Really “Is it the end of M road”?

[jaapv]

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That was never said. The catchphrase was: "with current technology"

 

Remember 10 years old threads (until right before 2009) here, why there can't be a full frame digital Leica and why there never will be one, ever?

[Guest]

Come on, Jaap: "impossible, because the lens being so close to the chip, the corners would..."

Ten years is long ago

 

Nothing wrong with technical progress, really.

Nor with buying frenzy - makes 2nd hand digital rangefinder Leicas more affordable to more future lens buyers.

And can be a source of more great photography.

[jaapv]

It is what Leica has been saying all the time between 2000 and 2009.

What people were saying on the forum is another matter. All kinds of nonsense come by  on the Internet. See the blog we are discussing here.

[bocaburger]

Nobody except Leica insiders know what their plans are, and any plans they have now can change suddenly depending on a whole host of factors.  Of course we can have fun being armchair CEO's   but it's a personal matter.  I personally have no interest in any Leica other than an M rangefinder.  I happen to like a rangefinder, and there is no other one out there by another manufacturer at far lower cost, unlike mirrorless cameras.  Personally I think it would be a mistake on Leica's part to discontinue the M cameras, but again, it's not my call.  If they do I'll use my M240's until they stop working and then if I'm forced into mounting the lenses on a mirrorless body, I'll pick one of Sony's. 

[Tailwagger]

Methinks perhaps we Leica owners are possibly missing just what the gentleman is actually trying to signal to us. 

 

Validity or otherwise of the criticisms aside, for someone as steeped in the lore as DL, its rather odd that he claims things are at dead end when we've yet to even cross year two of the classic four year cycle.  Surely he knows the pace of product intro.  Why claim now, August 1, 2018, that the M is a dead end?

 

I think he is trying to play Nostradamus in this case.  He thinks he has glimpsed the future and its no parlor trick or ESP. He's holding it in his hand and testing it right now.  A camera designed for those who have been clamoring for an FF mirrorless alternative to Sony with MF levels of pixels. 

 

What might the be?  The newly announced Nikon due for its full reveal sometime later this month.  I've no plans to be selling my Ms, but given the level of seriousness in terms of rumored glass and the obvious urgency for Nikon to succeed in this sphere,  perhaps there is a bit of fire that underlies this smoke.  

Edited August 2, 2018 by Tailwagger

[IkarusJohn]

I do not believe for a second that Leica will ever discontinue the M camera. Ever.

 

Yes, they will want the L mount cameras to succeed, but the M will endure - to my mind, the way the M10 has returned to a more “limited” or “focused” functionality compared to the M(240) confirms its long term future.

 

When the M(240) was released, I decided my Monochrom v1 would be my last and only digital M. I sold eveything else off and traded my corroded M9 for an M-A (thank you Leica). I am so impressed by what I see of the M10, I will seriously consider the M-D version of the M10 (if it takes the EVF (020) and has WiFi - the only issue I’ve been discussing with Leica is how to move the focal point, as I want a joystick, not the D rings).

 

More MP? Don’t care, provided the camera remains handheld ...

[Nordvik]

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Leica resisted making a digital M for so long, the company almost went under. They argued that film was superior to digital. But now that digital, in most respects, has surpassed film, they offer the best of both worlds. In the form of an M camera.

Leica M8 with 1,33 crop sensor was announced sept 06. First Nikon full frame was D3 announced aug 07, then D700 in july 08.

Leica M9 was announced 9/9-09 (number 9...number 9... number 9..., same day as the remastered The Beatles)

M (240)with EVF in sept 12, SL in oct 15. Now Nikon is making a full frame mirrorless for 2019, announced in aug 2018. Who is lagging behind now?

[Printmaker]

I wanted the M10 to be 36 MP but realized the M body would never sport that resolution as long as the S bodies sported 37 MP.

 

I bought a M10 anyway. And I love the camera. But I also used a S2 for many years and can clearly see the IQ of the additional MP, bit depth and - truth be told - sensor size. It is obvious enough that when I see a S2 file it stands out against my M8/M9/M10 files.

 

Still, the M10 is a damn fine camera. And 24 MP is a good compromise. But should Leica ever see their way to placing a 36 MP sensor with 16 bit depth into a M10 body, I'd be first in line. So, no, the current M10 is not the end of the line – unless Leica chooses to make it so by never raising the resolution.

[hteasley]

People saying 24mpix is woefully low just don't have a rational grasp of the camera market: there are very few cameras with *higher* resolution. It is an attitude that really just doesn't understand that not every aspect of every feature needs to be bleeding edge in every camera at the same time for the camera to be "worth it".

 

And again, National Geographic has published, and continues to publish, photos from much lower resolution cameras. This resolution obsession on web fora is silly.

Edited August 2, 2018 by hteasley

[pico]

I do not believe that  any of us will live long enough to know how our photography is important. 

[jaapv]

I do - utterly forgettable.

[Glasauge]

I do not - but it will probably be apout pics an not pixels

[farnz]

It's clickbait.  Nothing more.  Consider how many clicks even this thread has generated that will help line Diglloyd's pockets.

 

Diglloyd: opinion for hire.

 

Pete.

[Eoin]

Another hum drum article about technology in the image, implying images lacking in anything but the latest technology are inferior.

Truth be told, any image of any technology past, present or future is judged on the content therein and the emotion it evokes in the viewer.

 

For me, 24mpx is ample for my needs, doesn't stress my computer too much and still uses too much disk space.

I'm delighted to have an M10 and a few lenses, which are more than capable of satisfying my life long & well honed photography skills  . 

 

The only reservation I have with Leica is the deep breath I take when I look at the more than ample sticker price, .... certainly no lack of mega cents in that!.

[dantemi]

The topic started not to launch a discussion over the future of Leica, which I see bright and very far from an end, but to share with what is (in my view) a widespread misconception about photography: more mp and more electronic makes better pictures!

I choose a Leica M (and not the sony A7R3 or the SL) because it follows a path which is completely opposite to Mr Diglloyd’ approach, the M makes me a better photographer and that’s enough...

[zlatkob]

Remember 10 years old threads (until right before 2009) here, why there can't be a full frame digital Leica and why there never will be one, ever?

 

A few people back then argued vigorously against Leica making an autofocus camera system with autofocus lenses.  The arguments against were something like:  too big & heavy, too inconsistent with the Leica philosophy, or too much like a Canon/Nikon.  Also:  it would surely kill the M system, either because almost no one would buy a manual focus Leica when they could buy an autofocus Leica, or because Leica was too small a company to support more than one system and so would surely stop production of the M system if the new system outsold it.

[ramarren]

I don't read his column and likely won't. I've not seen anything that sounded like interesting insights out of it. 

 

Leica has hit the goals I set by myself in 2000 when I first became interested in a digital camera as replacement for my film 35mm cameras. I worked backwards from the print sizes I was interested in and came up with 4000x6000 pixels as being ideal, quite independent of any other pundits. I'm quite happy with it, even having worked with higher Mpixel files, and likely will be for as long as I do photography. 

 

The end of the M line in the M10? I doubt it. But I don't really need more in an M than the M-D typ 262 provides, so there I stay.

[jaapv]

The topic started not to launch a discussion over the future of Leica, which I see bright and very far from an end, but to share with what is (in my view) a widespread misconception about photography: more mp and more electronic makes better pictures!

I choose a Leica M (and not the sony A7R3 or the SL) because it follows a path which is completely opposite to Mr Diglloyd’ approach, the M makes me a better photographer and that’s enough...

A misconception which Kevin Raber of Luminous Landscape appears to subscribe to:

 

[Ouroboros]

A misconception which Kevin Raber of Luminous Landscape appears to subscribe to:

 

https://youtu.be/PtkX7T8dUP0

Indeed.

 

“Canon are going to go nuclear.......”

 

Did I really watch that video that far? I can’t think of any other expressive medium where so much pointless hot air is expended by so many creatively talentless people as it is in photography.

 

Give me my Nikon D810 and my Fuji X cameras for work and my Leica MP, Hasselblad and Fuji film cameras for play and I have no need to clutter my life or creative processes with tresolution, megapixels or unsolicited opinions from the likes of Raber, Loyd, Rockwell, Huff and Overgaard et al.

 

The only real point that these people will never, ever grasp or confront is the fact that you are only as good a photographer as the last image you made.

 

To hell with them all, photography should be practised and enjoyed without being burdened by their irrelevant opinions. Unless you insist on that as being part of your photography, of course.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[otto.f]

A misconception which Kevin Raber of Luminous Landscape appears to subscribe to:

 

https://youtu.be/PtkX7T8dUP0

I don’t mean to be personal but it is very funny, looking from the perspective of effective communication, to see someone advocate a vision on photography who has his eyes practically closed all the time. Reminds me of a dentist in our village who is called ‘Candy’ (translated from dutch).