Advice in Buying a MM9?

[Sjz]

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Hi,

I found what appears to be an underused M9 Mono for a fair price.  The seller does not say if the sensor has been replaced.  If the seller gives me the ‘Seriel No’ do you think Leica would let me know if the sensor has been replaced?  I do not want to take a risk.

Failing that, I also found a M246 Mono which is also ‘almost unused’ however is over 50% more expensive.  My preference is the M9 Mono for the obvious reason.  (I also found a M10-P for double the price but although tempting, takes me away from a desire to buy a Mono).  Head says M10-P, heart says MM9 (but only if the sensor has been replaced) and the 246 is just sitting there saying ‘pick me’.

i do realise I am doing the equivalent of asking the cat lovers society if I should buy a cat.

advice welcome 

Sjz

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[a.noctilux]

Difference is you have good choices of three cats nice M 😄.

I'd ask Leica if the Monochrom had replaced sensor.

 

I use the MM1 since 2015 with replaced sensor (2016 at no cost), last year I bought M246, and use the M246 more with EVF ( colored filter use)

and when I take the MM1, each time I said to myself that Leica did a very good job with this MM1, but in use it shows it's "older techno" and batteries life goes shorter and shorter.

 

I don't know which one is a better buy, as either is a nice picture taking machine.

[Ko.Fe.]

Spend some more time looking at M10 BW images. Many likes them.  

[dkmoore]

3 hours ago, Sjz said:

Hi,

I found what appears to be an underused M9 Mono for a fair price.  The seller does not say if the sensor has been replaced.  If the seller gives me the ‘Seriel No’ do you think Leica would let me know if the sensor has been replaced?  I do not want to take a risk.

Failing that, I also found a M246 Mono which is also ‘almost unused’ however is over 50% more expensive.  My preference is the M9 Mono for the obvious reason.  (I also found a M10-P for double the price but although tempting, takes me away from a desire to buy a Mono).  Head says M10-P, heart says MM9 (but only if the sensor has been replaced) and the 246 is just sitting there saying ‘pick me’.

i do realise I am doing the equivalent of asking the cat lovers society if I should buy a cat.

advice welcome 

Sjz

To answer your questions specifically, yes, Leica will give you that info if they are open and you provide the serial number.

i would ask the seller and if they indicate it was replaced, have them provide you the receipt. 
 

if you prefer the M9 M, I recommend checking out Leica store SOHO or Leica store SF, both of which have these in stock and in different colors. They will tell you straight away if sensor was replaced. Good luck. It’s a wonderful camera. 

[Jeff S]

I would (did) buy an MM1 from a reputable dealer such as Leica Miami, as they won’t sell one unless it has a new sensor, and includes a warranty and return policy. Mine had just come back from Germany with new sensor and full service, priced at $3500 a couple of years ago. Miami had a mint one recently that I mentioned here, with very low actuations and about $3300-3400 as I recall, but it sold quickly after they hosted a live discussion on the Monochrom variants. You could get on a list for another one, or research other good dealer inventories.  Leica might also have a refurbished model... worth checking.

Jeff

Edited May 28, 2020 by Jeff S

[Anakronox]

I purchased a M9M from B&H back in February and asked them to provide the serial numbers of the two they had in stock.  I called Leica USA and they were more than happy to give me the service histories of both.  Only one had ever been in for sensor replacement, so that's the one I picked.  A word of caution - even though I had a new sensor as of summer 2019 and it was corrosion free, there were two rows of dead pixels I found.  Leica would have charged me for a full sensor replacement at that point, so I returned the camera.  Make sure you thoroughly test the sensor and buy from someone who will take it back.

[jaapv]

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Those sensor lines were not really that bad - you could have asked B&H to have the sensor remapped before sale. Sensor lines often do do not require a replacement.

[Anakronox]

20 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Those sensor lines were not really that bad - you could have asked B&H to have the sensor remapped before sale. Sensor lines often do do not require a replacement.

I worked directly with Leica support for almost 1.5 weeks.  We traded DNGs and they finally claimed that they can only offer the sensor remap currently for M10 sensors.  In the end, I grabbed a M10 Monochrom and am happy with my setup.

[jaapv]

That is not nice. They remapped sensors of all kinds in the past. 

[Anakronox]

Definitely not.  I called them based on others' experiences on this forum!  I was really loving the M9M and truly wanted to keep it.  But after paying $3,800 already, I couldn't justify another $1,600 when the M10M wasn't that much more expensive (especially once I got my VAT returned!).  I'm not telling OP not to buy an M9M - far from it, only to test carefully and inspect for corrosion and dead pixels.  For the month that I shot with it, I definitely enjoyed it and its quirks!  It's a wonderful little camera and makes phenomenal images.

[chasdfg]

2 hours ago, Anakronox said:

I purchased a M9M from B&H back in February and asked them to provide the serial numbers of the two they had in stock.  I called Leica USA and they were more than happy to give me the service histories of both.  Only one had ever been in for sensor replacement, so that's the one I picked.  A word of caution - even though I had a new sensor as of summer 2019 and it was corrosion free, there were two rows of dead pixels I found.  Leica would have charged me for a full sensor replacement at that point, so I returned the camera.  Make sure you thoroughly test the sensor and buy from someone who will take it back.

Another issue I found with an M9M  that I tested recently from a private seller was a copy which performed flawlessly in terms rangefinder focus, mechanical operation and clean replaced shutter - but it had very faint dead pixels in the LCD. From my experience with dead pixels they do spread. So keep a lookout for that. Some of these bodies are 6 or 7 years old and while not "ancient" are getting a bit dated. This said, there are plenty of M8s, M9s and M9Ms chugging along fine. Just raising this point as something to take into consideration.

From an image quality and output perspective, the M9M is great and there's a lot to grow into e.g. learning how to process B&W, the "CCD output" (different/superior to some), etc. However after three unsuccessful tries to pick up a used Monochrom (2 M9Ms and 1 M246 all with issues, though for transparency they weren't necessarily to do with hardware but failed shipping, the dead LCD pixels and scratched up viewfinder) I gave up the idea of purchasing a Monochrom ...until I traded some gear for an M10M impulsively...not that I've looked back. 

In your shoes you can ask the seller for the "CCD ID" which should indicate whether the sensor has been replaced. Or you can contact Leica with the serial number. Not sure what existing gear you have which would influence what I would suggest I would do if i were in your shoes (sorry if i missed this somewhere). I would rather, on paper, be shooting an M240 and M246 or M240 and M9M for the same money as an M10P used. 

Edited May 29, 2020 by chasdfg

[Sjz]

Thank you for the advice, the reseller here in the UK has not yet responded to my questions about the sensor, instinct tells me that if it had been replaced then that would have been in the advert.  I will persevere.  There is a 60 day warranty for me to pick up issues such as the viewfinder and dead pixel rows.  The reseller is a small chain of camera shops, 

I think the MM9 pictures thread (for me at least) is exceptional in the consistency of the high image quality it contains.  I don’t know how much of that can be attributed to the camera, how much can be attributed to the knowledge / experience / skill - indeed the nature of the photographer this camera attracts, and how much to some prolific posters.  Colin I am looking at you in particular, as I feel the Glasgow I knew through your images. 

As for the 246, it is still sitting there saying ‘pick me’ and the M10-P looks at me confident that I will let my head win the argument.

Once again thank you to all who have contributed and made me think about aspects of the purchase I had not previously considered.

[Jeff S]

Did you contact Leica about the availability of any refurbished M Monochroms?

Jeff

[Sjz]

2 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Did you contact Leica about the availability of any refurbished M Monochroms?

Jeff

Hi, that is where the 246 is currently sitting.  It’s a very fair price there given the assurance I would get from purchasing from Leica.  No MM9 though. 

[Anakronox]

There’s a big debate about the feel of a CCD vs CMOS sensor in the M9M and M246/M10M.  I’ve seen the difference and when you’re pushing ISO above 800 the graininess resembles film grain and not just digital noise.  It’s quite pleasant and can add to your style if that’s what you like.  The M9M can produce some great shots when you use it properly and with the right color filters.  So can any of the other Monochroms.  If you’re looking for a worry-free experience then the M246 may be better as it’s got a proven track record in regards to its sensor.  Ultimately up to you, but good luck either way you choose!

[Herr Barnack]

My advice for buying an M9M is this:  Save up and buy an M10M.  😉

[setuporg]

The funny thing is, after I had the M246 and got the M10M, I just had to get the M9M.  Can't wait to get it and compare them all!

[Ken Abrahams]

You may want to use Lightroom or photoshop on M9M files because straight out of camera Files are rather flat compared to M10M

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Sjz]

On 6/13/2020 at 5:52 PM, Herr Barnack said:

My advice for buying an M9M is this:  Save up and buy an M10M.  😉

An expensive approach!

 

18 hours ago, setuporg said:

The funny thing is, after I had the M246 and got the M10M, I just had to get the M9M.  Can't wait to get it and compare them all!

An even more expensive approach!!
 

I do want  to try the M experience.  The original concept in my head, was to use my SL2 and CL As my main cameras (CL mainly for travel, but it is WAY better than that) and have a Monochrom in the bag, so there is no overlap.
 

Now am looking at M10M plus Summilux 28mm as I believe it works brilliantly on all three.  Time to put my card back in my wallet and take a step back.  This has become GAS....

Edited June 16, 2020 by Sjz

[setuporg]

M10M is not GAS, it's the greatest M ever made.  The sooner you get it, the longer you'll have to use it before the next one comes out!:)