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M10: sell or keep the M246

thomi

By thomi
in Leica M10

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Ted Lemon

Ted Lemon

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Good reasoning. What you are waiting for will probably be called an MP 440 and not an M11. But I'm curious anyway how they're gonna manage the nomenclatura

 

Don't know if you get the British Journal of Photography (BJP) but in the latest issue they have a full review of the M10 and touch on the naming. Apparently, the 240/246 nomenclature was a big mistake, according to Stefan Daniels, and M10 to 11 is very likely.   

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marcg
marcg

Surely this is going to be a discussion which will continue ad infinitum. At some point the M10 Monochrom will be released, then the M11 which will produce the debate as to whether the M10M is better

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I had both and sold the M10 as I primarily shoot black and white on the M246. I was curious how conversions would be with it and while they were very good, not in the same league as the M246.

MarkP
MarkP

And more detail and tonality at lower ISO in all the Monochroms.   I've sold my M240, ordered an M10, but am keeping my Monochrom v1.

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otto.f

otto.f

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what is art to you?

 

well, for instance the colors and the character of noise/grain of the M10 have more potential for art-photography than those aspects of the M9, how wonderfull the M9 is in any way. This is my experience of a small month working with the M10

Edited by otto.f
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wolfloid

wolfloid

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Amount of detail is only important for NASA or NSA....  if you make art, its irrelevant

 

 

Well, then why not just stick to an iPhone. Really, can't you ask yourself why some people want to use an MF camera? It might also be for the tones, but it is also for the resolution. As for 'making art' - is this what you do?

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wolfloid

wolfloid

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Going back to the two images - even at the sizes offered here, there is a very clear difference between the two. The one on the right (M246) is much crisper and sharper, with clearer detail. It also has sharper grain, which could be said to look more 'filmic'. If that is what you want/need for your particular work/size of output etc., then the other seems lacking.

 

However, it would interest me to see the M10 image sharpened up with a little more contrast to see whether the difference is still as noticeable. Is there much difference left after they have both been worked on to give an acceptably sharp and contrasty image?

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anickpick

anickpick

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Going back to the two images - even at the sizes offered here, there is a very clear difference between the two. The one on the right (M246) is much crisper and sharper, with clearer detail. It also has sharper grain, which could be said to look more 'filmic'. If that is what you want/need for your particular work/size of output etc., then the other seems lacking.

 

However, it would interest me to see the M10 image sharpened up with a little more contrast to see whether the difference is still as noticeable. Is there much difference left after they have both been worked on to give an acceptably sharp and contrasty image?

 

 

Well, the M246 delivers about the same resolution at ISO 6400 as at ISO 320.

The M10 does better than any other 24mp color camera on the market, but still has to "deal with" the bayer matrix.

 

Having said this, from my experience the difference between the two cameras at ISO 6400 is way smaller than it appears in those two images. 

Additionally, the images of the M10 at ISO 6400 are clearly more robust (can be pushed more) in post processing. 

 

Personally, I prefer the versatility of the M10, but for someone who only shoots b&w in somewhat controlled light situations, the M246 will still be the better camera.

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MarkP

MarkP

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The M246 is much better. It is not about the noise. It is the amazing amount of detail that is still retained in the M246 pictures even at very high iso.

 

 

And more detail and tonality at lower ISO in all the Monochroms.

 

I've sold my M240, ordered an M10, but am keeping my Monochrom v1.

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M10Alpine

M10Alpine

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But then you'd have to change your user name.

 

Jeff

 

 

Oui - But more realistically I guess I just have to buy a 246 again. I have  some feelers out. My point is that it will be missed sold i. Its a very special camera, so I would not recommend selling it. 

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Acousticlight

Acousticlight

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I absolutely love the tonal capabilities and detail of the MM246, and I am longing for the M10 after holding one at Leitz Park. No doubt it is nothing but a luxury to own both, but I won't get rid of my MM246 for the M10. The MM is, in my opinion, just unique and worth what it offers. At least with both bodies I could share lenses. Just my humble, happy opinion.

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helged

helged

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Dynamic range of the current Leica FF bodies/sensors, with the M246 at top (based on the the Photons2Photons measures). Whether the difference matters is in the eye of the beholder; I don't have the M10 but I enjoy the grain pattern and the micro-contrast of the M246.

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SiOnara

SiOnara

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Was shooting some B&W street photography in Barcelona recently using my M10.

Shooting at 16000 ISO on my 28mm Elmarit ASPH.  

Stunning results with a beautiful film grain like structure.  

 

I had a feeling I might hit banding at they high ISO but I'd say 90% of the shots were free of banding especially when exposed correctly.

I also found I could push the DNG files more then my M246 to open the shadow info without artefacts becoming a problem,

 

I will sell my M246 now as I feel the M10 is delivering everything I need for both colour and B&W.  

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olgierdc

olgierdc

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The M10 is not a MM but has a very good sensor. Should I sell the M246 and use the M10 for monochrome too?

 

I tested the two bodies with the same APO Summicron 50.

ISO 25k

F4

Shutter speed calculated for the M10: 1/350

Shutter speed calculated for the M246: 1/750 (because there is no Bayer Filter)

 

I could use half the ISO with the M246 to get the same shutter speed as with the M10.

 

Check the comparison: left picture M10 converted in Lightroom to monochrome; right picture M246

 

My Conclusion

 

The M10 is outstanding. Much better than the M240 at high ISO.

The M246 remains the reference for monochrome.

 

 

You have to choose. Flip the coin or sell 246 ;)

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SiOnara

SiOnara

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Example of M10 at 16000ISO using 28mm Elmarit ASPH.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

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SiOnara

SiOnara

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Crop of above image section showing grain and light/shadow area.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

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