Leica SL buy or wait?

[Leicaiste]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I think the SL crons will address most of the size/weight issues that some have with the current SL native lenses.

From what I saw during the Photokina, the SL Summicron's are still big. Granted they are 67mm filter large instead of 82mm, but they are still long lenses and their lens shades will be quite big.

 

They are not M-Summicron's or even R-Summicron's that you can slip/squeeze in a jacket's pocket.

 

If you travel with two of them you will need a camera bag all day long. That's when a 24-90 suddenly becomes handy.

 

[emoji6]

[LocalHero1953]

From what I saw during the Photokina, the SL Summicron's are still big. Granted they are 67mm filter large instead of 82mm, but they are still long lenses and their lens shades will be quite big.

 

They are not M-Summicron's or even R-Summicron's that you can slip/squeeze in a jacket's pocket.

 

If you travel with two of them you will need a camera bag all day long. That's when a 24-90 suddenly becomes handy.

 

[emoji6]

This was my point in an earlier post. I have carried the SL and 24-90 all day for travel/street, and decided to stick to the M for that usage in future: just too heavy

[matnz]

The SL crons certainly aren't as small of the m crons, but should be a lighter, perhaps more discrete AF option when you don't need the focal range of the 24-90.  I really like my 24-90, it fits into a small shoulder bag for a day outing and whenever I think how big it looks beside my M9P and 35mm cron, I just remind myself of how big a bag I would need for a 24mm/28mm, 50mm, 75mm and 90mm m lenses to have the same range.

Edited April 10, 2017 by matnz

[wattsy]

of course...here..some motivation for you. lol

 

 

 

I imagine that lens is very good and the results are excellent but that combination at, I guess around £9000, must be the world's most expensive APS-C 10MP camera.   I must admit that when I gave serious thought to buying an SL as a replacement for my DSLR, part of my thinking was that the TL lenses (especially the 23/F2) might be useful companion lenses. However, although I often find the Leica brand like a siren calling, in the end I didn't have to tie myself to the mast to resist this particular temptation.

Edited April 10, 2017 by wattsy

[geetee1972]

 

I imagine that lens is very good and the results are excellent but that combination at, I guess around £9000, must be the world's most expensive APS-C 10MP camera.

 

[earleygallery]

LOL, I can just imagine the comments here if Canon or Nikon released a £9K 10MP APS-C camera.........

 

Whilst I can see the usefulness of being able to fit a TL lens onto your SL, if you happen to use both systems, I don't see the point in spending money to 'downgrade' your FF system to APS-C.

 

The fact that many SL users seem to like the TL lenses for a 'lighter carry about' AF option suggests that the SL isn't the right choice of camera if a 'carry about' is what you're after.

 

To the OP, I think you need to consider exactly what you want from the SL that you don't/can't get from your M. Then look carefully to see if the SL meets those needs. Of course if you just like the idea of owning an SL for no particular reason then go ahead and get one!

[caissa]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I would consider T lenses only for video - there they are perfect.

For photography there are many better options, I'd rather use an adapted AF lens as a temporary solution (maybe you lose some IQ, but certainly the loss is much smaller than the reduced resolution of 10 MP) . If you already have it, use it, but not if you buy it only for using it that way. Maybe you like the foreign lens better than expected in the end.  I love also to adapt manual lenses (R, M, Contax, Zeiss, tilt-shift, macro, etc.)

Adapt the lens best suited for the job, not necessarily a Leica lens (T or S, often better R and M) (unless you have it already). There are many options in EOS and also some in Nikon mount usable with the Novoflex AF adapters.

There is no easy rule - it depends on the details (your preferred focal length) which lens is the best suited.

 

Of course it is your personal choice - but seeing the SL mainly as an AF enhancement to the M is the wrong viewpoint for me. It is very strong for manual focus, even better (more precise) than the M (e.g. Noctilux). For me it is mainly widening the focal range (11 to 800) and the lens selection choice and offering more control (preview options).

Edited April 10, 2017 by caissa

[Enbee]

I believe it would, though I'm neither a pro nor a wedding shooter. I use it for musical performance, portraits and community groups. So similar sort of usage, with need for AF.

Assuming you get results you are happy with.

[Enbee]

I would consider T lenses only for video - there they are perfect.

For photography there are many better options, I'd rather use an adapted AF lens as a temporary solution (maybe you lose some IQ, but certainly the loss is much smaller than the reduced resolution of 10 MP) . If you already have it, use it, but not if you buy it only for using it that way. Maybe you like the foreign lens better than expected in the end. I love also to adapt manual lenses (R, M, Contax, Zeiss, tilt-shift, macro, etc.)

Adapt the lens best suited for the job, not necessarily a Leica lens (T or S, often better R and M) (unless you have it already). There are many options in EOS and also some in Nikon mount usable with the Novoflex AF adapters.

There is no easy rule - it depends on the details (your preferred focal length) which lens is the best suited.

 

Of course it is your personal choice - but seeing the SL mainly as an AF enhancement to the M is the wrong viewpoint for me. It is very strong for manual focus, even better (more precise) than the M (e.g. Noctilux). For me it is mainly widening the focal range (11 to 800) and the lens selection choice and offering more control (preview options).

I agree with that it can't just be an AF but it's one of the main factors. I would hopefully be using my M lenses on it as well.

[caissa]

To give you an idea, I use a R 4/35-70 Macro as an easy walk-around zoom, or a Contax 3.4/35-70. Or a simple R 2/50 lens.  (Excellent !) Or lately even a EF 1.8/50 STM (with Novoflex EOS AF adapter).

If I need highest quality, then I take the burden and use a heavy native lens (SL 50 or SL 90-280).

Edited April 10, 2017 by caissa

[earleygallery]

That's the real USP for the SL, the ability to use a very wide range of lenses from many manufacturers. As a 'digital back' it makes a lot of sense.

[Jayesh Mehta]

To give you an idea, I use a R 4/35-70 Macro as an easy walk-around zoom, or a Contax 3.4/35-70. Or a simple R 2/50 lens.  (Excellent !) Or lately even a EF 1.8/50 STM (with Novoflex EOS AF adapter).

If I need highest quality, then I take the burden and use a heavy native lens (SL 50 or SL 90-280).

 

My experience with the Novoflex EOS-SL adapter has been a deeply unhappy one - other than being able to use Zeiss Otus 55 and 85. I have not used the ZOs because I use the Summilux-M 50/1.4 and Summicron-M 90/2 on the SL instead. Much more compact. AF either does not work at all or is totally inconsistent. Sometimes the camera-lens combination goes dead. This is true with a wide variety of Canon lenses (but not the 50 STM which I don't have) and with firmware 2.2.

 

I don't have a native SL lens but very happy using the M lenses I have (28/2, 50/1.4, 50/0.95, 90/2 - the last 2 being unusable for me on the M9P).

 

Also, I recently rented the Hasselblad X1D with a couple of lenses for a few days. Slow to start, slow to respond, tacky feel, buggy, hung up inconsistently. Absolutely no competition for the SL at all despite the larger sensor. Resisting the temptation to buy the X1D and renting it was a very sound financial decision!

[caissa]

Knowing how difficult it is (technically) to implement a fast reliable AF, it is wise using an AF adapter differently than a native lens or a mechanical adapter/mechanical lens. Technically we know that there must be problems, as the SL uses CDAF, while the AF lenses are built for cameras with PDAF.

My view: I am surprised that there are some AF lenses that work "really" well when adapted to the SL. The best news: All adapted lenses (with or w/o AF) work very nicely optically ! The sensor (microlens geometry) is very tolerant.

 

Often users have no idea how fast/slow or reliably the lens works on its native body (e.g. in bad light). But then the user expects "only the best" when attached to the SL ...      It's probably nice to have the attitude "I expect only the best" for people you meet, but for AF this is definitely a bad starting point.

It is mainly a matter of setting the right expectations, to avoid frustration. (glass half full or half empty)

 

(To set the right expectations, you could use a Sony or Fuji camera with adapted lenses (and different AF adapters) and find out about the restrictions). And for preparation it is definitely useful to study compatibility lists in detail (and unfortunately the detail is exactly what is often missing). Often even the "native" adapters do not work flawlessly with all existing lenses (EOS to EOS M, or Sigma (EOS) adapter for NEX).

Edited April 10, 2017 by caissa

[RoySmith]

of course...here..some motivation for you. lol

 

 

 

Alex,

 

Which wrist strap is the one in this photo ? I like it.

 

Roy

[tom0511]

If I wanted a SL (and didnt have one allready) I would buy a used one now. Live is too short to allways wait for the next generation.

[R3D-D0T]

My experience with the Novoflex EOS-SL adapter has been a deeply unhappy one - other than being able to use Zeiss Otus 55 and 85. I have not used the ZOs because I use the Summilux-M 50/1.4 and Summicron-M 90/2 on the SL instead. Much more compact. AF either does not work at all or is totally inconsistent. Sometimes the camera-lens combination goes dead. This is true with a wide variety of Canon lenses (but not the 50 STM which I don't have) and with firmware 2.2.

 

I don't have a native SL lens but very happy using the M lenses I have (28/2, 50/1.4, 50/0.95, 90/2 - the last 2 being unusable for me on the M9P).

 

Also, I recently rented the Hasselblad X1D with a couple of lenses for a few days. Slow to start, slow to respond, tacky feel, buggy, hung up inconsistently. Absolutely no competition for the SL at all despite the larger sensor. Resisting the temptation to buy the X1D and renting it was a very sound financial decision!

 

 

Yeah the laggy X1D is what made me consider the SL because at least the software there is better. But the IQ just doesn't compare to the SL (and again, that price and weight...)

[Cliff S]

The issues with the X1D are going to be resolved soon. The problem was getting it out if the gate after a huge delay. Hardware before firmware was the choice.

 

The latest firmware, while shooting RAW only has significantly reduced lag. I find only the focus speed needs improvement to being it to SL and Q class AF.

 

The X1D is what the SL should've been IMO. Much easier and quicker to use in the sense that it's much more Leica M like than the SL. Instant access to manual focus while in auto mode. No buttons to press and hold. AE-L is a dream in that it stays pressed so no need to hold. Manual 10x is like the M - just turn the focus and it magnifies. No buttons to press.

 

And the pictures it takes leave me speechless. The tonal gradation, IQ and 3D depth are spectacular. Suffice to say my SL has been given to my son who loves buttons. And weight and size.

 

So my stable is the M10 and X1D.

Edited April 10, 2017 by Cliff S

[AlexP]

Alex,

 

Which wrist strap is the one in this photo ? I like it.

 

Roy

http://lancecamerastraps.com/string-loop-wrist/

[LocalHero1953]

Assuming you get results you are happy with.

I do. The aspects that impress me most are the EVF, the speed of AF with both lenses, the speed of response to the trigger (with no noticeable blackout), and IQ and colours, which are superior to the M240, but are superseded by the M10, so I'm told.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[AlexP]

Bottom line, SL is not a perfect camera. Would other alternatives that cost much less do more? absolutely. 

 

BUT, would it fun to own one? ABSOLUTELY. :wub: :wub: