BerndReini Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1381 Posted January 12, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Not misguided for me, I agree that a lot of the extra weight of the M240 is due to the battery but the extra girth of all the digital M cameras is a negative factor, again, for me, I know that many like the extra width. I love the size of Leica M film cameras and if the M10 is the same or similar size I may not be able to resist. I agree with you on the difference between a film body and a digital M. I was only referring to the discussions about the size of the M240 vs the M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 12, 2017 Posted January 12, 2017 Hi BerndReini, Take a look here Leica M 10. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1382 Posted January 12, 2017 As it stands, the 'M10' looks pretty well like the M240 i was expecting four years ago. It would interest me if it could free me from using both an RF and a TTL camera but it is still far from my A7s mod DR wise i suspect and i doubt that it can work 100% in silent mode as does the latter. I am willing to reconsider if i'm wrong of course and i remain open to good surprises anyway but i won't hold my breath for now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
imants Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1383 Posted January 12, 2017 As it stands, the 'M10' looks pretty well like the M240 i was expecting four years ago. It would interest me if it could free me from using both an RF and a TTL camera but it is still far from my A7s mod DR wise i suspect and i doubt that it can work 100% in silent mode as does the latter. I am willing to reconsider if i'm wrong of course and i remain open to good surprises anyway but i won't hold my breath for now. I have the feeling that you are right better to keep on breathing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1384 Posted January 12, 2017 Edward, your wife is definitely splendid . . . But would she really notice the sudden arrival of a new ISO knob? I hope not - mine certainly won't! Thank you on behalf of my wife, Jono You would be surprised how she can pick up any slight differences in the cameras' exteriors. She has no idea about the inner workings but even a different paint shade is easily spotted Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rramesh Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1385 Posted January 12, 2017 I still think it's a 36MP CCD, no EVF, no live view, going back to basics of what the M was with a more manageable size and superior low light performance. But a compromise could be a 36MP CMOS, newer external EVF with appropriate connectors, live view, still harking back to what the M was with a more manageable size and superior low light performance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Distagon Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1386 Posted January 12, 2017 Doesn't the substantial dispute in this respect concern the question of whether the iso setting on a digital camera is in fact a shooting parameter?Yes, fair point.My experience has been that the M240's sensor is not ISO invariant: increasing ISO in camera provides a better result than pushing the same amount in post. So I do tend to use ISO in variable light conditions. If it were ISO invariant, the ISO dial would be less useful. The M10 will have a different sensor, so who outside of Leica knows how important ISO control in camera will be? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbuckley Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1387 Posted January 12, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) I agree that the differences between the M and SL/Q sensors are too small to be called a serious upgrade. Let's hope the surprise is in that department. Some wizardry in the VF/RF would be appreciated as well. Jaap - I have spent a lot of time over the past six months going back and forth among the SL, Mono-246, and MP-240. I think there is a very noticeable upgrade in the sensor from the Ms to the SL. The SL sensor output is brighter, in a good way. So the fact that this M is reputed to have the SL sensor is very encouraging to me. Speaking of the SL, I've configured it so I have to use one of the buttons to call up ISO, but can adjust exposure compensation while looking through the EVF. I find it really helpful to do that, and so while I appreciate the ISO dial, I really hope there is some way of being able to visualize, through the new EVF, changes in exposure compensation. As someone who has shot exclusively with Ms for more than 15 years until getting the SL earlier this year, that option proved a revelation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1388 Posted January 12, 2017 FWIW....DXO comparison.... https://www.dxomark.com/Reviews/Leica-SL-sensor-review-Best-performing-Leica-to-date/Comparison-1-Leica-SL-Typ-601-vs-Leica-Q-Typ-116-vs-Leica-M-Typ-240-Excellent-DR-at-high-ISOs Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CYBORA Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1389 Posted January 12, 2017 FWIW....DXO comparison.... https://www.dxomark.com/Reviews/Leica-SL-sensor-review-Best-performing-Leica-to-date/Comparison-1-Leica-SL-Typ-601-vs-Leica-Q-Typ-116-vs-Leica-M-Typ-240-Excellent-DR-at-high-ISOs Jeff Is M240 really better than SL in low light as shown here, how is your real world experience ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1390 Posted January 12, 2017 Is M240 really better than SL in low light as shown here, how is your real world experience ?Dont say that....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CYBORA Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1391 Posted January 12, 2017 Dont say that....... Should I understand that it is true ? Most people here don't count on DXO analysis, therefore your real world experiences will guide us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1392 Posted January 12, 2017 Is M240 really better than SL in low light as shown here, how is your real world experience ? According to my experience the SL is better by half a stop at high ISO but the M240 is better at medium ISO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeralCoton Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1393 Posted January 12, 2017 While I like the idea of an ISO knob, cutting off the corner and sticking a k on there see,s rather inelegant design. It could be moved in. Or,almwear if the detente isn't firm. I suppose it is hardening back to the rewind lever, but that was angled and better integrated in the design. I do like the alleged back buttons as they are more ergonomic. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1394 Posted January 12, 2017 For a serious reason to upgrade -sensorwise- the M10 should really better these three substantially. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
anickpick Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1395 Posted January 12, 2017 According to my experience the SL is better by half a stop at high ISO but the M240 is better at medium ISO. The dxo comparison actually shows that the Q and SL have 1.5 to 2 stops higher dynamic range at ISO 3200 than the M (raw files, not jpeg) ! In my experience, the SL shows less noise than the M at higher ISO by about one stop. But this is not the whole story: The SL files can be pushed further than the M files by approx. two stops at higher ISO. The M files are prone to banding, the SL files are not (since Firmware Update 2.0 or so). With the M, I try to stay at ISO 1600 max. in order to have some room in post. With the SL, I comfortably shoot at ISO 6400. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
anickpick Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1396 Posted January 12, 2017 I would be very happy if the M10 featured the SL sensor. However, I actually believe the M10 will feature the M240 sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xixi_gelly Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1397 Posted January 12, 2017 I just don't get the handwringing over the ISO dial when there are countless threads gushing about the aesthetic beauty of the film MP, M2, M3 and, indeed, praising the look of that VERY EXACT round knurled design over the M4 M6 crank that adds a slanted surface on the corner. But put the same thing on a digital body and it's suddenly hideous? To me that dial is a lovely homage to the classic M rangefinder. If I were a Leica industrial designer I would rip my hair out trying to please everyone on this forum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Distagon Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1398 Posted January 12, 2017 Something tells me that these leaks are very deliberate in what they reveal. Keep the buzz going, right? Absolutely. People don't magically get hold of pre-release cameras to publish as they see fit. It's all marketing, and well done too. Who's going to be paying attention on 18 January? Everyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
david strachan Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1399 Posted January 12, 2017 According to my experience the SL is better by half a stop at high ISO but the M240 is better at medium ISO. But who cares?? Sorry Edward, do we want everything to look like it's HDR forced. Not me...I'll pull the shadows a bit, if necessary and control the bright-bits in camera. I'm just so over DR discussions. all best, I mean no disrespect, cheers.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cirke Posted January 12, 2017 Share #1400 Posted January 12, 2017 But who cares?? Sorry Edward, do we want everything to look like it's HDR forced. Not me...I'll pull the shadows a bit, if necessary and control the bright-bits in camera. I'm just so over DR discussions. all best, I mean no disrespect, cheers.. who cares ? everybody ! If you get extra stops it doesn't look at all like HDR, you just get extra stops and more possibilities Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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