Ashkanani1985 Posted June 14, 2017 Share #1 Posted June 14, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi all I am a photographer from Kuwait, I've been Canon shooter for all of my time as photographer until beginning of this year when I decide to ditch all of my Canon gear fro the concept of 2 lenses and 2 bodies to travel around..... Started with Leica q which better than what I expected and now I am thinking of second body with a 50mm which leaves me into 2 choices 1 is the SL and second is the M10 SL is like holding uncomfortable DSLR and to be honest I ditched the heavy wight Canon gear to be light while traveling why should I go back again ?! I feel I am a more attached to the concept of rangefinder I've used M9 for a year and was more than happy with it and really fun but thats it fun! never took it with me to any of the places where I do serious travel shooting and never tried the range finder in not so perfect lighting. I do travel a lot and my main specialty in photography is the environmental people and culture photography, the way I work mostly inside houses of the people in the villages where I travel and flash is very important for me to use, I am worried that in that dark situation the rangefinder will be impossible to focus with, I know I can use the VIsoflex viewfinder but the problem if I use it there is no way to attach the flash trigger!? so any idea or thought about that topic will be really helpful? one thing really confuse me that every where I go I find Leica M attached to street photography, why ? I mean it wouldn't be a perfect camera for environmental people life photography? or Landscape ? I tried searching for wireless trigger flash compatible with the Leica system but couldn't find one so I guess pocket wizard and flash will do it unless someone can help or advice in this matter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Hi Ashkanani1985, Take a look here Moving to M10 and need some advice. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
fatihayoglu Posted June 14, 2017 Share #2 Posted June 14, 2017 You can use the screen on then closes of the camera rather than EVF so the port will be free for a flash I'm switching from Nikon to M10 currently and have difficulty with exposures s it works differently on M10 but if you master it, it is not more different than DSLR IMO. Focusing in a dark environment with RF shouldn't be difficult as long as you can see the subject with your very own eyes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatihayoglu Posted June 14, 2017 Share #3 Posted June 14, 2017 Edit: You can see the screen at the back of the camera... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashkanani1985 Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share #4 Posted June 14, 2017 You can use the screen on then closes of the camera rather than EVF so the port will be free for a flash I'm switching from Nikon to M10 currently and have difficulty with exposures s it works differently on M10 but if you master it, it is not more different than DSLR IMO. Focusing in a dark environment with RF shouldn't be difficult as long as you can see the subject with your very own eyes thanx a lot thats really a relief to be honest the EVF is something I want to ignore as long as I can and want to relay into RF focusing and master it because the RF experience is what bringing me to the m10 and the ability to see beyond where i am focusing will rise the quality of my photography over all ..... thats said and since you mention that even in the dark I will not have problem with focusing using RF will help as most of my work is in controlled environment and have all the time to setup the scene to my story of telling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted June 14, 2017 Share #5 Posted June 14, 2017 The main advance with the M10 is that it now has excellent low light (high ISO) capability, and of course the optical viewfinder and RF focusing work in light dim enough that AF is chancy. The M10 also has tidied up some of the operational idiosyncracies of the M240 and before -- favorites menu for almost everything, good handling, EVF if you need it for very wide angles. I also shoot with the SL but the M10 is my favorite for 28 to 75 mm lenses. M10 with as nice a 50 as you can afford and the 28 Elmarit-asph would be my choice as a travel combination. That will be very light and inconspicuous. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Miller Posted June 14, 2017 Share #6 Posted June 14, 2017 I do travel a lot and my main specialty in photography is the environmental people and culture photography, the way I work mostly inside houses of the people in the villages where I travel and flash is very important for me to use, I am worried that in that dark situation the rangefinder will be impossible to focus with, I know I can use the VIsoflex viewfinder but the problem if I use it there is no way to attach the flash trigger!? so any idea or thought about that topic will be really helpful? I shoot with the M-240 and M246 and find I can focus OK in low light. I did a comparison with my Df and found that I can do better in low light with the rangefinder than with the Df's groundglass. Often specular highlights can be found to focus on. Low light focus does take longer than in good light. If the subject is in motion it could be an issue, but should be fine for static ones. Should Leica release a multi-function hand grip for the M10 - the flash can be moved out of the hot shoe. Allegedly the required multi-function connector is present in the M10, hiding under a cover plate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 14, 2017 Share #7 Posted June 14, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) The reason M cameras are regarded as street shooters is because they were the favoured cameras of well-known street photographers, like Henry Cartier Bresson and many others. Although I suspect that the old masters would be using smaller, faster AF cameras nowadays, maybe a Leica Q, or Micro Four/Thirds cameras, etc. In concept and real use M cameras have a far wider application span. In fact, they are excellent travel cameras, reportage cameras, etc. Perfect for your speciality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brill64 Posted June 14, 2017 Share #8 Posted June 14, 2017 the way I work mostly inside houses of the people in the villages where I travel and flash is very important for me to use, I am worried that in that dark situation the rangefinder will be impossible to focus with, I know I can use the VIsoflex viewfinder but the problem if I use it there is no way to attach the flash trigger!? so any idea or thought about that topic will be really helpful? Leica makes an adjustable ttl flash bracket that plugs into a socket of the M-240's multifunction GPS handgrip. This way you can plug an electronic viewfinder into the flash shoe of the M-240 & have ttl or manual flash as well. Its not an M10 but it solves the issue you mention. The M10 doesn't have a multi function grip, as far as I know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phongph Posted June 14, 2017 Share #9 Posted June 14, 2017 Hi all I am a photographer from Kuwait, I've been Canon shooter for all of my time as photographer until beginning of this year when I decide to ditch all of my Canon gear fro the concept of 2 lenses and 2 bodies to travel around..... Started with Leica q which better than what I expected and now I am thinking of second body with a 50mm which leaves me into 2 choices 1 is the SL and second is the M10 SL is like holding uncomfortable DSLR and to be honest I ditched the heavy wight Canon gear to be light while traveling why should I go back again ?! I feel I am a more attached to the concept of rangefinder I've used M9 for a year and was more than happy with it and really fun but thats it fun! never took it with me to any of the places where I do serious travel shooting and never tried the range finder in not so perfect lighting. I do travel a lot and my main specialty in photography is the environmental people and culture photography, the way I work mostly inside houses of the people in the villages where I travel and flash is very important for me to use, I am worried that in that dark situation the rangefinder will be impossible to focus with, I know I can use the VIsoflex viewfinder but the problem if I use it there is no way to attach the flash trigger!? so any idea or thought about that topic will be really helpful? one thing really confuse me that every where I go I find Leica M attached to street photography, why ? I mean it wouldn't be a perfect camera for environmental people life photography? or Landscape ? I tried searching for wireless trigger flash compatible with the Leica system but couldn't find one so I guess pocket wizard and flash will do it unless someone can help or advice in this matter? Hi!I have owned both and been happy with SL 601 and M10. My SL 601 & SL24-90 is for shooting the event, activity, children ... with AF assisstance. My M10, M Apo 50 and M Lux 75 is for shooting the portrait, street life ... Have a good day! Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric1 Posted June 14, 2017 Share #10 Posted June 14, 2017 I switched to the M system from a dslr because of the weight and travel ability and the small M lenses. I think the m10 would be an excellent choice for that. I take landscape and city photos and think more people would also but let's face it, most people don't shoot leica because of the expense, even pros. Fifty years ago, street photography included landscapes, people, animals, buildings etc. For some reason today people only associate it with up close face shots, ala bruce gilden, but that's a very narrow interpretation. All cameras can be used for a variety of things and I wouldn't be turned off by what people think street photography is. If you want to see the M10 in action I suggested checking out photos on Flickr, which has a good variety of different kinds of shots, both landscape and more up close. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashkanani1985 Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share #11 Posted June 14, 2017 I shoot with the M-240 and M246 and find I can focus OK in low light. I did a comparison with my Df and found that I can do better in low light with the rangefinder than with the Df's groundglass. Often specular highlights can be found to focus on. Low light focus does take longer than in good light. If the subject is in motion it could be an issue, but should be fine for static ones. Should Leica release a multi-function hand grip for the M10 - the flash can be moved out of the hot shoe. Allegedly the required multi-function connector is present in the M10, hiding under a cover plate. Thank you Luke thats really a relief for me I have no problem with time to focus as most of my work is setup and have all the time to arrange for the shoot that I am looking for the way I work mostly inside houses of the people in the villages where I travel and flash is very important for me to use, I am worried that in that dark situation the rangefinder will be impossible to focus with, I know I can use the VIsoflex viewfinder but the problem if I use it there is no way to attach the flash trigger!? so any idea or thought about that topic will be really helpful? Leica makes an adjustable ttl flash bracket that plugs into a socket of the M-240's multifunction GPS handgrip. This way you can plug an electronic viewfinder into the flash shoe of the M-240 & have ttl or manual flash as well. Its not an M10 but it solves the issue you mention. The M10 doesn't have a multi function grip, as far as I know. I shoot with the M-240 and M246 and find I can focus OK in low light. I did a comparison with my Df and found that I can do better in low light with the rangefinder than with the Df's groundglass. Often specular highlights can be found to focus on. Low light focus does take longer than in good light. If the subject is in motion it could be an issue, but should be fine for static ones. Should Leica release a multi-function hand grip for the M10 - the flash can be moved out of the hot shoe. Allegedly the required multi-function connector is present in the M10, hiding under a cover plate. I've seen the multi grip for 240 and wished there is one for the m10 and now since Luke mention there is a multi grip connecter in the m10 thats a good thing, I've downloaded the M10 manual and tried to find if there is connecter under the plate for multi grip which gives hope that multi grip would be coming to m10 and couldn't find it.... anybody has M10 can confirm that the multi grip connectors are present in m10 plz ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tailwagger Posted June 14, 2017 Share #12 Posted June 14, 2017 one thing really confuse me that every where I go I find Leica M attached to street photography, why ? I mean it wouldn't be a perfect camera for environmental people life photography? or Landscape ? Mostly history. But worry not. Assuming you're satisfied with 25mp landscapes, there's nothing inherent in its design that prevents its use in any of those and many other pursuits. In fact, some of the nicest landscapes I've seen recently have been shot with the Monochrom. The variety, quality and availability of both modern and old glass, makes the M system capable of having any number of uses and personalities. Certainly the rangefinder, with its view beyond the frame of capture is useful for street, where it advantages the ability to anticipate timing of subjects moving in and out of the frame. but that same ability is just as useful for noticing that the some slight recomposition, taking a few steps back, brings an added element from outside the frame into it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashkanani1985 Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share #13 Posted June 14, 2017 Hi! I have owned both and been happy with SL 601 and M10. My SL 601 & SL24-90 is for shooting the event, activity, children ... with AF assisstance. My M10, M Apo 50 and M Lux 75 is for shooting the portrait, street life ... Have a good day! Thanks! I thought about the SL but than the size with 24-90 put me off, I came from DSLR and wanted to be light while traveling so going back to heavy wight will be doing nothing but I thought about using SL with M lenses which makes sense in the way I work so tomorrow I will pass to Leica Mayfair and try it with M lenses. when u use M lenses on the SL there is any auto magnification while focusing? does the camera read the lens data and apply correction? the lens data will be there in the exif data ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric1 Posted June 14, 2017 Share #14 Posted June 14, 2017 24mp is more than enough for landscape photos printed up to 16x24. If you're obsessed with printing bigger then you probably need something else to shoot with than a Leica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photon42 Posted June 14, 2017 Share #15 Posted June 14, 2017 What is your expectation regarding flash? TTL Flash was never the M's strongest point. On the M9 I remember it was error prone and laggy. Of course manual trigger just works fine, other than the accessory shoe then is taken and cannot be used for an additional finder. Maybe you try for yourself in a Leica Store. For me, the SL is too large, too heavy and too ugly. The lenses are only too large and too heavy. Certainly superb quality. If it has to be auto focus, good TTL flash support (Godox TT350 has a nice size) and very small system footprint, take a close look at the micro four thirds system, as Jaap hinted at already (PEN-F is small and beautiful, has in-body stabilisation and goes well with a Panasonic Leica 1.4/25). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 15, 2017 Share #16 Posted June 15, 2017 24mp is more than enough for landscape photos printed up to 16x24. If you're obsessed with printing bigger then you probably need something else to shoot with than a Leica.Many people print larger with an M. The camera is only one factor in a successful print workflow.... including viewing distance. And there's also the Leica S. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashkanani1985 Posted June 15, 2017 Author Share #17 Posted June 15, 2017 What is your expectation regarding flash? TTL Flash was never the M's strongest point. On the M9 I remember it was error prone and laggy. Of course manual trigger just works fine, other than the accessory shoe then is taken and cannot be used for an additional finder. Maybe you try for yourself in a Leica Store. For me, the SL is too large, too heavy and too ugly. The lenses are only too large and too heavy. Certainly superb quality. If it has to be auto focus, good TTL flash support (Godox TT350 has a nice size) and very small system footprint, take a close look at the micro four thirds system, as Jaap hinted at already (PEN-F is small and beautiful, has in-body stabilisation and goes well with a Panasonic Leica 1.4/25). Never used TTL flash even when it available in Canon, always manual so thats not a prob ..... m 4/3 system is ok but to be honest the reason I came to Leica is the magic in the color contrast that I found it only available in Leica and Canon comes very near to that so using another system is out of question now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 15, 2017 Share #18 Posted June 15, 2017 Many people print larger with an M. The camera is only one factor in a successful print workflow.... including viewing distance. And there's also the Leica S. Jeff Indeed. Printing technique is more important than MP count. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 15, 2017 Share #19 Posted June 15, 2017 ......................take a close look at the micro four thirds system, as Jaap hinted at already (PEN-F is small and beautiful, has in-body stabilisation and goes well with a Panasonic Leica 1.4/25). I second this in regards to the MFT system. After reading that Jaap was happy with his switch to the Panasonic GX8 I "trialed" one for a few days and I second his opinion, it's a great system with an awful lot to offer for the $$$$, the available Pana' lenses too are excellent. However I didn't get a GX8 at this time because I already have the GH4 which I use mainly for video work as a "B" camera on shoots but I have shot stills with it as well and have made several A2 sized prints from the images with no problems. For my usage the GX8 was too close to my GH4 to justify buying one. The GX8 has a larger "improved"sensor, pixel-wise, than the GH4 so it should do as well if not better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashkanani1985 Posted June 15, 2017 Author Share #20 Posted June 15, 2017 Today I've visited Leica Mayfair and tried both the SL and M10 and compare them on hand .... The SL really amazed it me to the point that I felt it is tailored made to my need The controls is amazing and the EVF is wooow and what really took my attention is M lenses on SL very easy to focus and the color is nothing but amazing ..... I think I found my match and SL with M lenses is the way to go as its is built for my needs in Travel photography and the dream of DSLR with the M lenses with the magic of Leica color comes to reality in this camera I thank you all for all your help and really appreciate your advices Thanx Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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