SL and S - which you use for what occasion

[tom0511]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

good evening,

as an owner of both systems (and also M and T ;(   ) I wondered how others do use these cameras.

 

For my part I believe to see this extra wow/smoothness/pop in IQ of S images, even though SL IQ also seem "fine/excellent",

I enjoy the primes on the S, but also using primes adds up bulk (weight when being outside), the 24-90 SL can "replace" the focal length range of bringing 3 primes for the S.

I prefer the OVF of the S but then I like the face detection of the SL and being able to move arounf focus points.

 

So for now I use the SL when I need speed/flexibility, and the S when I want the best possible IQ.

 

so whats your guys experience?

 

[Jeff S]

There's also the zoom for the S, for a blend of convenience/IQ, but my tests showed that the S006 lacks the ISO range to make up for the slow-ish zoom for handheld work in all but good daylight conditions (and the beautiful VF goes half black at the slower end).  The faster S007 surely would have made the S zoom better and more practical for me.....but price-wise, the combination was no longer as attractive when considering the alternative SL and 24-90, which I think may be better optically (and/or corrected better on the SL).

 

So, the jury is still out for me on the best complement to my M system for high IQ and wider/longer lenses.  The SL remains in the running, but so does the upcoming X1D and GFX, both of which may offer high IQ in a smaller and more affordable package than the S.  Only time will determine if those systems meet my needs....and come without their own reliability issues that we've seen with the S system.

 

Jeff

[Guest VVJ]

My S2P is mainly collecting dust in a closet somewhere.  I pretty much use the SL for everything now (when not using Q or T).

[Bill W]

I have both plus too much other stuff. Since getting the SL I will sell my Nikon gear. At least that is what I promised the boss.....!

[Likaleica]

I'll keep my S lenses for the 80mp 008 (no, I don't have any inside information and am not trying to start a rumor).  But the SL is so great and versatile that I rarely bring out the S.  To me, the S is a tripod camera, while the SL is an all-purpose hand-held camera.

[tom0511]

I have used the S006 and even more the S007 a lot handheld as well, but one is forced to shoot a lot at wider apartures.

I still wish the SL had a cropped S007 sensor, and more primes would be available (really looking forward to the SUmmicrons)

[Vieri]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I do Landscape, so obviously my setup might not apply to other kind of photography. I have both the S 007 and the SL in my bag at all times. I also have an S-Adapter L to use my S lenses on the SL. Since the S's files are beautiful, I use the S whenever I can: when I am shooting at focal lengths of 19mm FOV equivalent and above, and with shutter speeds up to one minute. Use the SL for ultra-wide angle shots, and for exposures longer than one minute. If Leica took out the long exposure limitation in the next S (007) FW, that would make it the PERFECT landscape camera; as it is, I need to bring and use the SL as well to cover for the S's limitations (and as a backup, of course). Hope this helps Best,

 

Vieri

[tom0511]

Thanks Vieri,

Used the SL today in sunny weather with snow and must say I still prefer a good OVF (like that of the S) over the SL for most things.

I -like you- feel that for anything static the S is outstanding.

[Guest VVJ]

Hi Tom/Vieri,

 

No offense but I have to ask this question...

 

Is there a lot of difference in image quality between the S2 (which I own) files and the S006 and/or S007 files?

 

I am asking because in these forums a fair amount of S-owners seem to attribute otherworldly and heavenly qualities to their S system and I am very honestly not seeing that...

 

My S2P produces good files but honestly so did my old trustworthy Phase One P30+...

 

The (slightly) larger sensor might provide some more depth and smoother transitions to some images under some circumstances but it is all very subtle...

 

Just trying to understand here... for completeness I should also add that I do not shoot landscapes...

 

Thanks, Joris.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Well the S2 has about 12 stops of dynamic range. That's about what a good micro 4/3 sensor has. The type 007 gets close to 15 stops. No 35mm sensor has close to that. That's a huge difference. The 007 is also much better at retaining DR and colour as well as lower noise at high ISO's.

 

In the situations where the CCD sensor shines you might argue the difference is small and down to colour interpretation but when the light falls or scene contrast increases you'll see a difference. In a studio where you have total control you won't see much difference in image quality at all. In fact the CCD mightn seem a little bit more crisp and have more "bite" in controlled conditions.

 

Since your Phase has similar sensor size and tech to the S2 I'm not surprised it looked similar. The S007 looks different. However both are mini MF systems so don't look like real medium format. But they also look different to 35mm.

 

Plus the S system has S lenses. Until the Otus line up matches it (or the SL) there's not much around in 35mm land that does what the S (and some other MF) lenses do.

 

Gordon

[tom0511]

For me the min benefit of the S007 was to be able to shoot 1600 ISO and higher, and a little faster response. DR is better but I never had a problem with DR of the S006 at lower ISO. So for me as a handheld shooter the 007 just gives me more flexibility if the light is not bright.

[Vieri]

Thanks Vieri,

Used the SL today in sunny weather with snow and must say I still prefer a good OVF (like that of the S) over the SL for most things.

I -like you- feel that for anything static the S is outstanding.

 

Tom,

 

to me the OVF of the S is probably the best OVF ever made. However, there is a case to be made for the use of EVF for landscape photography if you use filters (as I do); with the SL's EVF, which is great as far as EVFs go, I can use ND up to 6 - 10 stops AND see my image, which makes it quick and easy to adjust composition / focus / replace Grad NDs and the like without having to take out the filter holder and / or the ND filter. This is extremely useful in the field, especially when you don't have time and / or are in an uncomfortable place where the less you fiddle, the better (camera very low, camera very high, in the sea, on a cliff's edge, etc etc).

 

Best,

 

Vieri

[Vieri]

Hi Tom/Vieri,

 

No offense but I have to ask this question...

 

Is there a lot of difference in image quality between the S2 (which I own) files and the S006 and/or S007 files?

 

I am asking because in these forums a fair amount of S-owners seem to attribute otherworldly and heavenly qualities to their S system and I am very honestly not seeing that...

 

My S2P produces good files but honestly so did my old trustworthy Phase One P30+...

 

The (slightly) larger sensor might provide some more depth and smoother transitions to some images under some circumstances but it is all very subtle...

 

Just trying to understand here... for completeness I should also add that I do not shoot landscapes...

 

Thanks, Joris.

 

Hi Joris,

 

see Gordon's answer. Contrarily to you, I almost only shoot landscape, so of course YMMV; in large prints, the tonal transition, clarity and colours of the S lenses do stand out to me compared to Phase (I had P45+ and P65+), Leaf (I had the 12R II), which I used both with Phase lenses and with a Linhof Techno with Schenider and Rodenstock lenses. Comparing S files with 35mm, the differences in tonality, clarity and colours are even more apparent (I used D800E, D3, D2x, Sigma DP1, 2 and 3 Merrill, Sigma SD1 Merrill); comparing them with APS-C (I had the Fuji X-Pro 1, Sony Nex-7 with various lenses) is frankly laughable if you print large.

 

That said, it all depends on where and how you display your images: if you just display your work online and / or generally just on screens, perhaps using browsers with so-so color profiling and using compressed Jpegs at 1500-2000px max on the long side, most differences tend to disappear and the field tend to get levelled out - but this is true for any cameras, not just for the S.

 

Hope this helps, best

 

Vieri

[Likaleica]

Just looked through your website, Vieri.  Very nice.  Really, very nice.

[Vieri]

Just looked through your website, Vieri.  Very nice.  Really, very nice.

 

Thank you very much Tim for taking the time to browse my website and for your kind comment, much appreciated indeed Best,

 

Vieri