huk Posted January 15, 2014 Share #1 Posted January 15, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Dear fellow forum members, I want to say Hello as this is my first post to this forum (even though I have looked into it a lot). Today I have purchased an MM after having tested one in November last year -- I'm really happy :*) My question: if I remember right and as stated in the MM brochure, the MM should be shipped with a B&W MM "campaign" print by Jacob Aue Sobol. Unfortunately, my MM box does _not_ come with such a print. Anybody has also experienced this? Thanks, take care --Uli Krieger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 Hi huk, Take a look here Monochrom B&W MM print by Aue Sobol. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wattsy Posted January 15, 2014 Share #2 Posted January 15, 2014 In truth you are not missing much – it's really just a small sample print to showcase the baryte printing service from Whitewall – but if it bothers you I'm sure Leica will send you a print if you let them know it was missing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido Posted January 15, 2014 Share #3 Posted January 15, 2014 I have to agree... nothing to write home about. Don't worry, and simply replace the print by one of your own to come Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huk Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share #4 Posted January 15, 2014 I have to agree... nothing to write home about. Don't worry, and simply replace the print by one of your own to come :*)) thx Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T 1969 Posted January 16, 2014 Share #5 Posted January 16, 2014 Personally I like his work and would love an original print. Especially if it was free! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted January 16, 2014 Share #6 Posted January 16, 2014 Agree that the small print isn't such a big deal. I looked at it, put it in back, and then put the box into storage. I'd not thought about it since then. Oh, and welcome to the forum :)/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sm23221 Posted January 16, 2014 Share #7 Posted January 16, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) For me it was a curiosity to see what a "great" print looks like compared to mine. The subject matter is impressive but the print itself doesn't seem much different from what my Epson 3880 can produce. In other words, your not missing much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcraf Posted January 24, 2014 Share #8 Posted January 24, 2014 It's more like a postcard. To fit in the box, I guess. As others have said, you're not missing much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted January 24, 2014 Share #9 Posted January 24, 2014 ...just to be safe though, whenever you finally do come around to selling it on eBay, DO NOT under any circumstances mention that it doesn't come with the Sobol print or no-one will buy it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted January 25, 2014 Share #10 Posted January 25, 2014 I echo the sentiments of most people here. My print is in the box with the rest of the camera documents - where it will stay. Personally, I found nothing that impressed me about the print. If you feel you should have it, and indeed you should since it was advertised, contact Leica, I am sure they will rectify the problem. If I ever sell the camera, the print will go with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huk Posted January 27, 2014 Author Share #11 Posted January 27, 2014 I echo the sentiments of most people here. My print is in the box with the rest of the camera documents - where it will stay. Personally, I found nothing that impressed me about the print. If you feel you should have it, and indeed you should since it was advertised, contact Leica, I am sure they will rectify the problem. If I ever sell the camera, the print will go with it. Hello again, just to let you know -- my camera dealer contacted Leica and they told him that the Aue Sobol campaign has ended in December 2013 and that Leica is no longer allowed to ship prints from him. Even though I ordered the MM a month before that date, it arrived at my dealer around mid January 2014, so Leica removed the print from the package, even though they still have have copies of it :*( Note also that the print is no longer listed as part of the MM package content. Luckily, Leica seems to offer me a large® print that is framed, or something like this (a metal plate ?), it was not clear to him -- so let's see -- will report on this when having it in my hand :*) Unfortunately, as have been with my M9-P and the X Vario of my wife, the MM have been sent back to Leica after two days as I become aware that its sensor is really really really dirty -- haven't seen this before on any camera. Don't know whether this is/was liquid (oil?), definitely it isn't dust. And again, as before, I will be on vacation and would have liked to take the camera with me, but it is now at the mothership in Solms :*(( Cheers, let you know about the print --Uli Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_S Posted January 30, 2014 Share #12 Posted January 30, 2014 ..Note also that the print is no longer listed as part of the MM package content. Luckily, Leica seems to offer me a large® print that is framed, or something like this (a metal plate ?), it was not clear to him -- so let's see -- will report on this when having it in my hand :*) I like the Aue Sobel photograph and I plan to have framed it framed for display at some point, so you are one step ahead. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcraf Posted February 2, 2014 Share #13 Posted February 2, 2014 Unfortunately, as have been with my M9-P and the X Vario of my wife, the MM have been sent back to Leica after two days as I become aware that its sensor is really really really dirty -- haven't seen this before on any camera. Don't know whether this is/was liquid (oil?), definitely it isn't dust. --Uli Hi Uli, and welcome. I have had 2 MMs. The first died after only 4 days. Both have had very dirty sensors out of the box. Obviously with the first one, I didn't even bother with this, as it was exchanged for my second MM after a few days. On 'MM No2' I have already had the sensor cleaned once for free in Leica Mayfair in London. I had my M240 cleaned at the same time. The technician told me that the MM takes longer to clean to a satisfactory degree. I have no idea of the logic behind this (can't remember his explanation) Only 1 month after cleaning, the MM needs cleaning again. I have no idea whether it is oil or dust on the sensor. I probably need to learn to clean the sensor myself now. I did this on my M8 cameras a few years back. But the thought of getting it wrong on a fairly new GBP 6000 camera is sobering...... But, is it acceptable to have to do this so frequently? Some are accepting of this, some are not. In a product at this price point I am surprised that this happens, but it's probably the nature of the beast. Not sure why sensor cleaning isn't built-in. Maybe compactness or weight. We tolerate a lot of faults as Leica fans, I guess......Leica is fortunate in this. Anyhow hope you get your MM back soon. Dirty sensor or not, it is a phenomenal tool. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2wk Posted February 2, 2014 Share #14 Posted February 2, 2014 ^when I got my MM it wasn't dirty out if the box, but it became extremely dirty after only a few shots. My understanding is that oil from the shutter (or somewhere) was splattering over the sensor from the mechanism moving. I sent it back to leica NJ who would only say, "oh dust is normal on a digital camera, blah blah blah" I hadn't even changed lenses! However, since I got it back, problem solved. I have taken thousands of shots and it is behaving like a normal digital camera. Any dust I now have I blow off with a rocket blower easily. However, I now am extremely careful changing lenses. I blow the camera, back of new lens, inside the rear lens caps etc. I treat the MM more like a medium format digital in that respect. I know some people wet clean their Leicas all the time. I just don't have the nerves to swab around inside this $8000 camera myself. It would be a bit like finding my own vein to give blood haha. Creeps me out. My fuji Xpro on the other hand is a champ of avoiding dust on the sensor. I have changed lenses everywhere with great abandonment for care. In a windstorm in the desert, in a dusty woodshop etc. That self sensor cleaning must really work! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
A miller Posted February 2, 2014 Share #15 Posted February 2, 2014 I also stressed about the sensor spots from the MM that I have. I even returned it for another one and opened all of them that the particular store had to make sure that I took home a camera that had never been taken out of the wrapping. And guess what, there are a few spots on the new one as well! The is a flickr discussion in which no less than a dozen people remark that their MMs had spots right out of the box. So I called Leica in Solms Friday morning and raised my concern. They said that this camera will by its nature show some spots (even right out of the box), and it is not realistic to try to have a spot-free sensor. Leica said that the MM sensor is so very sensitive to light and filterless that as a practical matter is it really inherent in the design of the sensor that there will be some spots. The message was essentially "get used it and get over it..." In a way this is comforting to me to know that a few spots are normal and that I really shouldn't stress too much and I should simply clone them out when necessary and once or twice a year have it wiped professionally. I also think that particular care must be taken not to shake this camera as oil from the shutter might have a tendency to leak onto the sensor. I drive a Smart car in NYC which is bumpy as HELL on the NYC roads and I usually have my camera either in the front seat or on the floor in its case. With my M9 this isn't a big issue but with my MM I think I will either put extra padding in the camera case or keep the camera somehow more securely fastened while in the car. The bottom line is that one shouldn't be a perfectionist when it comes to keeping your MM sensor free of oil-based sensor spots. (BTW, I find it easy to tell which spots are oil based and which are dust based, as the oil based at normally perfectly round whereas the dust-based spots are not.). --Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted February 2, 2014 Share #16 Posted February 2, 2014 I'm afraid a dirty sensor is a bit of a fact of life with the Monochrom. As I understand it, it is largely oil spots flicked up from the shutter. It should become less frequent with time. I clean my sensor when it gets bad - small sensor swabs and Eclipse. It takes time, care and effort, but it's worth it. Otherwise I just use the excellent spot remover in LightRoom 5. You will get used to it, and it will settle down with time, and cleaning ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted February 2, 2014 Share #17 Posted February 2, 2014 I'm afraid a dirty sensor is a bit of a fact of life with the Monochrom. As I understand it, it is largely oil spots flicked up from the shutter. It should become less frequent with time. I clean my sensor when it gets bad - small sensor swabs and Eclipse. It takes time, care and effort, but it's worth it. Otherwise I just use the excellent spot remover in LightRoom 5. You will get used to it, and it will settle down with time, and cleaning ... It takes me about five minutes to get my Monochrom sensor spotless using the Eyelead stamping tool..... I find washing my car or shaving in the morning more of a hassle:rolleyes: I have looked at the sticky dirt though a microscope. Most of it are pollen, skin flakes and small broken pieces of eyelash. Oil spots are quite rare. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
A miller Posted February 3, 2014 Share #18 Posted February 3, 2014 Most of it are pollen, skin flakes and small broken pieces of eyelash. Oil spots are quite rare. Jaap - Not sure I agree on this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2wk Posted February 3, 2014 Share #19 Posted February 3, 2014 Like I said, if you are seeing an extraordinary amount of spots, send it in. Leica fixed my issue. I'm talking about hundreds of spots on a brand new sensor after 1 days use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huk Posted February 3, 2014 Author Share #20 Posted February 3, 2014 Hi Uli, and welcome. I have had 2 MMs. The first died after only 4 days. Both have had very dirty sensors out of the box. Obviously with the first one, I didn't even bother with this, as it was exchanged for my second MM after a few days. On 'MM No2' I have already had the sensor cleaned once for free in Leica Mayfair in London. I had my M240 cleaned at the same time. The technician told me that the MM takes longer to clean to a satisfactory degree. I have no idea of the logic behind this (can't remember his explanation) Only 1 month after cleaning, the MM needs cleaning again. I have no idea whether it is oil or dust on the sensor. I probably need to learn to clean the sensor myself now. I did this on my M8 cameras a few years back. But the thought of getting it wrong on a fairly new GBP 6000 camera is sobering...... But, is it acceptable to have to do this so frequently? Some are accepting of this, some are not. In a product at this price point I am surprised that this happens, but it's probably the nature of the beast. Not sure why sensor cleaning isn't built-in. Maybe compactness or weight. We tolerate a lot of faults as Leica fans, I guess......Leica is fortunate in this. Anyhow hope you get your MM back soon. Dirty sensor or not, it is a phenomenal tool. Regards John, thank you for your kind words! Yes, the MM came back after 10 days and the dirt has gone as it seems. And because it looked different from the dust I experienced with the M9 (I mean what I saw in the image), I thought it would be better to send it to Solms. Concerning the M9, my air blower/pump always helped me to clean the sensor. Ah, one more thing: you've mentioned that your first MM died after a few days, I had more luck with my M9 that showed purple regions in the picture after about 1 year -- the sensor was replaced and sadly also the Vulcanite "leather", since Leica ran out of stock at that time, very sad ... I've mentioning this because the sensor on the MM is basically the same as on the M9 -- and in case I would have shot all my M9 pictures in black&white, I would have had a hard time to recognized that something has gone wrong with the sensor -- you need the colors to be sure that the sensor is definitely defective. So, I'm asking myself (since you mentioned your experience with the died MM), whether we will recognize when the sensor of the MM is damaged :*(( take care --Uli Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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