Susie Posted April 30, 2018 Share #1  Posted April 30, 2018 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Guys,  Does anyone know the diffeence between the VAROB, DAXOO and the FOOLY enlarger lenses? They are all shown as 5cm f/3.5. I appreciate that they ave different mounts/ aperture adjustment rings etc, but are they essentially all 5cm/3.5 Elmars?  Susie Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 Hi Susie, Take a look here Enlarger Lenses. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
thomas_schertel Posted April 30, 2018 Share #2 Â Posted April 30, 2018 VAROB is the Elmar 3,5/50 in special mount DAXOO ? FOOLY (Leitz New York: VALOY II Enlarger head with adapter to convert Reprovit II to an enlarger. MAybe the lens is an Elmar. Â yours sincerely Thomas 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted April 30, 2018 Share #3  Posted April 30, 2018 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Top row, Varob box, Varob #464357, pre war, and a DOOGS, f=5cm 1:3.5 serial 834122 postwar. The DOOGS appears to be an Elmar lens.  Bottom row, Daxoo, serial 649079, just postwar and appears tobe an Elmar lens. a hard to find Varob-Hektor serial 178206, very early, for quote color enlarging and only opens to 6.3. Obviously not an Elmar type lens, but based on the Hektor of the period. The serial is in the last batch 178001-500 Hektor lenses for the camera. And lastly the FOOLY, serial 741823, and does not appear to be an Elmar lens, it is much shorter from front to back element.  So, can anyone discuss the serial numbers for enlarging lenses. It seems they were not a separate listing or assignment but rather mixed in with and reducing slightly the number of camera lenses made.  Later, I can show the 90mm enlarging lenses too.   5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Top row, Varob box, Varob #464357, pre war, and a DOOGS, f=5cm 1:3.5 serial 834122 postwar. The DOOGS appears to be an Elmar lens.  Bottom row, Daxoo, serial 649079, just postwar and appears tobe an Elmar lens. a hard to find Varob-Hektor serial 178206, very early, for quote color enlarging and only opens to 6.3. Obviously not an Elmar type lens, but based on the Hektor of the period. The serial is in the last batch 178001-500 Hektor lenses for the camera. And lastly the FOOLY, serial 741823, and does not appear to be an Elmar lens, it is much shorter from front to back element.  So, can anyone discuss the serial numbers for enlarging lenses. It seems they were not a separate listing or assignment but rather mixed in with and reducing slightly the number of camera lenses made.  Later, I can show the 90mm enlarging lenses too.   ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3509931'>More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 30, 2018 Share #4  Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Dunno about FOOLY (but I'm not in depth on the "Leitz N.Y. only" codes) : afaik the sequence of Elmars re-designed for enlarger is VAROB ('30s) DAXOO ('40s) DOOGS (after WWII, around '50)  DAXOO is quite similar to VAROB, with front part in aluminium instead of nickel (1940... nickel is one of the "King metals for weapons" ...   ) , both with a f scale not related to the usual one for taking lenses (*) DOOGS came after WWII, black and the first with usual f stop scale  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  (*) made for the long times needed for printing : values are simply multipliers for the base time at "1" : made a good test strip at 15" wide open... close to 3 and expose for 45"  P.S. : thanks Alan ! I never saw a Varob-Hektor... Edited April 30, 2018 by luigi bertolotti 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  (*) made for the long times needed for printing : values are simply multipliers for the base time at "1" : made a good test strip at 15" wide open... close to 3 and expose for 45"  P.S. : thanks Alan ! I never saw a Varob-Hektor... ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3510024'>More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted May 1, 2018 Share #5  Posted May 1, 2018 The VAROB, DAXOO, and DOOGS all have serial numbers that are shown in factory records (Thiele) as Elmar. So, it seems they are all based on the Elmar which was perfectly suited also for enlargements. The Focotar is a named lens and appears as such in the records. The first 5cm Focotar arrived in 1952, with a maximum opening of 4.5. Likely, this was a recomputed lens especially for enlarging only.  For the early enlarger of larger than 35mm, Leitz offered the VOORT, a 9.5cm f/4 lens, likely based on the 90mm f/4 Elmar. The examples I have, do not have serial numbers, but Lager shows this lens with serial 450330. By 1949, this lens was recomputed to f/4.5 and the name Focotar was used and the code word was FOODE, additional evolution followed, see Lager Vol. 2 Lenses.  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!    3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!    ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3510140'>More sharing options...
jerzy Posted May 1, 2018 Share #6 Â Posted May 1, 2018 Alan, VEROB Hektor is really rarity, short search in web did not show any other lenses like this. It looks like the optical mount is (almost) identical to regular Hektors, however aperture setting ring has been modified. Very interesting item, thank you! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerzy Posted May 1, 2018 Share #7 Â Posted May 1, 2018 Advertisement (gone after registration) Alan, would you mind posting (or send directly to me) more photos of Varob Hektor? Showing the side with aperture setting, rear side. Max opening has been limited to 6,3, I wonder why. Were optical parameter with full opening (2,5) not good enough? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted May 1, 2018 Share #8  Posted May 1, 2018 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Photos with bad shadows, sorry. Lens has 10 aperature blades, same as camera Hektor 2.5. Front flange also same diameter. Rotation travel from f /18 toHektor f/6.3 is the same also. Rear flange is hand scribed 51.0. I am almost certain this enlarger lens has the same lens cell package as the camera lens, with the opening restricted to f/6.3 rather than f/2.5.  Serial is in the middle of the last batch of camera lenses, as noted. Talked to Lager, he has seen another one and feels this enlarger lens was a last ditch effort to use up some excess Hektor lens cells before the arrival of the Summar. I have read that Leitz tried to market this enlarger lens as best suited for color, but I wonder how much color work was being done in 1933.  The "Hektor" family is interesting. The Hektor extended the Elmar lens with the addition of extra lens in the center if the triplet. Various patents relate to the Hektor and can be used in an in-depth study. Optical experts can be more informative than me, but the family seems to be:  Hektor f/6.3 28mm, 5 glass Hektor f/2.5 50mm, 6 glass Hektor f/1.9 73mm 6 glass Hektor f/4.5 135mm 4 glass Hektor f/2.5 125mm 4 glass portrait lens Thambar f/2.2 90mm 4 glass Varob-Hektor f/6.3 6 glass for color Hektor rapid for cine Hektor projector lenses   2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Photos with bad shadows, sorry. Lens has 10 aperature blades, same as camera Hektor 2.5. Front flange also same diameter. Rotation travel from f /18 toHektor f/6.3 is the same also. Rear flange is hand scribed 51.0. I am almost certain this enlarger lens has the same lens cell package as the camera lens, with the opening restricted to f/6.3 rather than f/2.5.  Serial is in the middle of the last batch of camera lenses, as noted. Talked to Lager, he has seen another one and feels this enlarger lens was a last ditch effort to use up some excess Hektor lens cells before the arrival of the Summar. I have read that Leitz tried to market this enlarger lens as best suited for color, but I wonder how much color work was being done in 1933.  The "Hektor" family is interesting. The Hektor extended the Elmar lens with the addition of extra lens in the center if the triplet. Various patents relate to the Hektor and can be used in an in-depth study. Optical experts can be more informative than me, but the family seems to be:  Hektor f/6.3 28mm, 5 glass Hektor f/2.5 50mm, 6 glass Hektor f/1.9 73mm 6 glass Hektor f/4.5 135mm 4 glass Hektor f/2.5 125mm 4 glass portrait lens Thambar f/2.2 90mm 4 glass Varob-Hektor f/6.3 6 glass for color Hektor rapid for cine Hektor projector lenses   ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3510802'>More sharing options...
jerzy Posted May 2, 2018 Share #9 Â Posted May 2, 2018 (edited) Alan, thx for the photos and further details. Yes, optical cell mount looks like from regular Hektor with just aperture setting ring modified. Oh, how much I would like to take it apart to see other, hidden details ;-) ;-) Edited May 2, 2018 by jerzy Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicapasion Posted May 3, 2018 Share #10  Posted May 3, 2018 My modest contribution:  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3511830'>More sharing options...
Leicapasion Posted May 3, 2018 Share #11  Posted May 3, 2018 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Alan, would you mind posting (or send directly to me) more photos of Varob Hektor? Showing the side with aperture setting, rear side. Max opening has been limited to 6,3, I wonder why. Were optical parameter with full opening (2,5) not good enough?  1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3512253'>More sharing options...
pico Posted May 3, 2018 Share #12 Â Posted May 3, 2018 (edited) I understand that this thread is oriented to collectors which has been helpful. If anyone has tried the 135mm Hektor (decoupled from focusing tube) on an enlarger I would be interested in impressions, outcomes. Edited May 3, 2018 by pico Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted May 4, 2018 Share #13  Posted May 4, 2018 The thread of the removed lens head on the 135 Hektor or Elmar is 41.5mm and will not fit the older enlargers that had a 39mm flange similar to the camera. I found an adapter that works, but when mounted on an enlarger, I cannot achieve focus at any adjustment. When using the 135 lens without removing the head, focus can be achieved at about 1 meter, producing a 4 inch by 6 inch image. Not a practical arrangement. Thanks for allowing me to re-experience how hot the globe containing the bulb gets on these old enlargers! I wonder if anyone has built an enlarger with low heat LED light source?  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!   Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!   ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3512346'>More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted May 4, 2018 Share #14  Posted May 4, 2018 (edited) Hello Pico,  The lens head of the detachable 135mm F4 Tele-Elmar has 2 threads: 39mm X 1mm & 33mm X 1mm  A 135mm F4 Tele-Elmar is a perfectly good lens for close-ups. As well as being a perfectly good portrait lens, medium distance lens & long distance or/& landscape lens.  Best Regards,  Michael Edited May 4, 2018 by Michael Geschlecht 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted May 4, 2018 Share #15  Posted May 4, 2018 (edited) RE: 135mm Hektor  Thanks, Alan. I just measured my lens head female thread with my best instrument as 35mm OD which is close enough. I cannot measure into the thread which could amount to 36mm. BTW, mine looks nothing like your picture.  I use enlargers with bellows and helix and can make an adapter so it is up to me to do that to answer my own question. I'll post the outcome. Edited May 4, 2018 by pico Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted May 4, 2018 Share #16  Posted May 4, 2018 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  My previous photo showed the 135 Hektor lens head with the adapter mounted. Here it is separately. the rear male thread is 42.5mm, the adapter converts it to 39mm. These are old lenses from the early 1930's, the Tele-Elmar is a much later lens. Leitz did offer a short mount for the 135 early lenses, for copying or use on the visoflex/Ploot, but I am not aware of any specific adaptations for the use of these lenses in enlarging. Thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  My previous photo showed the 135 Hektor lens head with the adapter mounted. Here it is separately. the rear male thread is 42.5mm, the adapter converts it to 39mm. These are old lenses from the early 1930's, the Tele-Elmar is a much later lens. Leitz did offer a short mount for the 135 early lenses, for copying or use on the visoflex/Ploot, but I am not aware of any specific adaptations for the use of these lenses in enlarging. Thanks ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/284145-enlarger-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=3512385'>More sharing options...
alan mcfall Posted May 4, 2018 Share #17  Posted May 4, 2018 VH1 copia.jpgVH2 copia.jpgVH3 copia.jpg Very nice, now at least 2 Varob-Hektor enlarger lenses with serials normally assumed to be camera lenses. This latest at 168xxx which is in a lot 168001-169000 which was all asigned camera lenses. And all the regular Varob lens also lying in the Elmar factory assignments, Can we then suggest that all the early enlarger lenses, before the recomputed Focotar series just priot to the war, were based on the existing camera lenses, 50 Elmar, 50 Hektor and 90 Elmar? And their likely small numbers will very slightly lower the total number of camera lenses produced. Maybe someone with direct access to the factory records individual pages can check this theory. Someday we my know exactly how many Varob-Hektor lenses were made. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted May 4, 2018 Share #18  Posted May 4, 2018 The DOOGS looks like a rigid version of the Elmar with a VALOO fixed on it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted May 4, 2018 Share #19 Â Posted May 4, 2018 (edited) Hello Everybody, Â I have an adapter for use on a Visoflex I, for a later 135mm F4.5 Hektor lenses cataloged as: ZOOAN/16495. Â The adapter is the usual 39mm X 1mm for attachment to the Visoflex I side. It is 42 X 0.75mm on the side that accepts the 135mm F4.5 Hektor lens head. Â 42mm X 0.75mm is the same as what was called "T2" back in the 20th Century when there were some attempts to make a single lens that could be used on a variety of brands of cameras, each of which had its own unique lens mount. The theory was to buy 1 lens with a variety of interchangeable mounts which would allow the 1 lens to be used on a variety of different brands of cameras. Â This is not to be confused with Practica/ Pentax Mount which is 42mm X 1mm. Sometimes also called "Universal Mount". Â Best Regards, Â Michael Edited May 4, 2018 by Michael Geschlecht 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrogallol Posted May 4, 2018 Share #20  Posted May 4, 2018 The thread of the removed lens head on the 135 Hektor or Elmar is 41.5mm and will not fit the older enlargers that had a 39mm flange similar to the camera. I found an adapter that works, but when mounted on an enlarger, I cannot achieve focus at any adjustment. When using the 135 lens without removing the head, focus can be achieved at about 1 meter, producing a 4 inch by 6 inch image. Not a practical arrangement. Thanks for allowing me to re-experience how hot the globe containing the bulb gets on these old enlargers! I wonder if anyone has built an enlarger with low heat LED light source?  IMG_0529.JPG I made a new light head for my Lines and Jones half plate enlarger using three panels of LED lights to replace the original cold cathode lamp. It works well, only 12 volts through a transformer and no heat. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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