invented digital cameras, if the complete story could ever be made public.  So I would also intrinsically say Kodak in the most significant brands.  

I have never found a book that addresses the significance of Rochester NY to the history of photography.

Kodak also introduced significant developments from German through its involvement with Dr August Nagel. The Eastman Museum also still exists. One wonderful book they have published with Sterling Innovation is 'Camera, a History of Photography from Daguerreotype to Digital' by Todd Gustavson which covers a lot of the Kodak developments along with others. There are many books and sites dealing with Kodak and its products. There are also many collectors and specialists of Kodak products. Kodak was well represented in the V&A Museum Photography Centre in London when I visited it in 2018.

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William 

[pgk]

11 hours ago, zeitz said:

Kodak patented roll film in 1884 and began manufacturing the first roll film cameras in 1888.  The case could also be made that Kodak invented digital cameras, if the complete story could ever be made public.....

When I studied, Kodak was considered the company to work for. A job at Kodak was a good job for life. Sadly, in spite of their research and progress with digital (I have owned several Kodak dSLRs) the decisions made which resulted in their effective departure from the digital market must be considered to be one of the biggest blunders in photographic history too. They were a huge company that failed to foresee the consequences of trying to compete against a new technology with an older, existing technology. It was all very sad.

[willeica]

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37 minutes ago, pgk said:

When I studied, Kodak was considered the company to work for. A job at Kodak was a good job for life. Sadly, in spite of their research and progress with digital (I have owned several Kodak dSLRs) the decisions made which resulted in their effective departure from the digital market must be considered to be one of the biggest blunders in photographic history too. They were a huge company that failed to foresee the consequences of trying to compete against a new technology with an older, existing technology. It was all very sad.

Paul, you are saying what several former Kodak employees have said to me. Some of them saw the errors of the company's decisions at the time that they were taken. One of them, now in his mid 80s, has told me to keep buying Portra as it funds its pension. The Kodak name and brand still has strong presence , though , despite the 'demise' of the original company https://www.kodak.com/en

Leica nearly went the same way when the threat from Japan appeared and a 'fortress' attitude emerged from Wetzlar. The most remarkable thing about the M11 when it appears next week won't be any of the new features, but the fact that it exists at all with a format that effectively goes back about 100 years, even though it looks like the 'bottom feeding' aspect will be somewhat modified.

I believe that the Kodak brand will be around for a very long time as will Leica.

William

 

 

 

[zeitz]

5 hours ago, willeica said:

There are many books and sites dealing with Kodak and its products.

What is missing is books that cover the whole photographic industry in Rochester, including Graflex, Wollensak, Ilex, Elgeet, etc.  If I recall correctly, William Bielicke, one of the cofounders of Astro-Berlin, emigrated to Germany from Rochester.  He calls himself a citizen of the US with a Berlin-Neukolln address in the patent for the Pan-Tachar.  There must be common origins of all these companies that lead to their location in Rochester.  Rochester is not a likely spot to pick to start a company unless there was an underlying reason.  Ansel Adams in his autobiography denigrates Rochester.

Similarly a book on Dresden's photographic industry would include Ihagee and Kamera Werkstatten along with Zeiss Ikon.

The George Eastman House and Museum is independent of Kodak and is certainly worth the visit.  

3 hours ago, willeica said:

told me to keep buying Portra as it funds its pension

I think Kodak's digital patent licenses, including the one for the Bayer filter, also contributed to funding the pension.

[willeica]

4 hours ago, zeitz said:

Similarly a book on Dresden's photographic industry would include Ihagee and Kamera Werkstatten along with Zeiss Ikon.

Hartmut Thiele has quite a few books on the German industry , in German, of course. Here is the full list. 

https://www.lindemanns.de/shop/photobookshop/uusuch61d5fa11368db.php

Unfortunately his general book on the German industry seems to have been sold out. I have ordered his books on the Deckel Compur and the Kodak Retina. I don't speak German, but I will muddle through, as I do with his Leitz lens book. 

I suggest that you send a query to the Eastman Museum about the best book for what you want. We have a Kodak expert on the PCCGB research group and I can also ask him if you want.

William 

 

[UliWer]

1 hour ago, willeica said:

I have ordered his books on the Deckel Compur and the Kodak Retina. I don't speak German, but I will muddle through, as I do with his Leitz lens book. 

Hartmut Thiele seems to be in literature about photographic equipment what Zeiss Ikon tried to do for the real things: he covers every need.

If you have problems of understanding some German parts in the book, please don't hesitate to ask here. There are many people around in the Forum who could try to translate.  

[thomas_schertel]

Days with Voigtländer

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[pippy]

A couple of days ago I managed to acquire a Black-Paint version of the Light Lens Lab 35mm Summicron '8 Element' reverse-engineered recreation.

There's another snap of it elsewhere but for now here is a pic of her - alongside the similarly recreated IROOA hood - resting on my M2;

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Philip.

[wizard]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb pippy:

I managed to acquire a Black-Paint version of the Light Lens Lab 35mm Summicron '8 Element' reverse-engineered recreation.

That's a lovely lens. Looks every bit like the original thing, save the indication on the front ring, of course. How does it perform optically?

[pippy]

3 minutes ago, wizard said:

That's a lovely lens. Looks every bit like the original thing, save the indication on the front ring, of course. How does it perform optically?

Thank you for the kind remark, Wizard.

As far as how it performs there is an excellent thread over in the M lens subforum, started by Al Brown, which goes into that subject in quite a lot of detail. Both Al and, slightly later on, Shirubadanieru have posted images comparing the LLL offering with an original 8 Element and the results are rather amazing.

LLL really have reverse-engineered the lens to be as near a perfect replica as is physically possible.

Very briefly the LLL behaves in exactly the same way as the Leica lens - so much so that it's rather spooky - with two very small differences; firstly it has very slightly better edge sharpness wide open and, secondly, it has fractionally more contrast. In both these cases, however, the difference is so very slight as to be effectively insignificant.

If you would care to read more for yourself here is the link;

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326477-summicron-352-8-element-vs-light-lens-lab-352-a-direct-comparison/

...and here's a good on-line review;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJVykkfwNm4

WARNING : It was as a direct result of reading the thread and watching the clip that I simply HAD to get one for myself. You have been warned!............

Philip.

[pgk]

The FT-3 arrived - a good, honest copy with some wear but not that much for a 45 year old camera. Here's a rough shot on a mid-1890's lens (hence the contrat issues) on the SL.

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[pgk]

1 hour ago, pgk said:

Here's a rough shot on a mid-1890's lens (hence the contrat issues) on the SL.

I should add that the waterhouse stop is made from a piece of plastic and hole punched, so less than perfect😉.

[Ambro51]

Yup.  A Stereo Realist.   .....what’s different?  Well, I painted the metal Black!   

The popularity of the Realist was astonishing.  There are stories of people waiting in lines to trade in Leicas for them!   Production ramped up, to the point the David White Company changed the location of the stamped serial number from the base, to the side.  The reason, to speed up production! Overall, 125,000 were built from 1947 to 1971, with 2,000 being the 1050 Custom.  At the end, Olden Camera had the remaing stock and built ‘bitsa’ cameras from a mix of Custom and Standard parts.  ••••• Seton Rochwite, the Inventor, late in the production personally hand built a very small number of Stereo Realists using his polorizer system.  They have a special Seton Rochwite Insturments lens cover and are immensely collectible.  

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Edited January 8, 2022 by Ambro51

[wizard]

Am 7.1.2022 um 18:25 schrieb pippy:

WARNING : It was as a direct result of reading the thread and watching the clip that I simply HAD to get one for myself. You have been warned!..

Ok, I hear you. So before I start reading that other thread (thanks so much for pointing it out to me), how much is the LLL copy of the Summicron 35 v1? I need to do some risk assessment here ... 🙂

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[willeica]

On 1/8/2022 at 9:37 PM, Ambro51 said:

Yup.  A Stereo Realist.   .....what’s different?  Well, I painted the metal Black!   

The popularity of the Realist was astonishing.  There are stories of people waiting in lines to trade in Leicas for them!   Production ramped up, to the point the David White Company changed the location of the stamped serial number from the base, to the side.  The reason, to speed up production! Overall, 125,000 were built from 1947 to 1971, with 2,000 being the 1050 Custom.  At the end, Olden Camera had the remaing stock and built ‘bitsa’ cameras from a mix of Custom and Standard parts.  ••••• Seton Rochwite, the Inventor, late in the production personally hand built a very small number of Stereo Realists using his polorizer system.  They have a special Seton Rochwite Insturments lens cover and are immensely collectible.  

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Very nice. It reminds me somewhat of this earlier camera from Kern. One of these will be coming up in the Wetzlar Camera Auction next October.

https://collectiblend.com/Cameras/Kern/Stereo.html

William 

[pippy]

1 hour ago, wizard said:

Ok, I hear you. So before I start reading that other thread (thanks so much for pointing it out to me), how much is the LLL copy of the Summicron 35 v1? I need to do some risk assessment here ... 🙂

PM sent...

Philip.

Edited January 10, 2022 by pippy