LD_50 Posted March 29, 2017 Share #121 Â Posted March 29, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) A lot of the Fuji updates simply bring them closer to the competition in feature set. They receive a lot more credit for updates than do companies who ship more finished products in the beginning. Â I would appreciate the updates but I can definitely say I would rather have a more complete product from day 1. The Nikon D# series is an example where I don't really recall many useful updates but the cameras were fast, reliable, and feature rich from day 1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 29, 2017 Posted March 29, 2017 Hi LD_50, Take a look here SL Firmware 3.0 update wishes. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jrp Posted March 29, 2017 Share #122 Â Posted March 29, 2017 Was there not a rumour some time ago that we could expect a further firmware update about now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRJohn Posted March 30, 2017 Author Share #123 Â Posted March 30, 2017 A lot of the Fuji updates simply bring them closer to the competition in feature set. They receive a lot more credit for updates than do companies who ship more finished products in the beginning. Â Â Â I was expecting a response like this. The question is when is the SL finished? When has the SL maximised its potential, does Leica have an interest to maximise its potential? Modern digital cameras are as much hardware as software. I would even pay (if necessary) for specific new features which are important to me. I think Leica misses an opportunity by not positioning the SL as a "living camera". Something which evolves until technical advances (hardware) appear in an SL2. In contrast to the M line, the SL is about innovation, with all those lenses which can be adapted it is a Swiss army knife of a camera. Some of its features are useful to me, some of it not. I do not care much about the things which are there and which I don't need and don't use (maybe they are important to others). I care about the things I use, and the things which I am missing. The SL is a great camera, it could be even better with some of the things added or fixed which are mentioned in this thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanhulsenbeek Posted March 30, 2017 Share #124 Â Posted March 30, 2017 even if the new summaron M 28mm is a special order M lens built in limited numbers I have it and the SL I own doesnt recognize it even if is coded ( as it does with the other M coded lenses ) Yes my M9 recognize it but why SL shoundnt have the summaron 28mm into his list . I appreciate an upgrade for this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanhulsenbeek Posted March 30, 2017 Share #125 Â Posted March 30, 2017 Yes! I got a mail from Leica Wetzlar that the Summaron 28/5.6 will be included in the next firmware . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD_50 Posted March 30, 2017 Share #126 Â Posted March 30, 2017 I was expecting a response like this. The question is when is the SL finished? When has the SL maximised its potential, does Leica have an interest to maximise its potential? Modern digital cameras are as much hardware as software. I would even pay (if necessary) for specific new features which are important to me. I think Leica misses an opportunity by not positioning the SL as a "living camera". Something which evolves until technical advances (hardware) appear in an SL2. In contrast to the M line, the SL is about innovation, with all those lenses which can be adapted it is a Swiss army knife of a camera. Some of its features are useful to me, some of it not. I do not care much about the things which are there and which I don't need and don't use (maybe they are important to others). I care about the things I use, and the things which I am missing. The SL is a great camera, it could be even better with some of the things added or fixed which are mentioned in this thread. I believe the SL has a long way to go to compete on features with more finished products like the Nikon D4/5 that I mentioned. In this sense Leica is similar to Fuji in having more room to grow on the firmware side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashGordonPhotography Posted March 30, 2017 Share #127  Posted March 30, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) A lot of the Fuji updates simply bring them closer to the competition in feature set. They receive a lot more credit for updates than do companies who ship more finished products in the beginning.  I would appreciate the updates but I can definitely say I would rather have a more complete product from day 1. The Nikon D# series is an example where I don't really recall many useful updates but the cameras were fast, reliable, and feature rich from day 1.  I'm not so sure about that. I suppose Apple gets the credit for starting the whole "expect updates with new firmware" thing. Fuji was the first in cameras. Now it seems everybody does it, to some extent, except Canikon. With the Fuji cameras I have owned the firmware has been robust. Certainly better than the original SL firmware. And I have appreciated the Fuji updates even though I'm sure it's partly a marketing plan and some of the features added are planned that way. Then they do something like update the old XPro1 or update the XE2 so it has every new feature of the newer XE2S (hardware permitting).  Canikon are still, once again, just stumbling along with their old strategy. Release camera. Wait. Release camera... Sure the firmware is robust and feature rich but a lot happens in a three year product cyclle and Canikon cameras are dinosaurs mid way through. It takes someone like Magic Lantern to release firmware which can leverage more functionality out of the same hardware where as Fuji and to a lesser extent Sony, m43 and the SL have manufacturers support.  The camera industry is in crisis. Except for boutique players like Leica sales are plumetting. The simple fact is that the fast release cycles of the consumer space in the last decade can't remain as they are. Making a new EOS 1000 every 18 months is killing them in R&D and tooling costs. Even tablets and phones are starting to see this. Cameras with longer cycles do better and an easy way to keep a cycle successful for longer is to keep on top of new features and software development. It's a lot cheaper than tooling a new model just to get a codec out the door.  So Nikon may release feature rich firmware with each camera and just leave it at that but does it do them any good as a company when that model remains un-updated after 12 months? In another 12 months the mid models will be more feature rich and up to date than the D5 and peple will buy a cheaper camera because the flagship doesn't have features that could be implemented with new firmware. In a time where firmware updates are the norm that seems kind of out of touch.  Gordon  p.s. In no way does the above excuse the terrible firmware the SL was released with...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted March 30, 2017 Share #128  Posted March 30, 2017 ......not quite sure what was 'terrible' with the firmware that the SL was released with ..... and having had the camera from before the official release date I had no real issues of consequence....  anyway, that's by the by .... the simple fact is that cameras and firmware are released 'when they think they can get away with it' rather than 100% complete and bomb-proof.  simple commercial constraints dictate that, and there is a constant upgrade/replacement war that is waged between competing camera/lens producers.  Like drugs ..... which are phenomenally expensive to test to ensure safety and efficacy ...... you cannot cover every eventuality and it often takes many thousands of users covering every possible eventuality to reveal some side effects and issues. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingo Posted March 31, 2017 Share #129 Â Posted March 31, 2017 #66: Auto-ISO: Â Enable exposure compensation in M-Mode Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashGordonPhotography Posted March 31, 2017 Share #130  Posted March 31, 2017 ......not quite sure what was 'terrible' with the firmware that the SL was released with ..... and having had the camera from before the official release date I had no real issues of consequence....  Well besides the flash actually not firing at all in A, T and P mode if the shutter was between 1/30 and 1/500, the almost completely non functional auto ISO, banding in shadows, focus inaccuracies at the long end of the zoom and a half dozen other pretty serious bugs it was just dandy.  Gordon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted March 31, 2017 Share #131  Posted March 31, 2017 #66: Auto-ISO:  Enable exposure compensation in M-Mode   Agree! But how - in a quick and smooth way?  The top and back wheels are necessarily set to alter aperture and speed in manual mode - so an additional button must be involved somehow.  I usually put ISO on the front button. This is convenient since the middle finger reach this button without changing the holding of the body, and since I tend to alter the ISO. I could, of course, assign the exposure compensation to that button. Alternatively, the exposure compensation could then be activated by pressing the joystick+moving one of the wheels simultaneously.  I am asking because I am curious what people think/use and, possibly, how this is done on non-Leica bodies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingo Posted March 31, 2017 Share #132  Posted March 31, 2017 Agree! But how - in a quick and smooth way?  The top and back wheels are necessarily set to alter aperture and speed in manual mode - so an additional button must be involved somehow.  I usually put ISO on the front button. This is convenient since the middle finger reach this button without changing the holding of the body, and since I tend to alter the ISO. I could, of course, assign the exposure compensation to that button. Alternatively, the exposure compensation could then be activated by pressing the joystick+moving one of the wheels simultaneously.  I am asking because I am curious what people think/use and, possibly, how this is done on non-Leica bodies.  I'm just responsible for the FW-requests, not the solutions .  But I think that register the exposure compensation function to any button would be fine.  Canon has a dedicated button for exposure compensation. But that's a different philosophy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 31, 2017 Share #133  Posted March 31, 2017 #66: Auto-ISO:  Enable exposure compensation in M-Mode   Exposure compensation is already there.  I have it set to the long-press on the upper-right button. Very convenient to my thumb. Press button, set EC with thumb on rear dial or forefinger on top dial, half press shutter release and make exposure.  (Bottom-right button for ISO setting, and FN button for lens profile for me, when working with manual lenses. FN button for OIS off/on when working with AF lenses.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingo Posted March 31, 2017 Share #134  Posted March 31, 2017 Exposure compensation is already there.  I have it set to the long-press on the upper-right button. Very convenient to my thumb. Press button, set EC with thumb on rear dial or forefinger on top dial, half press shutter release and make exposure.  (Bottom-right button for ISO setting, and FN button for lens profile for me, when working with manual lenses. FN button for OIS off/on when working with AF lenses.) Damn! How could I oversee this. Thanks a lot for the hint. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 31, 2017 Share #135  Posted March 31, 2017 BTW: Manual mode with AutoISO enabled and Exposure Preview ON pretty much does what Doug Herr and everyone else seems be wanting with respect to giving a WYSIWYG view at all times when shooting. At least with an R lens ... I haven't pulled out the AF lens to look again yet.  And another BTW: I pulled out the camera and fitted the Summilux-R 50mm f/1.4 to test the M-AutoISO setting. I've been shooting with the SL24-90, SL90-280, and Super-Elmar-R 15mm most of the time lately. Fitting the, by comparison, light and small R 50/1.4 lens reminded me how much of a chameleon the SL is ... with the R50/1.4 lens on it, the SL becomes a middleweight, compact SLR-like camera instead of a "serious professional tool" in the hand. The versatility of this camera is incredible.  I look forward to seeing what Leica does with the next firmware update. However, if they did nothing at all, I'm quite content with the SL just as it is now with firmware 2.1, and it wasn't too far off with firmware 1.2 when I got it. The one big thing I'd like to see corrected is the metering with AutoISO range limits set ... it just behaves erratically if I set the bottom limit to anything but ISO 50 ... and I really would prefer an override to the AutoISO shutter speed limiter with an indication that the override was active (that is, the normal exposure time limit was being extended). That would make using AutoISO in Aperture priority mode work much more like every other camera I've had with AutoISO and Aperture priority. The way it slams into the limit and just underexposes has caught me out so often that I have discontinued using AutoISO with aperture priority most of the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest VVJ Posted March 31, 2017 Share #136  Posted March 31, 2017 We are at 2.2 now I believe.  Well besides the flash actually not firing at all in A, T and P mode if the shutter was between 1/30 and 1/500, the almost completely non functional auto ISO, banding in shadows, focus inaccuracies at the long end of the zoom and a half dozen other pretty serious bugs it was just dandy.  Gordon  I stepped with 1.2 which I though was already pretty good, in any case a lot better than the first firmwares of the Fuji X-Pro1 or the Leica T.  Those were terrible IMHO.  Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 31, 2017 Share #137 Â Posted March 31, 2017 We are at 2.2 now I believe.Yes, that's right. My mistake ... I'd forgotten I updated it a few weeks back. Â Personally, I think Leica did a bang-up job on the SL. The mechanics of the camera are outstanding, even the v1.x series firmware was quite good for such a 'totally new from the ground up' system. Between the SL and the M-D, I really need nothing further in any rational sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashGordonPhotography Posted March 31, 2017 Share #138  Posted March 31, 2017 We are at 2.2 now I believe.   I stepped with 1.2 which I though was already pretty good, in any case a lot better than the first firmwares of the Fuji X-Pro1 or the Leica T.  Those were terrible IMHO.   Yep. And I like the 2.x camera a LOT. I work with a pair of them. It's just the release firmware I had issues with. Big issues and I nearly returned the camera until talking with people from Leica about fixing the flaws. I'm a commercial photographer and having a camera just not fire the flash at a dozen different shutter speeds for no apparent reason is a pretty big fail in a working environment. Especially when it was it was listed as a function in the specifications.  I agree on the XPro1 and held off buying one.  Now with 2.2 the SL is my favourite working camera of all time. I'm a huge fan and if it were stolen I would immediately replace them. There's still room for improvement though and I hope whatever/whenever Leica have in store for the SL makes it even better.  Gordon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted April 1, 2017 Share #139  Posted April 1, 2017 Leica SL is one of my favorite cameras, but I would not mind if they fixed this:  - Back button focusing (MF mode) should be able to use AF-C instead of AF-S only. - A mode where EVF is used only as a viewfinder and never for reviewing images (every time I have reviewed an image it 'blocks' the EVF). - Auto review on LCD when using EVF only. - Lock focus point with AF Field Size -> 1 Point. - Allow moving focus point only after something (e.g. shutter button) 'unlocks' it. That would eliminate the need for locking focus point. - Fix issue with very slow startups with some SD cards. - Faster startup.   Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD_50 Posted April 1, 2017 Share #140 Â Posted April 1, 2017 Â Leica SL is one of my favorite cameras, but I would not mind if they fixed this: Â - Back button focusing (MF mode) should be able to use AF-C instead of AF-S only.. AF-C works with back button focus in MF mode with the current firmware on my camera with 24-90. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.