Owning both 28mm Summicron and Summilux?

[leicarox]

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Hi all,

I'm sort of going on a lens binge here. Does it make sense to get the 28mm in both Summicron and Summilux (both current versions)? My other lenses are 50mm APO and 50mm Summilux.

Will I be let down with image quality or anything on the 2.0? 

Would a better route be the Summilux 28mm and fill the gap with either a 35 Summilux or Summicron?

I'm thinking the 28mm 2.0 for vacations and times when I'm really trekking around all day and the 1.4 weight or size may be an issue. Of course, maybe the 1.4 weight might not be an issue and I can just carry that everywhere 🙂

Thanks!!

 

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[Jeff S]

https://www.lensrentals.com/rent/leica-28mm-f1.4-summilux-m-asph

https://www.lensrentals.com/rent/leica-28mm-f2-asph-summicron-m-ii

Jeff

Edited January 10, 2020 by Jeff S

[james.liam]

Take a deep breath. Maybe two. 

Decide on one 28

and maybe consider a different FL, say a 75 Summilux or Summicron, perhaps a 90 AA all selling used for less than  either 28’s you mention. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by james.liam

[01af]

In terms of image quality, neither choice will let you down. Both lenses are marvellous. Simply decide upon size, weight, lens speed, and cost.

I am fine with the Summicron's speed and I don't like the Summilux's filter size and viewfinder obstruction. So, while being enchanted with the Summilux's performance, I got the Summicron which performs equally well, in a more compact package.

[darylgo]

I'm guilty of multiple lenses in similar focal lengths for exactly the reason you state.   M cameras are rather smallish but a large lens will make it unmanageable at times, a smaller lens keeps it workable.  Other reasons for multiple lenses are character, older lenses will render different than the newer Karbe lenses.  And there are irresistible lenses  for their esthetics or physical characteristics, the red 50 Summicron Apo, the stainless steel 35mm Summilux sold with the M60.  The great thing about Leica optics is their retained value and high demand. 

A favorite focal length can require and you might well be compelled to purchase multiple copies:-).    

Edited January 11, 2020 by darylgo

[RayD28]

I have the 28mm ASPH 2.0 v1 and a 28mm 2.8 ASPH v2.  There are many posts and articles if you want to research the characteristics of these two lenses.  If you want to stay in the same FL and have a small, contrasty, and sharp little brother for the 1.4 the 2.8 ASPH is a relatively inexpensive option. Best wishes on whatever you decide.  

[james.liam]

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41 minutes ago, darylgo said:

I'm guilty of multiple lenses in similar focal lengths for exactly the reason you state.   M cameras are rather smallish but a large lens will make it unmanageable at times, a smaller lens keeps it workable.  Other reasons for multiple lenses are character, older lenses will render different than the newer Karbe lenses.  And there are some lenses that are irresistible for their esthetics or physical characteristics, the red 50 Summicron Apo or the stainless steel 35mm Summilux sold with the M60.  The great thing about Leica optics is their retained value and high demand. 

A favorite focal length can require and you might well be compelled to purchase multiple copies:-).    

Agree in principle with you but I tend to choose a 2nd lens to render very differently than the first. Buying two very modern lenses separated by a single ƒ-stop doesn't make sense.

My 28 Elmarit shares cupboard space with a CV 3,5/28 for a Monochrom, 50 APO with a Canon 50/1.4 LTM & 50 Rigid, 35 C Biogon with a 35 Summaron ƒ/2.8. For a single travel lens, an E49 MATE.

Edited January 11, 2020 by james.liam

[jakontil]

I couldnt agree more with you, it all comes down to budget though

 

i have multiple 50’s and 35’s since they are my comfort FL while taking most my pictures

[chasdfg]

I owned a 28lux and found it too big as my primary 28mm as I wanted a daily shooter. I sold it and eventually settled on a 28cron v2. The 28cron is my go to 28mm - it's small but doesn't compromise on image quality (I had a 28mm f2 Ms-optics and this did) and with the hood on it's not much bigger than the 28 elmarit v2 with hood on. This was my only 28mm for a while.

I did however recently buy a 28lux again, in silver. I always liked the 28lux rendering and I must say the 28lux and 28cron don't render the same. The 28lux is closer to a mix between a 35lux FLE and pre-FLE in terms of bokeh. For the 28cron v2, the lens which resembles it most in my eyes is a zeiss 35mm 1.4 (non scientific tests, just gut feel based on what I've used before). It has similar pop as the zeiss. Sure it's not a mandler vs karbe difference, but it is there.

I wouldn't own 2 28mms if not for the 28lux in silver. I wouldn't have been tempted to own the 28lux again if it was the black version despite the rendering difference (not huge enough difference for me). But from an aesthetics point of view, the 28lux in silver...hard to resist. And that's how I ended up with them.

I do admit I also own a 35lux FLE. If I didn't have that, I'd probably have picked up a 35mm over another 28mm first. In the end you have fantastic gear for making pictures - maybe go for the option which would allow you to take pictures in a different way or improve your photography. A 35mm may be quite limiting but yet liberating in that you dont need to bring a 28 and 50 out. 

[Fedro]

I have both the Cron and Lux and love both of them. I have accumulated quite a few lenses over the past 10-15 years, and I will have to slim down some this year, but I am unlikely to sell one of those two as I love 28 as a focal length. The 28 Lux is my go to lens for environmental portraits, while the Cron is my walk around 28 though admittedly either could play the other's role to an extent. To me RFs work best with 28-35-50 so I think it is totally ok to have more than one in a focal length as long as use them

[james.liam]

There is of course “nothing wrong” at all, especially if you have the resources. Doubling up on two modern 28’s does not avail you of an opportunity of a FL you haven’t as yet tried or a different version with a different rendering  

“M” is all about compact and portability and any of the 21/24/28 Summilux or 50/75/90 Noctilux kills. 

[NigelG]

21 minutes ago, james.liam said:

“M” is all about compact and portability and any of the 21/24/28 Summilux or 50/75/90 Noctilux kills. 

I’m seriously considering adding this lens to my 28 cron v2 and I wouldn’t put it in the same category as the others you list at all.  

It’s lighter than my chrome 50 lux ASPH and more like a longer/fatter 35 lux FLE IMHO (the lens it will replace)....and offers in my eyes a significantly different “rendering” than the cron.

Anyway, maybe for some of us the M might be “all about” manually focussing through a minimal OVF with simple straightforward controls and precision engineered mechanical lenses......for me compact and portable is smaller than an M.

[Fedro]

2 hours ago, james.liam said:

There is of course “nothing wrong” at all, especially if you have the resources. Doubling up on two modern 28’s does not avail you of an opportunity of a FL you haven’t as yet tried or a different version with a different rendering  

“M” is all about compact and portability and any of the 21/24/28 Summilux or 50/75/90 Noctilux kills. 

Mmm, not so sure. The 28 Lux (and 21) are amazing lenses, so is the 50 Nocti, especially when you factor in  size constraints - the 75 is probably a step too far

To me M is all about best possible in as small as possible, some sort of Pareto efficient design.

I would think in relative rather than absolute terms, otherwise how do you justify that the body alone weighs close to 700 grams and has no AF, weather sealing etc etc etc?

In this sense the 28 Lux makes sense for example vs the Otus version of the same lens; probably technically not as good, but amazingly good given size constraints

[RexGig0]

I have an Elmarit-M 28mm III, a threaded-mount Summaron 28mm, and an Elmarit-R, plus a 6-bit-coded Novoflex LEM/LER adapter, so, yes, have a surplus of 28mm lenses that I can use on Leica M cameras. I bought the Elmarit-R before the others, in order to experiment with zone/scale focusing at 28mm, so it has been relegated to reserve status, now that I have an Elmarit-M.

At 35mm, I started with a tiny 3.5cm f/3.5 Summaron-M, and later added a notably much larger, faster Zeiss 1,4/35mm DIstagon ZM. These have far different visual signatures, and, of course, one is much better than the other in extremely low light. The final images of my father, without an oxygen tube covering part of his face, were captured with the fast Distagon, so,  f/1.4 has its important place. I also have a Leica-R 35mm Elmarit, but not one of the most-desirable versions. Other than a few test shots, I have not used it. I may sell-trade this R.

My first M-mount lens, the lure that pulled me into the Leica M system, was a Summilux-M ASPH, calling to me from among the pre-owned lenses in the Leica display at Houston Camera Exchange. Of course, I needed a body for the lens, and, HCE being an official Leica dealer, had a new M10. I later added a Summicron-M 50mm, with IV/V optical elements*. This most closely matches the use cases in this thread’s original post. 

Of course, I could not leave 50mm well enough alone, with a Summilux/Summicron pair, and added a well-preserved Elmar-M, for the times extreme compactness is desirable.

My one 21mm M-mount lens, a Zeiss 4,5/21mm Biogon-C ZM, is wonderful on a Monochrom, but can produce color shifts, with M9/240/M10 cameras, so, I may add a second 21mm lens, eventually, perhaps an SEM. Or, perhaps not, as I really like this tiny Zeiss, on a Monochrom 246, but have yet to desire to shoot color at 21mm.

I do not anticipate adding additional versions of lenses in my other M focal lengths, 85mm (Zeiss) and 90mm. (Thambar-M) These are niche focal lengths, for me. Well-liked, but niche.

An attack of Gear Acquisition Syndrome would be more likely, I think, to result in the addition of a more-exotic 50mm. I could probably build a collection of fifties, if my wallet is able to support the habit.

*My Summicron-M 50mm is a Special Edition, with the compactness and appearance of a Rigid, but with IV/V glass.

[Herr Barnack]

Quote

Will I be let down with image quality or anything on the 2.0? 

No, not in the least. 

I had the previous version (#11604) of the 28/2 (#11672 is the current version).  It was a blockbuster of a lens and the newer version #11672 is even better by all accounts.

I currently have the 28/2.8 Elmarit (#11677) which is an excellent all around 28; it is eye popping sharp, has excellent color rendering and contrast and is feather light.

My take on the 28mm M lenses is this:  If you want just one 28mm lens to do it all, get the 28 Summicron #11672.  If you are not opposed to owning more than one 28mm, get the 28 Summilux and the 28 Elmarit and you have all contingencies covered. 

Lastly - if you have money to burn, get all three 28mm lenses, the Elmarit, the Summicron and the Summilux. 

[a.noctilux]

2 minutes ago, Herr Barnack said:

No, not in the least. 

...

Lastly - if you have money to burn, get all three 28mm lenses, the Elmarit, the Summicron and the Summilux. 

Don't forget the "last" Summaron-M 28mm 👍.

This "last" lens is incredible "old school" and not replaceable by my other 28mm (I own/use some 😇).

[Herr Barnack]

The Summaron does have its adherents - I have not had a chance to shoot with one so far.

The maximum aperture of f/5.6 leaves me a bit puzzled though.  Apparently its old time rendering is the attraction...

[RexGig0]

2 hours ago, RexGig0 said:

My first M-mount lens, the lure that pulled me into the Leica M system, was a Summilux-M 50mm ASPH, calling to me from among the pre-owned lenses in the Leica display at Houston Camera Exchange. Of course, I needed a body for the lens, and, HCE being an official Leica dealer, had a new M10. I later added a Summicron-M 50mm, with IV/V optical elements*. This most closely matches the use cases in this thread’s original post. 

Of course, I could not leave 50mm well enough alone, with a Summilux/Summicron pair, and added a well-preserved Elmar-M, for the times extreme compactness is desirable.

Too late to edit, so corrected above, in bold type.

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[RexGig0]

1 hour ago, Herr Barnack said:

The Summaron does have its adherents - I have not had a chance to shoot with one so far.

The maximum aperture of f/5.6 leaves me a bit puzzled though.  Apparently its old time rendering is the attraction...

On bright, sunny days, an f/5.6 lens can be plenty, even in shade. If shooting hyper-focal, f/8 is normal. A 2.8cm Summaron, or 28mm Summaron-M, while affixed to the camera, is little more bulky than a body cap.

Then, of course, there is the rendering. 😀

[ELAN]

15 hours ago, Herr Barnack said:

The maximum aperture of f/5.6 leaves me a bit puzzled though.  Apparently its old time rendering is the attraction...

I love the little Summaron-M 28/5.6 size and rendering and I use it quite a bit.  Daytime indoor photos at ISO 2000 converted to B&W are lovely.  And carrying such a tiny lens all day (w/o hood) is such a joy.  Of course the 28 lux is in another league, but you pay for it in bulk and weight.  Nonetheless, I made two 10-day trips last year with the 28 lux as my only lens and I couldn't be happier with the results.