caissa Posted February 22, 2019 Author Share #41 Posted February 22, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Both S1 and S1R hands-on report from Austria: https://www.lcegroup.co.uk/LiveView/panasonic-lumix-s1--s1r-|-hands-ons-in-austria Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 22, 2019 Posted February 22, 2019 Hi caissa, Take a look here Is the S1/S1R a good backup camera for SL. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
caissa Posted February 22, 2019 Author Share #42 Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) The high resolution mode of the S1 and S1R is one of the most interesting features of these cameras, together with IBIS on which it actually depends. I remember comments on this forum of SL users that said they need more resolution and headed for the (in my eyes clumsy and slow 33x44 cameras - that undeservedly are often called medium format), for better IQ. I’m glad that with this feature an even richer IQ should be in our reach with Leica SL lenses. Some commented on the 187 MP of the S1R with strange remarks like computer too slow and disks too small. 😎🤣 (Yes, the grapes are hanging very high... ) Others even felt so secure that they denied Panasonic the 187 MP and boldly claimed “the truth” that “in reality” it was only 2x47=94MP (e.g. in the Northrup video about the S cameras). If they had taken the time and compared with already existing cameras (G9) they could have easily found out the truth .... But these cameras are not the first to make use of pixel shift. So here a comparison of four older cameras with similar features. The G9 is also from Panasonic and quite close to S1/R. It has an 20.2 MP sensor and a high res image resolution of about 80MP (the raw file size is different, an even bigger number of megabytes). So the images of the G9 in this comparison can serve as a first idea how the S1R high res mode will work. At the same time you learn how other platforms have other (more limited) high res mode capabilities. https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/panasonic-g9/panasonic-g9HIRES.HTM There is also an actual video of using the S1R with the 187 MP, also with downloadable images. But beware, that the camera firmware is still beta and the results not really useful for a final verdict. But generally speaking, high res mode seems not useful for moving targets, but it actually depends how clever you are using it. With water it could give you the sought after effects that you typically achieve with slower shutter speeds (e.g. with cascades of water). https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nkyjUuK68Qs Edited February 22, 2019 by caissa Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 22, 2019 Share #43 Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) Impressive video, particularly regarding what I assume is an algorithm dealing with movement. For myself, the IBIS is a major feature of importance, and absent any issues with Leica SL lens compatibility, the S1R will likely represent a keeper. And given the "L" alliance, it wouldn't surprise me to find that Leica has licensed the Panasonic IBIS, and who knows whatever else, for the forthcoming SLII. Edited February 22, 2019 by ron777 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 22, 2019 Share #44 Posted February 22, 2019 On 2/21/2019 at 12:57 PM, thighslapper said: This is a Leica USP ..... if they covered the camera in buttons as you wish it would just be an expensive, big Sony, Nikon or Panasonic. Differentiating your product from the opposition corners a particular niche market .... which is my interpretation of Leica's marketing philosophy. They don't want, and would not be able to cope with a high demand broad appeal based product. Those who like precision German engineering and design, quality optics, simplicity and the cachet of the Leica name are always going to buy ...... and that means people with deep pockets .... or a deep emotional attachment to the brand and philosophy. If you based choice purely on the number of buttons, menu options and pixels you would never buy Leica. As I've said before ..... I will get and try an S1R and to use with my current SL until the SL2 appears ... and then I will decide what to keep and what to dispose of ..... Choice is a multifactorial process, and the presence of a plethora of buttons and switches is not a deciding factor but ... a few dedicated buttons wouldn't mar the landscape. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Andersson Posted February 23, 2019 Share #45 Posted February 23, 2019 Those like me who were wondering how well SL glass will play when attached to the S1R might find the latest video from of interest: OK, they're there to sell gear but even this early in the release of the S1R I think the answer to the thread might be "Yes". 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donzo98 Posted February 23, 2019 Share #46 Posted February 23, 2019 3 hours ago, Bob Andersson said: Those like me who were wondering how well SL glass will play when attached to the S1R might find the latest video from Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! of interest: OK, they're there to sell gear but even this early in the release of the S1R I think the answer to the thread might be "Yes". Impressive... for sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 26, 2019 Share #47 Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Leica SL II rumors abound. I've previously suspected that Leica, in an effort to compete and obtain a leg up— given the "L" mount alliance— could possibly license Panasonic's IBIS. But now there are rumors suggesting that Leica might release a rebranded Panasonic S1R. Actually, IMO, that would make sense for Leica, because they likely sell more lenses than they do bodies, and I'd suspect, but cannot prove, that the profit margin is higher as well. But rumors are often just that, and they frequently dissipate like a puff of smoke. Edited February 26, 2019 by ron777 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent M10 Posted February 26, 2019 Share #48 Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, ron777 said: Leica SL II rumors abound. I've previously suspected that Leica, in an effort to compete and obtain a leg up— given the "L" mount alliance— could possibly license Panasonic's IBIS. But now there are rumors suggesting that Leica might release a rebranded Panasonic S1R. Actually, IMO, that would make sense for Leica, because they likely sell more lenses than they do bodies, and I'd suspect, but cannot prove, that the profit margin is higher as well. But rumors are often just that, and they frequently dissipate like a puff of smoke. I think there is an Andreas Kaufmann video somewhere where he describes the SL2 as having a more elegant design. I wouldn't think he was talking about the S1R. With the Q2 announced, I'm interested in the processor. Is it new? The S3 is supposed to have the Maestro II. Edited February 26, 2019 by Agent M10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 26, 2019 Share #49 Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) I saw that as well, but "more elegant design" can mean many things, both technically and esthetically. I haven't noticed any mention of the proposed processor. The rumor mill seems to feel that the Q2 will have a 47mp sensor. Could that be the same sensor that's in the S1R? And if so, the SL2 may have one as well. As they say on the street, we won't know until we know. But given Leica's pricing history, I would guess that the SL2, with a larger sensor and who knows what else, will be pushing 10K. If that, off the top of my head estimate, is anywhere near close to reality, the S1R might just turn out to be one heck of a deal. Edited February 26, 2019 by ron777 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted February 26, 2019 Share #50 Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) vor 11 Minuten schrieb ron777: But given Leica's pricing history, I would guess that the SL2, with a larger sensor and who knows what else, will be pushing 10K. The sensor isn’t larger. Its size is still 36.0mm x 24.0mm. For 10K they better make it an SL2-P with a screw in place of a red dot. Edited February 26, 2019 by Chaemono 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caissa Posted February 26, 2019 Author Share #51 Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) Sigma seems to announce 11 fast primes from 14 to 135mm, all 1.4 or 1.8. But I am not really happy with this: The lenses seem to be exactly the same as for eos, but they are even larger - just the size that the adapter has taken up until now. And they also offer an MC-21 adapter eos to L . The AF is now certainly better - not like many adapted lenses. But the size of some (e.g. 1.4/105) is really extreme (especially with hood). And no longer (tele) lenses until now. This is actually what I am looking for. Or a zoom like the 2.0/24-35. I do not really understand why they think that the primes are the best way to begin with. And they also mention again the exchange of mount for existing lenses (but it is not clear if this is only valid for the above primes). https://www.ephotozine.com/article/11-sigma-art-lenses-announced-for-l-mount-alliance-cameras-33300 Edited February 27, 2019 by caissa Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted February 27, 2019 Share #52 Posted February 27, 2019 6 hours ago, Agent M10 said: I think there is an Andreas Kaufmann video somewhere where he describes the SL2 as having a more elegant design. This was Kevin Raber’s interview on LuLa (Kevin has since left LuLa and is creating his own site). Dr. Kaufmann was clearly describing the next SL design. Incidentally, in that same interview, Dr. K. hinted at the increased potential of the L mount, which he suggested we would learn about. We now know what that meant. Additionally, Stephan Schulz (head of S and SL design, as well as the L alliance), stated that Leica was not privy to the details of the most recent Panasonic product announcement. However much leeway we give him for this statement, it suggests to me that the SL is a Leica product, not a clone of anything else (even if some parts may be shared or licensed). Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caissa Posted February 27, 2019 Author Share #53 Posted February 27, 2019 (edited) Here also the Sigma lens list with dollar prize. Availability “soon”. https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2019/02/26/sigma-announces-11-art-prime-lenses-for-l-mount Edited February 27, 2019 by caissa Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardC Posted February 27, 2019 Share #54 Posted February 27, 2019 42 minutes ago, caissa said: I do not really understand why they think that the primes are the best way to begin with. It could be that the zooms do not meet L-Mount minimum performance requirements, or that Sigma doesn't feel that they will perform optimally 47 MP sensors. ...or it could be that all of the Art primes are similar from an electronics standpoint, so they could be released as a group. The zooms may require additional work to optimize AF and IS performance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caissa Posted February 27, 2019 Author Share #55 Posted February 27, 2019 (edited) More details of the new Sigma MC-21 mount converter. (Eos to L). It supports 29 lenses. That would increase the number of usable (adapted) lenses on the SL even more. Included are lenses like the 4/500, the 100-400, the 150-600, and many more zooms. So this adapter opens a whole new world of lenses for the SL. Here you can find the full list. https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2019/02/26/2045/ Drawback: It works only in AF-s mode (not AF-c) and only with Sigma lenses. Strong point: It also supports correction functions for these lenses. Edited February 27, 2019 by caissa 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted February 27, 2019 Share #56 Posted February 27, 2019 5 hours ago, caissa said: More details of the new Sigma MC-21 mount converter. (Eos to L). It supports 29 lenses. That would increase the number of usable (adapted) lenses on the SL even more. Included are lenses like the 4/500, the 100-400, the 150-600, and many more zooms. So this adapter opens a whole new world of lenses for the SL. Here you can find the full list. https://www.sigma-global.com/en/news/2019/02/26/2045/ Drawback: It works only in AF-s mode (not AF-c) and only with Sigma lenses. Strong point: It also supports correction functions for these lenses. It looks like the Sigma 500mm f4 lens works in AFc mode, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted February 27, 2019 Share #57 Posted February 27, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, helged said: It looks like the Sigma 500mm f4 lens works in AFc mode, though. Correction: No AFc mode, and no teleconverter. I do hope that the 500mm f4 - or other long primes - will be available in L-mount, allowing AFc (important) and the use of teleconverter... From the page https://www.sigma-global.com/en/lenses/cas/product/accessories/mount-converter/#mc-21: "Cannot be used in combination with teleconverter" and "Not compatible with AF-C mode". Edited February 27, 2019 by helged Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 27, 2019 Share #58 Posted February 27, 2019 17 hours ago, Chaemono said: The sensor isn’t larger. Its size is still 36.0mm x 24.0mm. For 10K they better make it an SL2-P with a screw in place of a red dot. Duh! The word "larger" was meant to imply more pixels, not the actual sensor dimensions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted February 27, 2019 Share #59 Posted February 27, 2019 So smaller pixels, fine. For 10K I still want that screw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron777 Posted February 27, 2019 Share #60 Posted February 27, 2019 50 minutes ago, Chaemono said: So smaller pixels, fine. For 10K I still want that screw. The 10K number was just a guesstimate, and it may well be far off base, but if they forget the screw, a dab of black paint should do the trick. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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