Longest Telephoto for L mount

[aksclix]

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13 minutes ago, SrMi said:

Unfortunately, LUMIX 70-200 F/2.8 has a focus clutch mechanism that cannot work with back-button focusing.
Otherwise, I read good things about Panasonics 2x teleconverter.

I had the 70-200 f2.8 and it is a superb lens with comparable IQ to the 90-280 IMO.. I never realized the back button focussing limitation until someone pointed it out in this forum because I never truly used the lens much due to lockdown.. had found a great deal used and bought it. I was able to return it thanks to the extended return window at B&H for the holiday season.. I found a great deal on the 90-280 and took it! No regrets.. added advantages? no second guessing with IQ, no "power not enough" issue unless its <= 25%, strangely feels better than 70-200 holding it in my hand... thought the long barrel would be unattractive but I was wrong.. it is pretty nice! I get 420mm FL with crop mode anyway and 20MP is plenty! OTOH, I tried the 70-200 with 2x TC, at f5.6 and f6.3, I did NOT like the IQ. (I want to be shooting wide open) It wasn't sharp enough.. So, I think for me the 90-280 although came at 2.5x times the price seems like a winner! I also have the Gigapixel AI by Topaz which can help upscaling the megapixels.. I haven't tried it yet but I am sure its good based on the reviews

[aksclix]

13 minutes ago, bherman01545 said:

I don't know if that is 100% accurate. I know someone who uses the LUMIX 70-200 F/2.8 and have confirmed that BB AF does work, but not in the same way as a Leica SL lens.

With an SL lens, you set the camera to Manual Focus in the menu, and this essentially decouples the focusing function from the Shutter Button, so you can BB AF with the joystick only.

With both the LUMIX 70-200 F/2.8 and F4 versions, the manual focus clutch mechanism has nothing to do with BB AF. On my lens (70-200 F/4) and my buddies 70-200 F/2.8, you can use the joystick OR the shutter button to achieve focus. When I switch the lens to MF by engaging the Manual Focus Clutch Mechanism, you can literally only focus by wire with the Focusing Ring on the lens and is configured, the image will magnify in the EVF to assist in accurate focusing

with Panasonic lens it wouldn't let you choose MF option.. it is grayed out

[bherman01545]

Just now, aksclix said:

with Panasonic lens it wouldn't let you choose MF option.. it is grayed out

Yes, but when you pull out the Focus Clutch so that MF is engaged, it shows up again in RED in the menu

[aksclix]

2 minutes ago, bherman01545 said:

Yes, but when you pull out the Focus Clutch so that MF is engaged, it shows up again in RED in the menu

but there is no AF when you pull the clutch.. the whole purpose of BBF is to not engage AF when the shutter button is pressed

Edited February 2, 2021 by aksclix

[bherman01545]

This is where the limitations with the L Mount Alliance and third party lenses comes into play. No lens will work exactly like the OEM Leica lens, and many will not achieve the same image quality. The 70-200 LUMIX (both the F4 and F/2.8) are very good lenses, but there are trade-offs - in operation, build and resolution. 

The 70-200 with the 1.4x tc will provide slightly better results than the 2.0x tc. To be fair, the 90-280 is an APO lens, and 3-5x the price of the LUMIX 70-200, depending on which one that you choose. I own both the Leica 90-280 nd the LUMIX 70-200 F4. The 90-280 will come with me when I am able to take my photo backpack, while the 70-200 LUMIX fits well in my Billingham shoulder bag

[bherman01545]

6 minutes ago, aksclix said:

but there is no AF when you pull the clutch.. the whole purpose of BBF is to not engage AF when the shutter button is pressed

I see what you're saying. You are correct. This is a limitation of the third party L Mount lenses

[SrMi]

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16 minutes ago, bherman01545 said:

I see what you're saying. You are correct. This is a limitation of the third party L Mount lenses

There are no issues with Sigma lenses, AFAIK.

Strangely, Panasonic does not use focus clutch in m43, while Olympus does.

We are still hoping that Leica would allow disabling the focusing with the shutter button in one of the AF modes.

[aksclix]

I got the Sigma 150-600 ef mount lens with mc21 adapter for the SL2 and it’s pretty awesome.. no AFc support, only AFs but still... I think this IQ trumps the 100-400 l-mount lens by a distance!! At least in my opinion.. I did not like the 100-400 at all and returned it a while ago.. this 150-600 is a keeper.. it’s ef mount and it’s usable on my R6 and Sony bodies too.. got the adapters..

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[Chriseto]

On 2/2/2021 at 7:52 AM, bherman01545 said:

The 90-280 on a 47mp sensor gives you excellent cropping options. You can also put the camera in APS-C mode. Will that not suffice or do you need 47mp for what you need to do? 

-Brad

Hi, I take the opportunity given by your message to ask this question: I own a SL and a 90-280.
I would like to improve it and I'm hesitating between buying an SL2 and doing as you say, croping the file , or buying the new Sigma 150-600 and using it on my SL.

What do you think will give me the better result?
I'm photojournalist working for several magazines and particularely Géo Magazine in France. I do a lot of landscapes and wildlife pictures.
Thanks for your help.

Olivier

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[caissa]

The Sigma 150-600 zoom for mirrorless is the better choice. Because its range is so much longer. And it is excellent even at  600 mm. Even if you add the 1.4 extender the IQ is high and AF speed still acceptable. OS is also very good.

Michali has shown a photo of the moon with the SL2 at 840 mm that is simply stunning (so rich in details). (There is a thread for the 150-600 in other L-mount equipment.)

And at the end you can additionally use cropping. Another nice option is also the macro capability (1:3 at 180 mm and with extender even more).

The SL 90-280 is my best lens, but for small objects like small birds it is simply not long enough. The 150-600 makes live easier, even though it is heavier than the 90-280. Optically the 90-280 is unbeaten, but the Sigma lens is very close behind.

P.S. This lens is now available for L-mount, this means you have now all AF options with a native lens. It has been improved and is more compact.

P.S.2. The SL2 is clearly better than the SL (IBIS, 47 MP, highres (187 MP), better AF). But it is the much more expensive option than the Sigma lens.

Edited September 26, 2021 by caissa

[Chriseto]

59 minutes ago, caissa said:

The Sigma 150-600 zoom for mirrorless is the better choice. Because its range is so much longer. And it is excellent even at  600 mm. Even if you add the 1.4 extender the IQ is high and AF speed still acceptable. OS is also very good.

Michali has shown a photo of the moon with the SL2 at 840 mm that is simply stunning (so rich in details). (There is a thread for the 150-600 in other L-mount equipment.)

And at the end you can additionally use cropping. Another nice option is also the macro capability (1:3 at 180 mm and with extender even more).

The SL 90-280 is my best lens, but for small objects like small birds it is simply not long enough. The 150-600 makes live easier, even though it is heavier than the 90-280. Optically the 90-280 is unbeaten, but the Sigma lens is very close behind.

P.S. This lens is now available for L-mount, this means you have now all AF options with a native lens. It has been improved and is more compact.

P.S.2. The SL2 is clearly better than the SL (IBIS, 47 MP, highres (187 MP), better AF). But it is the much more expensive option than the Sigma lens.

Thank you for your answer. But what I really want to know is what I get in my frame if I buy a SL2 and use it with the cropping set up with my 90-280.
Will I get the same as my SL with a Sigma 150-600 at 600 and a 24mp file?
The SL2 used is findable at 5500$US.

The Sigma+uv filter for 1600$US.

It's a huge difference.
In another hand, if I buy the SL2 I'll have a second camera. (third If I consider my M10) And I'll have the same range of lenses I already have.

With the Sigma, I'm adding a lens in my set, which will double in a way the 90-280. With Two cameras (including the M10). Apparently the 150-600 is big like the  90-280, and it's not easy to take all the day along. I could get rid of my 90-280. But It's a really good lens. 

 

[caissa]

No, if you switch the sensor to APS-C then you get a crop factor of 1.5 . That means the 280 mm looks like/equivalent to a 420mm . The EVF is automatically enlarged by 50% . (90-280 becomes 135-420). The AF sensors are also from that reduced area, so the object is enlarged and often they work better with a higher hit rate.

If you do the same with the 600 mm attached then it will look like 900 mm. (150-600 becomes 225-900)

There is also the curiosity that even if you switch, the SL2 will still save the full 36x24 mm image file. So in post processing you get not only the APS-C area (20.1 MP) but if you request it also the FF area (47 MP). If you missed partially a bird you can often find the missing parts in the bigger area.

I think you need to set priorities. You can upgrade in steps. 

 I do not often take with me the 90-280, only if I see a need for it. My usual lens is the SL 16-35. And a 50, 75 or 90.  And if I take the 150-600 then I take nothing else - or maybe just a small prime or a macro. I cannot do all sorts of photography at the same time.  The 150-600 takes the full concentration.     I would never sell the SL 90-280 and it is no problem as the 150-600 is cheap - it costs only 1500$. On an arctic expedition I would take both lenses (onto the ship), but decide each day which to use.

The 150-600 is mainly for usage at 400-600 and for macro (180) and for use with extender. For all else the Leica is better. But unfortunately there is no extender for the Leica. (If there was, then I would probably only use the Leica).

APS-C on the SL gives you about 10 MP, on the SL2 about 20 MP.

For landscape you can also use the highres mode with 187 MP. But you need a quiet environment (tripod and no wind).

Edited September 26, 2021 by caissa

[Chriseto]

2 hours ago, caissa said:

No, if you switch the sensor to APS-C then you get a crop factor of 1.5 . That means the 280 mm looks like/equivalent to a 420mm . The EVF is automatically enlarged by 50% . (90-280 becomes 135-420). The AF sensors are also from that reduced area, so the object is enlarged and often they work better with a higher hit rate.

If you do the same with the 600 mm attached then it will look like 900 mm. (150-600 becomes 225-900)

There is also the curiosity that even if you switch, the SL2 will still save the full 36x24 mm image file. So in post processing you get not only the APS-C area (20.1 MP) but if you request it also the FF area (47 MP). If you missed partially a bird you can often find the missing parts in the bigger area.

I think you need to set priorities. You can upgrade in steps. 

 I do not often take with me the 90-280, only if I see a need for it. My usual lens is the SL 16-35. And a 50, 75 or 90.  And if I take the 150-600 then I take nothing else - or maybe just a small prime or a macro. I cannot do all sorts of photography at the same time.  The 150-600 takes the full concentration.     I would never sell the SL 90-280 and it is no problem as the 150-600 is cheap - it costs only 1500$. On an arctic expedition I would take both lenses (onto the ship), but decide each day which to use.

The 150-600 is mainly for usage at 400-600 and for macro (180) and for use with extender. For all else the Leica is better. But unfortunately there is no extender for the Leica. (If there was, then I would probably only use the Leica).

APS-C on the SL gives you about 10 MP, on the SL2 about 20 MP.

For landscape you can also use the highres mode with 187 MP. But you need a quiet environment (tripod and no wind).

Thank you very much for these explanations. It's exactly what I was looking for. According to that, I'll certainly invest in the Sigma and keep the 90-280. I'll take both for my next trip in Antarctica in November if I can find the sigma before. I'll invest in a SL2 later.

[caissa]

How do you travel there ? On a ship, I mean a cruise ?

[Chriseto]

31 minutes ago, caissa said:

How do you travel there ? On a ship, I mean a cruise ?

Yes. Since a few year I'm doing a workshop with the editor in chief of Geo Magazine onboard ships of the French cruise company Ponant. We have already been in Antarctica in 2019 and we do it again this year. 
https://www.geo.fr/voyage/souvenirs-dantarctique-les-images-incroyables-dun-voyage-inoubliable-203345
https://www.ponant.com/antarctique-expedition-en-terres-australes-y121121-1

[michali]

3 hours ago, Chriseto said:

Thank you very much for these explanations. It's exactly what I was looking for. According to that, I'll certainly invest in the Sigma and keep the 90-280. I'll take both for my next trip in Antarctica in November if I can find the sigma before. I'll invest in a SL2 later.

I've done 3 trips to Antarctica, I used 2 M9s with 16-18-21mm Tri-Elmar for landscapes and my other most used lenses were the 90mm Elmarit M f2.8 & 135mm APO-Telyt M. 

My next trip is coming up in Dec. I'm planning on taking 2 cameras,  SL2 & SL2-S with 3 lenses, Sigma 14-24mm L, Leica 24-90mm L & the Leica 90-280mm L, which should be sufficient for wildlife there. Personally I think the 150-600mm could be overkill.

Some M9  Antarctica images: https://michali.zenfolio.com/p295216947