LocalHero1953 Posted April 6, 2017 Share #421 Posted April 6, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Me thinks..its is a stills...computer... Agreed - the slippery slope started when someone invented a lightmeter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 6, 2017 Posted April 6, 2017 Hi LocalHero1953, Take a look here So how long before video capture functionality arrives?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted April 6, 2017 Share #422 Posted April 6, 2017 Agreed - the slippery slope started when someone invented a lightmeter. Reminds me of a Leica workshop organized in the same hotel as mine last century. All participants had a Leica M. So had i but my M4-2 had a Leicameter... I still remember the glance of the workshop host, an HCB's disciple i respected very much. What a shame my friends! Das Wesentliche before its time . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted April 6, 2017 Share #423 Posted April 6, 2017 Reminds me of a Leica workshop organized in the same hotel as mine last century. All participants had a Leica M. So had i but my M4-2 had a Leicameter... I still remember the glance of the workshop host, an HCB's disciple i respected very much. What a shame my friends! Das Wesentliche before its time . Brilliant, you can take video out of M but you will still not satisfy traditionalist until manual re-cock lever is reintroduced. It was just like yesterday and following one of the firmware updates that we had bitter trench warfare argument here on LUF for and against merits of Auto ISO on M240. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted April 6, 2017 Share #424 Posted April 6, 2017 I agree... I tend to just ignore those members nowadays. Life is too short and there is little point trying to bring them into the 21st century. We have what we have, and actually, its fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted April 6, 2017 Share #425 Posted April 6, 2017 I will be taking my SL (with the 24-90 zoom) & M-A (with Noct and 28 & 21 Summiluxes) to Israel with me next week. A perfect kit - all the electronic wizardry I could want, and a fabulous film camera. Video - covered. I haven't taken much video with the SL, so this will be a steep learning curve for me. I'm attending a weeding, so I will either use the zoom (and suffer the intrusion) or the Noct. I know it will be sub-par (for the video purists), but ti will be good enough, I hope. Cheers John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted April 6, 2017 Share #426 Posted April 6, 2017 Brilliant, you can take video out of M but you will still not satisfy traditionalist until manual re-cock lever is reintroduced. It was just like yesterday and following one of the firmware updates that we had bitter trench warfare argument here on LUF for and against merits of Auto ISO on M240. I do remember that Auto ISO discussion. Now after it is implemented on M240 as I wanted, and I am happy, I am able to see (I think) the point traditionalists were making. I have come to realize that many people don't like change. Praise for M10's direct ISO control by traditionalists is also one such example. People who didn't use "auto" anything aren't going to start going auto all of a sudden. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted April 7, 2017 Share #427 Posted April 7, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) I will be taking my SL (with the 24-90 zoom) & M-A (with Noct and 28 & 21 Summiluxes) to Israel with me next week. A perfect kit - all the electronic wizardry I could want, and a fabulous film camera. Video - covered. I haven't taken much video with the SL, so this will be a steep learning curve for me. I'm attending a weeding, so I will either use the zoom (and suffer the intrusion) or the Noct. I know it will be sub-par (for the video purists), but ti will be good enough, I hope. Cheers John Have fun on your trip... however remember that if you don't shoot enough video then it may be disabled at some point and you will be forced to use iPhone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted April 7, 2017 Share #428 Posted April 7, 2017 Brilliant, you can take video out of M but you will still not satisfy traditionalist until manual re-cock lever is reintroduced. It was just like yesterday and following one of the firmware updates that we had bitter trench warfare argument here on LUF for and against merits of Auto ISO on M240. Ahhh a new derogatory label - traditionalist - for those of us who actually think about what the benefits of incorporating new technologies actually are. So arguments about implementation of a potentially 'poor' video system into a body which is ergonomically unsuited to video are traditionalist. And any discussion of auto ISO is really about automatic systems, not auto ISO at all - the question being whether a mechanical camera actually benefits from any auto systems at all - not the word benefits - it is key to any meaningful discussion, and such discussions seem to becoming rarer - entrenched views are in the ascendency it appears. Look, the M camera system had no automation (except flash) until the M7 appeared. And some fabulous photographs were taken using M cameras. So has automation improved the images produced since the M7 and increased automation? Modifying tools for the sake of modification and marketing is different from modifying their usability. To me the M system requires a fundamentally different approach to its use than Canon/Canon dSLR, Sony Mirrorless or virtually any other system on the market today. IMO its strengths lie in not competing and there are photographers who will always welcome a distinctly different approach and use it because it has no video, not auto ISO and so on. I've just been handed some boxes of photographic books to sell - mostly older books or by/about older well-known photographers. Despite the difficulties of shooting manual, mechanical cameras and using film including sheet and glass, the photographs are often stunning. We, the photographer, remain the limiting factor. Like I said in an earlier post - you could fit a video system in a watch no doubt (someone probably has). "Traditionalists' would object, and no doubt be accused of blocking progress by some. But the question is not about tradition, its actually about viability - sure the technology exists, but is it relevant to apply it (especially if poorly implemented) everywhere it is possible to do so? Decide for yourself. Ad FWIW, manual re-cocking might have the advantage of saving battery power which could be useful if charging is difficult - go figure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsleica Posted April 7, 2017 Share #429 Posted April 7, 2017 M10 is basically a stills computer in rangefinder clothing... Why not utilize the full capabilities of a computer system.. That means video too.. It would be more useful that way.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp995 Posted April 7, 2017 Share #430 Posted April 7, 2017 M10 is basically a stills computer in rangefinder clothing... Why not utilize the full capabilities of a computer system.. That means video too.. It would be more useful that way.. Product Marketing is not easy like that! Only if you have a single product ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stef63 Posted April 7, 2017 Share #431 Posted April 7, 2017 M10 is basically a stills computer in rangefinder clothing... Why not utilize the full capabilities of a computer system.. That means video too.. It would be more useful that way.. My dishwasher is also a computer system, It has wifi and connects to the internet etc. Why not utilise the full capabilities of a computer system? That means taking photopraphs and selfies too. It would be more useful that way ... Sorry, but this topic is going nowhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted April 7, 2017 Share #432 Posted April 7, 2017 My dishwasher is also a computer system, It has wifi and connects to the internet etc. Why not utilise the full capabilities of a computer system? That means taking photopraphs and selfies too. It would be more useful that way ... Sorry, but this topic is going nowhere. I will only use a Leica camera to was dishes if it is environmentally safe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted April 7, 2017 Share #433 Posted April 7, 2017 And how many megapixels does the dishwasher have? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlindstrom Posted April 10, 2017 Share #434 Posted April 10, 2017 WHAT?! NO VIDEO?! Oh, it's an M camera.. nvm, carry on ;-) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted April 10, 2017 Share #435 Posted April 10, 2017 We are on page 22 and no video yet... I will be back on page 50.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted April 10, 2017 Share #436 Posted April 10, 2017 Ad FWIW, manual re-cocking might have the advantage of saving battery power which could be useful if charging is difficult - go figure. I don't really have an opinion on traditionalism and features (I have lots of opinions about features . . . However, this last statement I think I can illuminate slightly: When doing some testing of frequent (not continuous) shooting I took 2,437 images in about an hour and a quarter shooting DNG+JPG (that's a 64gb card and a 16gb card), after which the battery was still 55% full. If the battery will accommodate something like 5,000 releases with one battery, then it seems to me inconceivable that having a manual re-cocking would help with this materially - in fact, to take so many images with a manual re-cock of the shutter would take considerably longer, and it seems to me that having the camera switched on is what uses the battery (not releasing the shutter). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted April 11, 2017 Share #437 Posted April 11, 2017 Ahhh a new derogatory label - traditionalist - for those of us who actually think about what the benefits of incorporating new technologies actually are. So arguments about implementation of a potentially 'poor' video system into a body which is ergonomically unsuited to video are traditionalist. And any discussion of auto ISO is really about automatic systems, not auto ISO at all - the question being whether a mechanical camera actually benefits from any auto systems at all - not the word benefits - it is key to any meaningful discussion, and such discussions seem to becoming rarer - entrenched views are in the ascendency it appears. Look, the M camera system had no automation (except flash) until the M7 appeared. And some fabulous photographs were taken using M cameras. So has automation improved the images produced since the M7 and increased automation? Modifying tools for the sake of modification and marketing is different from modifying their usability. To me the M system requires a fundamentally different approach to its use than Canon/Canon dSLR, Sony Mirrorless or virtually any other system on the market today. IMO its strengths lie in not competing and there are photographers who will always welcome a distinctly different approach and use it because it has no video, not auto ISO and so on. I've just been handed some boxes of photographic books to sell - mostly older books or by/about older well-known photographers. Despite the difficulties of shooting manual, mechanical cameras and using film including sheet and glass, the photographs are often stunning. We, the photographer, remain the limiting factor. Like I said in an earlier post - you could fit a video system in a watch no doubt (someone probably has). "Traditionalists' would object, and no doubt be accused of blocking progress by some. But the question is not about tradition, its actually about viability - sure the technology exists, but is it relevant to apply it (especially if poorly implemented) everywhere it is possible to do so? Decide for yourself. Ad FWIW, manual re-cocking might have the advantage of saving battery power which could be useful if charging is difficult - go figure. There is nothing derogatory about being traditionalist, the way I see it one is not embracing what latest technology can offer by conviction but either convenience or lack of alternative. Sometime we hear odd technical comments, out of sheer love for the object of ones adoration like about absence of re-cock leaver. Thankfully "Maxim Machine Gun" endurance test performed by Jono shines new light on the capabilities of camera electric systems. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Mandeville Posted April 11, 2017 Share #438 Posted April 11, 2017 The problem with terms like "traditionalist" is that they attempt to categorize people into neat little boxes and then are used to make assumptions about those people. Unfortunately, people rarely fit so neatly into such categories. I prefer the smaller size, manual ISO knob, lack of video, simplified user interface, and focus on the fundamentals of photography of the M10. Some would want to use those preferences to categorize me as a traditionalist or a purist. But I also have no problems with EVF, Live View, chimping, auto-ISO, exposure compensation, and other modern technology that aids in the pursuit of photography. So I don't fit so neatly into the box that others may try to put me in. Honestly, I just want the best digital compact rangefinder still photography camera for my particular needs and preferences that I can buy. The M10 is the closest to that mark that I have seen so far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted April 11, 2017 Share #439 Posted April 11, 2017 There is nothing derogatory about being traditionalist..... It depends on the inference being made. Photography has changed and offers many more possibilities. But, just because something is possible doesn't mean that it is going to make something better. And there is a lot of difference between trying to explain this, and not being open to new ideas (the inference). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted April 11, 2017 Share #440 Posted April 11, 2017 Appealing only to so-called young people who have low aspirations is not Leica's market goal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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