SL versus SONY ar7ii

[Norman Peritore]

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im using a sony ar7ii as a platform for 3 lovely R lenses. im thinking of springing for a nice used SL, but the reviews make it a hard choice between the two. is the IQ and ISO performance on SL better? Is it a better match to R lenses? Is the color rendition better? Is it worth the extra cost? Is it too heavy for daily use or is it basically a studio camera? Please advise

Patrick

Recife Brazil

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[xiaubauu2009]

I won't use 'better' to define these, cause in the end it's what you like that matters.

A72 is an old camera.... (or maybe the same as the SL, not sure), and for the price of a used SL, you can definitely get a new A7r3 with spare to buy more lens.... And there's no question about the question about ISO, tech etc etc that is 'better' in the A7r3, and oh, there's the IBIS as well and the crazy fast eye focus etc.... And since you are familiar with Sony work process, I think it will be better to stick with what you know.

[Vieri]

Patrick, I think you posted this in the wrong forum - this is the Leica S forum. You might have better luck posting in the Leica SL forum, and searching that forum before posting might return a lot of info about this topic without posting your own thread   Best regards,

Vieri

[jaapv]

Topic moved

[jaapv]

If you like your Sony system, why change? 

[colonel]

11 hours ago, Norman Peritore said:

im using a sony ar7ii as a platform for 3 lovely R lenses. im thinking of springing for a nice used SL, but the reviews make it a hard choice between the two. is the IQ and ISO performance on SL better? Is it a better match to R lenses? Is the color rendition better? Is it worth the extra cost? Is it too heavy for daily use or is it basically a studio camera? Please advise

Patrick

Recife Brazil

Although there are advantages to IQ on the SL, typically its thinner sensor glass filters, and the SL lenses, I wouldn't switch based on IQ. The Sony has higher resolution for example. If you were going to invest in SL lenses, that would be a different story …. 

The Sony also has more features which might be of interest, including stabilisation and eye focus.

On the other hand, the Leica SL has some more professional features, including dual cards, higher ISO range, fantastic EVF (IMHO), etc. and some different features, e.g. GPS.

This SL is also much faster to use in the field then the A7R ii, e.g. start up time, fps, etc.,   although using with manual focus on R lenses this is somewhat of a limited advantage.

If you look at DXO mark the ISO performance of the Sony is better

The SL is heavier but it depends on the lens. With the Sigma 45mm its excellent for street and travel.

	Leica SL	Sony a7R II
Price	Higher	Lower
Pixel Count	24MP	42MP
ISO Range (native)	50-50000	100-25600
AF Point control	Joystick/touchscreen	Four-way controller
Card slots	Dual SD, 1x UHS II	Single SD, UHS I
EVF (magnification/resolution)	0.80x / 4.4M dots	0.78x / 2.36M dots
Continuous Shooting rate	11 fps (7 fps with AF)	5 fps
Rear screen	Fixed touchscreen	Tilting
Autofocus	529 spot point (49-field) contrast-detect	499-pt on sensor phase-detect
Image stabilization	In-lens	In-body
Video	Up to 4K/30p	Up to 4K/30p
Battery life	400 shots	290 shots
Weight	847g	628g

Leica filter glass tends to be thinner then other manufacturers, so the acuity and sharpness can be superior, but not sure if noticeably worth it in this case

I would only switch if:

1. The handling and/or joy of ownership will be significantly better for you 

2. You are lusting after the SL lens

3. You intend to use M lenses in the future on the platform

rgds

Edited August 16, 2019 by colonel

[jaapv]

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Assuming that IQ is about resolution and image noise only...

[colonel]

5 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Assuming that IQ is about resolution and image noise only...

I was careful not to make an absolute statement here

A SL + SL lens would be superior in most aspects of IQ to the Sony A7R ii IMHO, but one can't deny its higher resolution and ISO performance

[Chaemono]

I strongly subscribe to the view that the more a camera inspires, the higher the chances of taking nice images with it.

[jaapv]

28 minutes ago, colonel said:

I was careful not to make an absolute statement here

A SL + SL lens would be superior in most aspects of IQ to the Sony A7R ii IMHO, but one can't deny its higher resolution and ISO performance

You are quite right, but when I read forums like DPreview or Fred Miranda I get a strong impression that those are the only parameters that count to camera buyers (I don't call them photographers ) One of the things Ilike about this forum. People tend to look beyond specs and at images.

[colonel]

23 minutes ago, jaapv said:

You are quite right, but when I read forums like DPreview or Fred Miranda I get a strong impression that those are the only parameters that count to camera buyers (I don't call them photographers ) One of the things Ilike about this forum. People tend to look beyond specs and at images.

yes. Actually the M8 with its diminutive resolution was far superior in IQ to anything in the day, if used carefully

I have just moved from a Sony system (coincidently the A7Rii) to a SL system, so I am somewhat biased

The SL body is much faster and more professional. It is more comparable to the A9 then the AR7ii IMHO

I have always wanted an SL, but its just now that the body price has become more reasonable and there is a reasonable selection of second hand lenses around. Although my dream 35mm f2 APO may take some time to materialise ….

The other factor, as Chaemono stated, is that the enjoyment of use is much higher

Finally, the sensor glass thing, and the design of the sensor (which has raised micro lenses towards the edges) should not be dismissed. This make a noticeable difference to the final product. Ethereal is the word I like to use ...

 

[Mr.Q]

I know this is subjective but I think low to mid (12-24MP) resolution cameras draw out the character of legacy glasses better.

[jrehorek1]

Hi Patrick,

I own both SL and A7Rii. IMO, for high ISO performance and dynamic range, A7Rii sensor is superior. SL has better colours out of camera.. The details of SL files look more like a film to me, the details of Sony file structure details seem more like something computer generated.

SL camera is more responsive and faster, the weather sealing is superior. Sony has sensor stabilization which could be useful esp. with longer manual lenses. SL EVF is much better than A7Rii If one is using only legacy manual R lenses. Look at the SL and FE lens portfolio should you decide to purchase more native lenses in future.

I use the SL 90% of time,  mainly because it just feels better and I'm more comfortable shooting with it. For the remaining 10% I'm very happy with the Sony.

regards

 Jiri

 

[AZN]

I'm another person who has both A7Rii and SL and echo the sentiments above.

Another advantage of the SL is that the firmware is frequently updated, while Sony only bother updating the firmware for the first few months or so =/

Which means that if they don't fix bugs/ quirks early, then they never will.

OTOH, the downsides of the SL are that it is 24 MP only , has no IBIS and if you need to have it serviced, then wave goodbye to the camera for at least 3 months (I'm in Australia, other parts of the world might be faster).

Edited August 16, 2019 by AZN

[jrp]

I haven't use my A7Rii since I got the SL.  Self-indulgence?  Probably, but it's just more enjoyable to use and you get better results with M lenses.  That said, since the S1R came out, I have stuck with that because (i) the viewfinder is a touch better even than the SL; (II) IBIS, which means that I can shoot at ISO100 pretty much all the time; (iii) the SL lenses love 47Mpix.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

IMHO the *best* platform for R lenses, currently, is the S1R/S1 from Panasonic, followed by the SL. IBIS combined with a spectacular manual focus assist system make the S1 a pleasure to use with R lenses. The adaptor also works well with the Panasonics. However, although you'll get a significantly better handling camera than the Sony they still have 6 million buttons and switches and a menu as long as War and Peace. It's still a pleasure if you're coming from a Sony body though. The stunningly good button layout and menus of the SL are still worth having a look at and if you can do without the image stabilisation it's a joy with R lenses.

Gordon