hollisd Posted February 6, 2017 Share #1 Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Is there a graphic anywhere that shows frame lines for a .72x VF? I'm curious how the M10 VF looks for a given lens, say, a 35 or 50, could someone give me a novice explanation and/or graphic that shows what lines appear in the viewfinder with how much space around the margins? I've only looked through a Leica VF once and it was stunning but, for example, I don't understand, say, you're using a 35 cron, do frame lines come in pairs so you always see 2 or is this a setting or how does it work? Also I've heard of a frame lines selector but what is that? Apologies for the noob content but figure others may benefit from the forum's knowledge so thanks in advance. Edited February 6, 2017 by hollisd 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 6, 2017 Posted February 6, 2017 Hi hollisd, Take a look here Framelines. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
UliWer Posted February 6, 2017 Share #2 Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) You find a description with graphics in the M10 Manual, english Version p. 158f. https://de.leica-camera.com/Fotografie/Leica-M/Leica-M10/Downloads They always appear in pairs in the viewfinder: 28/90 mm; 35/135mm; 50/75mm. With the frame selector you can change the pairs you see in the viewfinder; e.g. you have a 50mm lens on your camera, showing the frames for 50/75mm but you want to see which field of view you get with 90mm - you select the other frames with the little lever which is on the front side under the viewfinder. You get the usual frames again, when you don't activate the lever. Edited February 6, 2017 by UliWer 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollisd Posted February 6, 2017 Author Share #3 Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) Why do they always appear in pairs? Why not just show what frame line corresponds to the mounted lens? In my view that would be simplicity in line with editing down to what is essential - if you're going to do this on the body why not simplify the VF too? Edited February 6, 2017 by hollisd Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalHero1953 Posted February 6, 2017 Share #4 Posted February 6, 2017 The limitations of mechanical engineering. They would need another three masks in the rangefinder mechanism, and the cams on the M lenses (the shapes on the end of the lens barrel that select which frame pairs are shown) would have to be changed - and so would no longer be backwards compatible. The cams on the 50 and 75 lenses are identical at present. Just imagine a programme of cam replacement to accommodate this change. We're stuck with design choices made 60-70 years ago! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted February 6, 2017 Share #5 Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) They could use the information from the 6bit coding but then the frames will have to be activated electronically and mechanically. Don't forget the frames also move mechanically with the focusing. Edited February 6, 2017 by Leicaiste 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted February 6, 2017 Share #6 Posted February 6, 2017 (edited) I see the 75mm frames are still as elusive as ever. [emoji6] Edited February 6, 2017 by Leicaiste Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 6, 2017 Share #7 Posted February 6, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Why do they always appear in pairs? Why not just show what frame line corresponds to the mounted lens? In my view that would be simplicity in line with editing down to what is essential - if you're going to do this on the body why not simplify the VF too? Do some research. If you google the relevant words you'll find all sorts of information and pictures/diagrams to show you how the rangefinder and viewfinder is assembled and works and then you will understand why it is how it is, and more importantly, why it would be very difficult for Leica to change it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmen Posted February 6, 2017 Share #8 Posted February 6, 2017 And have a look at these two amazingly informative threads http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/66999-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8-framelines/ http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/21079-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8/ This forum is stunning in terms of readily shared information! 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted February 6, 2017 Share #9 Posted February 6, 2017 Well, they could change it and avoid the pairing by going back to the original concept of the M2: only frames for 35, 50 and 90mm, each on it's own and separately activated by the different lenses. They do offer this as an option for their film M-bodies. Though, if we had this non-pairing 35-50-90-system as a rule, I wonder which threads were longer: those complaing about the cluttered viewfinder asking for simplicity or those complaing about the left-out frames for 28-75-135mm. If they offered a general frame option for every body they produce, the threads complaing about delivery times would certainly be the longest.- And there is some sort of interest in displaying many frames in the viewfinder on Leica's side as well: they are a constant inspiration to acquire a new lens for which you have an unused frame. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted February 6, 2017 Share #10 Posted February 6, 2017 And have a look at these two amazingly informative threads http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/66999-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8-framelines/ http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/21079-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8/ This forum is stunning in terms of readily shared information! You're welcome.... http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/268492-m10-fw-requests/?p=3201577 Jeff 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 17, 2017 Share #11 Posted March 17, 2017 Would it not be technically feasible to show the mm number according to the frame line so with the 28mm lenses, it would show 28 say in the left corner etc. I ask because I forget all the time which frameline matches the lens I put on! However thanks to UliWer above it would appear that if I remember 28, 35 50, are going to be the larger frameline, the 75, 90 and 135mm are going to be the smaller frames - I think my zired grey cells can remember it that way. If the mm figure was feasible somewhere in the frameline, there would be no need for me to remember or guess! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 17, 2017 Share #12 Posted March 17, 2017 Better to just use your camera and lenses more frequently. There are many other things that will become second nature.... frameline accuracy based on subject distance, metering results, zone of focus, etc. No need to mess up the VF more than now. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 17, 2017 Share #13 Posted March 17, 2017 Better to just use your camera and lenses more frequently. There are many other things that will become second nature.... frameline accuracy based on subject distance, metering results, zone of focus, etc. No need to mess up the VF more than now. Jeff Maybe you're right, I haven't had the M10 for 6 weeks yet...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 17, 2017 Share #14 Posted March 17, 2017 Indeed. Some bond with M photography quickly, some over time, and some not at all. But to really get to know it, one has to use it....a lot. Especially in manual mode. You might stick with one lens for a while and get to know it. And remember that on the M10 you have the benefit of a frame preview lever so that you can judge alternate framing without switching lenses. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff S Posted March 17, 2017 Share #15 Posted March 17, 2017 My system is 35 is with 135. Then the rest are obvious. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustafasoleiman Posted March 20, 2017 Share #16 Posted March 20, 2017 Is there a way to stop the frame lines from changing brightness automatically? Alex Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted March 20, 2017 Share #17 Posted March 20, 2017 I looked for this, but couldn't find it. You can switch the changing brightness of the display off, but I don't think there is anything for the framelines. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBJ2 Posted April 7, 2018 Share #18 Posted April 7, 2018 And have a look at these two amazingly informative threads http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/66999-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8-framelines/ http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/21079-anatomy-of-the-leica-m8/ This forum is stunning in terms of readily shared information! Very helpful ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
raphael Posted January 18, 2019 Share #19 Posted January 18, 2019 Wait... what? On my M10 the frame lines do not move/shift when focusing. Is my M10 broken? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted January 18, 2019 Share #20 Posted January 18, 2019 The frame lines should move subtly on diagonal from top left to lower right, but the focus patch stays put. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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