Guest VVJ Posted November 20, 2015 Share #21 Posted November 20, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) pretty funny....called around to see what is going on and getting all kinds of answers....leica is selling it as a kit only for now, body only will take 2-3 months, leica is sending more SL lenses then bodies.....nobody has them right now in the US.... doesn't leica US get a certain number which they then distribute to dealers? are they seriously shipping them out one by one? Leica should really solve its supply chain problems and properly communicate with its customers through its dealers. I recently went through exactly the same thing with the Q and although I am very interested in the SL there is no way on earth that I am going through the same frustrating pre-order process again... Very very customer unfriendly IMHO... If I am still interested in 2-3 months I will pick one up when it is readily available in the stores, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 20, 2015 Posted November 20, 2015 Hi Guest VVJ, Take a look here Availability. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
@McLeica Posted November 20, 2015 Share #22 Posted November 20, 2015 Availability - about 15 minutes ago - smug smile to self. Mine came from Ffordes in Scotland. They always seem to treat me very well and get a camera to me within the first few days of UK release. I did put one on order with them on the day after announcement. Wilson +1 for Ffordes. It took me a week to get my Q. Sometimes you've got to go off the beaten track a bit. The shop is a gem though as they've got all sorts of great vintage kit in there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted November 20, 2015 Share #23 Posted November 20, 2015 The way that I usually get around these kinds of issues in the first place is to not be in a hurry to have the latest hot new thing. I've bought new stuff just coming out many times the simple way: I put an order in with my preferred vendor for whatever it is and then stopped thinking about it. I go on with my work (be it my job or my photographic endeavors) and just wait for it to arrive, checking in with the vendor periodically if the time seems over long. A Leica camera or lens is an expensive purchase, something that I most usually plan for over a goodly period of time. I'd been planning for the SL for quite some time (3+ years), and I put some effort into doing the best I could to get one reasonably quickly, But in the end, I was lucky that the local dealer was able to obtain a camera for me quickly given the "Lucky Leica Lottery" product distribution scheme that seems the norm for Leica USA, and I was prepared for the purchase way in advance so I could take advantage of that luck. I was also prepared to wait for as long as necessary. Again, because a Leica is an expensive purchase but also because they have lasting value and there's really no need to be in a rush. Put in the order and go on doing what I do until it shows up has always worked just fine. The camera will be just as valuable to me a year from now as it is right now... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlashGordonPhotography Posted November 20, 2015 Share #24 Posted November 20, 2015 The way that I usually get around these kinds of issues in the first place is to not be in a hurry to have the latest hot new thing. I've bought new stuff just coming out many times the simple way: I put an order in with my preferred vendor for whatever it is and then stopped thinking about it. I go on with my work (be it my job or my photographic endeavors) and just wait for it to arrive, checking in with the vendor periodically if the time seems over long. A Leica camera or lens is an expensive purchase, something that I most usually plan for over a goodly period of time. I'd been planning for the SL for quite some time (3+ years), and I put some effort into doing the best I could to get one reasonably quickly, But in the end, I was lucky that the local dealer was able to obtain a camera for me quickly given the "Lucky Leica Lottery" product distribution scheme that seems the norm for Leica USA, and I was prepared for the purchase way in advance so I could take advantage of that luck. I was also prepared to wait for as long as necessary. Again, because a Leica is an expensive purchase but also because they have lasting value and there's really no need to be in a rush. Put in the order and go on doing what I do until it shows up has always worked just fine. The camera will be just as valuable to me a year from now as it is right now... Exactly. I don't pre-order. It's not the end of the world. (Actually I do, occasionally. I pre ordered the A7RII and got the first one in the country and I will get the first CV 10mm in Oz as well, but I USUSALLY don't). I waited four months for my M. I wasn't expecting the get an SL. I'd actually budgeted for Jan/Feb. I just went to check out a couple of the functions and asked the question. Next thing you know my bank account spontaneously emptied itself..... I would have survived without it, just fine. It was a pleasant surprise, none the less. Gordon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted November 21, 2015 Share #25 Posted November 21, 2015 I think Leica, certainly in the UK, appear to be operating a fairer distribution system than they were a few years ago, when it seemed to depend on how friendly your dealer was with the travelling rep. I put the first order in for the UK for the M9, with a deposit, as I had spotted a prototype during a visit to the factory, when my escort left to take a phone call. This was then with a very small dealer, H.A. Baker in my local town of Lewes, from whom I had bought my M7, M8, Digilux 1 and 2. When I still had not received my order nearly three months after the UK release and when other people had been able to walk in off the street in London and buy one, I started to wonder why I was still M9-less. It turned out the rep was having a disagreement with Bakers over their ordering volumes and was punishing them by not giving them any M9's. You can imagine I hit the roof and emails started to fly backwards and forwards to Solms. My M9 was delivered by a rather chastened rep, within the week. The smaller dealers like Ffordes, seem to be getting a fair crack of the whip now. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted November 21, 2015 Share #26 Posted November 21, 2015 I'm not so sure that has changed, Wilson. Seems like Leica is insisting on minimum stock volumes still ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted November 21, 2015 Share #27 Posted November 21, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) My dealer is in the same category as Ffordes (remote location, largely internet sales, occasional savings), but in California. They got one SL in their first shipment, last week, and have several more coming in the middle of next week. scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted November 21, 2015 Share #28 Posted November 21, 2015 I'm not so sure that has changed, Wilson. Seems like Leica is insisting on minimum stock volumes still ... John, I am sure you are correct, as Bakers have had their prime dealership taken away from them. This is a small shop as an adjunct to a chemists and the stock/purchasing levels Leica wanted them to achieve were completely unrealistic (I saw the figures). It used to be a very popular shop when it was run by Stuart Bean, who had been Leica UK's service manager before he semi-retired to Lewes. He was a dyed in the wool Leica enthusiast and ran seminars, workshops and gave talks on the history of Leica and the development of their cameras. After he died, there were a succession of pleasant people running the Leica part of the shop but not quite of the same calibre as Stuart, until it got put under the wing of Buckland Photographic of Seaford, where there was a Leica specialist at Bakers three days a week. It was still a very useful resource for people living in the south of England, who did not want to have to go into London. Their stock levels were reasonable and they were very efficient at getting in whatever you needed. Sadly Leica thought otherwise and took their premier dealership away, giving it to Parkcameras of Burgess Hill. Now I use Park for things like paper, ink carts and sensor cleaning stuff. I have yet to see a single Leica body or lens on display in the shop and I doubt they sell very many. It is a very impersonal shopping experience. Buying a Leica should be like buying a made to measure suit from the family tailors, where you feel that the salesman understands your individual needs and has a deep knowledge of the product he is trying to sell you. It makes good business sense as you are far more likely to buy more in those circumstances. People like Porsche understand this perfectly and the local Porsche dealers work extremely hard to build personal relationships with their customers. It makes taking your car there such a pleasant experience that the pain of the large bill almost fades into the background. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted November 21, 2015 Share #29 Posted November 21, 2015 ... Sadly Leica thought otherwise and took their premier dealership away, giving it to Parkcameras of Burgess Hill. Now I use Park for things like paper, ink carts and sensor cleaning stuff. I have yet to see a single Leica body or lens on display in the shop and I doubt they sell very many. It is a very impersonal shopping experience. Buying a Leica should be like buying a made to measure suit from the family tailors, where you feel that the salesman understands your individual needs and has a deep knowledge of the product he is trying to sell you. It makes good business sense as you are far more likely to buy more in those circumstances. ... That sounds very much like what Leica is doing with the Leica Stores, and promoting their premier dealership sellers to be. The Parkcameras shop sounds more like the B&H Photo experience ... When I buy from B&H, I don't expect much personal service and a relationship; I'm looking for competitive pricing, stock availability, and delivery speed as the priorities. There's space for that kind of business too, when those are the customer priorities. Some folks will regard any camera as just another commodity/equipment purchase. I tend to buy Leica cameras from my local dealer (Keeble & Shuchat Photography in Palo Alto, CA) or from Dan Tamarkin (Tamarkin.com in Chicago, Ill.) because both of them are "premier" dealerships that focus on personal service and a long term relationship. There's a Leica Store in San Francisco, too; I've got to head up there for a visit some time, I've heard good reports. Mostly because I like supporting good brick&mortar shops and good people, and it's very pleasant to stop into the shop or call on the phone to have a chat over some detail or issue with a knowledgeable person whom I already know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted November 21, 2015 Share #30 Posted November 21, 2015 I feel a little hesitant talking about this. The people I used offered excellent service - I chose them originally because they were in Christchurch and, after the earthquake, I thought they needed the business. Also, the local guys annoyed me a few too many times with unhelpful comments (suggesting I pay the full price for an M9 before they'd order it - they've since gone bust, which is sad, but no surprise). Anyway, I've had excellent service and good prices from Christchurch. It seems they've lost their Leica dealership because they won't maintain the required stock levels (which seems a little unfair when Leica does struggle to supply sometimes). Anyway, it's a tough market out there when Leica equipment goes Wetzlar->regional distributor->national importer->local dealer, each needing to make money, while the Leica Stores presumably get supplied direct. Nationally, we're reduced to two dealers - a national "Warehouse" chain, which has never really inspired me, but we'll see, and a small family business in Auckland. It turns out I know the Auckland family, so that looks promising. On the plus side, unless you're looking to evade GST/VAT, Leica has the pricing right. Our local price pretty much matches the US and Australia price, which is good. I'd rather buy local. That coffee isn't assured yet, Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted November 21, 2015 Share #31 Posted November 21, 2015 Here's another slightly dirty bit of business. Arbitrage. I presume that Leica starts out with prices the same in all countries, to within a few percent. Then things change. I recently picked up an Olympus 5.2 from a store in Toronto which was honoring the old price (from back when the Canadian dollar was roughly equal to the American dollar). This ended up giving me a 50% savings. Anyway right now, the American price is a noticeable bit higher than the European prices. 6900 EUR for the SL in Germany translates into $7350 US (price is $7450). But the EU price includes 19% VAT, while the US price has to have typically 8% local sales tax added to it. That's a 27% difference in the real wallet impact, available to a careful internet purchaser or a traveller with connections. Just saying... but I purchased within my country. scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overgaard Posted November 22, 2015 Share #32 Posted November 22, 2015 Leica Galerie Salzburg had one in stock, and a lens, that was not sold yesterday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward Louis Marit Posted November 22, 2015 Share #33 Posted November 22, 2015 John, I am sure you are correct, as Bakers have had their prime dealership taken away from them. This is a small shop as an adjunct to a chemists and the stock/purchasing levels Leica wanted them to achieve were completely unrealistic (I saw the figures). It used to be a very popular shop when it was run by Stuart Bean, who had been Leica UK's service manager before he semi-retired to Lewes. He was a dyed in the wool Leica enthusiast and ran seminars, workshops and gave talks on the history of Leica and the development of their cameras. After he died, there were a succession of pleasant people running the Leica part of the shop but not quite of the same calibre as Stuart, until it got put under the wing of Buckland Photographic of Seaford, where there was a Leica specialist at Bakers three days a week. It was still a very useful resource for people living in the south of England, who did not want to have to go into London. Their stock levels were reasonable and they were very efficient at getting in whatever you needed. Sadly Leica thought otherwise and took their premier dealership away, giving it to Parkcameras of Burgess Hill. Now I use Park for things like paper, ink carts and sensor cleaning stuff. I have yet to see a single Leica body or lens on display in the shop and I doubt they sell very many. It is a very impersonal shopping experience. Buying a Leica should be like buying a made to measure suit from the family tailors, where you feel that the salesman understands your individual needs and has a deep knowledge of the product he is trying to sell you. It makes good business sense as you are far more likely to buy more in those circumstances. People like Porsche understand this perfectly and the local Porsche dealers work extremely hard to build personal relationships with their customers. It makes taking your car there such a pleasant experience that the pain of the large bill almost fades into the background. Wilson That's why I sold my 997. Despite the great relationship I had with the dealer and the very personal service after a succession of large bills post warranty the straw that broke the camels back was $700 for a battery. And you can't just go and buy a generic battery from the local auto parts store because it was such a weird shape only the Porsche battery would fit... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaGuy2014 Posted November 22, 2015 Share #34 Posted November 22, 2015 Strangely, B&H shows shipments were expected to start today - but has anyone received confirmation of this? Also note that they were "offline" for most of the day, so shipments might actually begin Monday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manoleica Posted November 22, 2015 Share #35 Posted November 22, 2015 Having owned quite a few high end Marques both here and in the UK, one can usually expect a highly motivated customer service experience at Jag, Porsche, Lexus and many other dealerships.. With Leica even at Wetzlar and some of their boutiques the service/customer experience can be as one might say iffy.. When taking delivery of a new vehicle the hand over and associated preamble is to my mind a must.. With my Leicas once I have decided on the model and ordered it online (no local dealerships) I enjoy/relish the unboxing and subsequent learning curve.. Both the Leica S and the new Jaguars have me drooling, will I jump? I really don't know.. My clutch of Leica's still touch that photographic spot, my 2015 Challenger certainly revs my adrenalin gland... Let's be honest being well healed is a bitch"" oh' for a 10year old Civic & a well used Rebel"" -lol- '()'.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted November 22, 2015 Share #36 Posted November 22, 2015 Strangely, B&H shows shipments were expected to start today - but has anyone received confirmation of this? Also note that they were "offline" for most of the day, so shipments might actually begin Monday. My spare battery and remote cable orders are still showing just "on order" as status with B&H. Hopefully they've gotten a few spare batteries in and are preparing shipments today. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenjosh Posted November 23, 2015 Share #37 Posted November 23, 2015 pretty funny....called around to see what is going on and getting all kinds of answers....leica is selling it as a kit only for now, body only will take 2-3 months, leica is sending more SL lenses then bodies.....nobody has them right now in the US.... doesn't leica US get a certain number which they then distribute to dealers? are they seriously shipping them out one by one? I spoke to my dealer this weekend. He runs a small family owned store and sells primarily Nikon and Sony. He also sells Leica but does not stock much. I usually buy from him just for exceptional customer service. He is not aware of any Leica mandated limitation that prevents sale of camera without the lens. He informed me that the first customer ordered just the camera without the lens and got it last week. I am second in the list. He informed that I will get mine in the next few days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vec Posted November 23, 2015 Share #38 Posted November 23, 2015 Just came back from my local shop -- went to buy paper this time. I was there a week ago fondling the SL rig when the local Leica rep was in town. (Having just got a 240 M-P my credit cards are still too hot to the touch to consider another camera) In any case, they got in two SLs this week and one of the SL zooms. The lens was still sitting idly in the case whilst both of the SLs were long gone to customers who had preordered them. So it appears the idea that there's a requirement to buy both might be a nice sales tool for the shop. -George Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaGuy2014 Posted November 23, 2015 Share #39 Posted November 23, 2015 Agree with Vec. Some dealers are simply being opportunistic. Re: svenjosh - your dealer gets a heads up on incoming orders via the invoice from Leica. He can also see the # of units that he'll be getting. I would say that I picked up the zoom lens with my SL and it's been refreshing. Perhaps it's a function of having lowered expectations, but the combination of a speedy and responsive AF and a brilliant lens has been refreshing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted November 23, 2015 Share #40 Posted November 23, 2015 .... In any case, they got in two SLs this week and one of the SL zooms. The lens was still sitting idly in the case whilst both of the SLs were long gone to customers who had preordered them. So it appears the idea that there's a requirement to buy both might be a nice sales tool for the shop. -George It does sound like the logistics of getting the SL out are going to be tricky for Leica. To whom does your shop sell that 24-90 L lens that is now sitting orphaned? I guess the idea is that after shooting every M/R lens in their inventories, the early body-only buyers will be back in the next credit card billing cycle. I'll watch this thread for the point where it shifts over to discussing 24-90 Vario-Elmarit availability. scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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