Ecaton Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4701 Posted December 27, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Well I would hardly call the A7II bloated, yes it is marginally bigger a a little heavier than the A7 but as a body is still lighter than the Leica M. Yes the lenses are larger and heavier and this is a drawback to the system. but the FE55 and FE16-35 are truly wonderful lenses and the FE35 is very small and light. In fact the FE35 and the A7s make for a small package with incredible flexibility and IQ (for a12mp sensor) and is a lot lighter than the M. I have the leica M and a lot of leica glass but I'm afraid to say that I now find the A7II and the A7s have become my main cameras. I can carry the A7II with 16-35, A7s with 24-70 and the FE55 all easily in my old Billingham Hadley pro just as I used to with 2 leica bodes plus the WATE, 28 cron asph, 50 lux asph and 90 elmarit M and I reckon the weight would have been around the same. The only real lens that I miss not being able to use (or have an equivalent of) is the 28 summicron asph my all time favourite leica lens but sony are coming out with an FE28/f2 next year so I hope it will be good. The longer leica M lenses such as my elmarit-m 90 and api-telyt 135 are ahoy to use and focus on the A7II due to IBIS which not only makes for sharp images at lower shutter speeds but also makes focus so much easier when in magnified view due to the steadier image. All fair points you are making. But mine was about compactness and excellent performance at the same time. First of all, the A7II weights slightly more than the M9. And M lenses loose their brilliance when used on a A7 body, including the 35 and 50 asph Summiluxes. For size: The new Summarit 35 is faster and considerably smaller than the FE35 and optically superior. The ZE 55 with lens shade is quite large as compared to the faster 50 Summilux. Compare size and weight of the MF Zeiss Loxias 35/2 and 50/2 with the Summicrons, quite a difference. And if AF is preferred, the announced ZE 28/2, 35/1.4, 90/2.4 look huge on the lens roadmap charts. And don`t forget not to leave the house with your A7 with two spare batteries. The 16-35 is a zoom, quite nice, I hear, but heavy. To cut a long story short: A reasonably well rounded Sony A7.. based system does not really provide any bulk and weight advantage over a comparable DSLR solution and is still lacking in some areas. The improved A7II which gets closer to DSLR performance added weight and does not provide any real advantage over a Nikon 750 with its "Nikonized" 24MP Sony sensor and uncompressed raw files. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 27, 2014 Posted December 27, 2014 Hi Ecaton, Take a look here The Sony A7 thread [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
viramati Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4702 Posted December 27, 2014 David, Can you send my some images created by 28 Cron and A7 II via Dropbox? Preferably including that of close focus, middle distance, and aiming at infinity. Thanks a lot. Best Regards, Thomas Chen I'm afraid the 28 cron is unfortunately one of the worst performing leica lenses on the A7 with quite severe smearing in the outer areas and vignetting. Even stopped down it never gets to a level that I would find acceptable. It really is no better on the A7s. so I'm afraid I don't see much use in testing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4703 Posted December 27, 2014 All fair points you are making. But mine was about compactness and excellent performance at the same time. First of all, the A7II weights slightly more than the M9. And M lenses loose their brilliance when used on a A7 body, including the 35 and 50 asph Summiluxes. For size: The new Summarit 35 is faster and considerably smaller than the FE35 and optically superior. The ZE 55 with lens shade is quite large as compared to the faster 50 Summilux. Compare size and weight of the MF Zeiss Loxias 35/2 and 50/2 with the Summicrons, quite a difference. And if AF is preferred, the announced ZE 28/2, 35/1.4, 90/2.4 look huge on the lens roadmap charts. And don`t forget not to leave the house with your A7 with two spare batteries. The 16-35 is a zoom, quite nice, I hear, but heavy. To cut a long story short: A reasonably well rounded Sony A7.. based system does not really provide any bulk and weight advantage over a comparable DSLR solution and is still lacking in some areas. The improved A7II which gets closer to DSLR performance added weight and does not provide any real advantage over a Nikon 750 with its "Nikonized" 24MP Sony sensor and uncompressed raw files. Again fair points but I used to be a nikon man with The D700 and holy trinity zooms (70-20, 24-70,14-24) and various zeiss primes and I can say that at least for me the sony is considerably smaller and lighter than the Nikon FF DSLR's. Of course the Leica M9 and leica lenses are smaller and lighter but the Sony system is so much more versatile especially compared to the M9. Don't get me wrong I like my M240 and Leica especially for their size, quality of the lenses and 'feel' of the whole system but I am finding that in day-to-day use the Sony system to be far more practical with a very similar output to the M240. In fact I often work with the 2 together FE55 on the A7 an 28 cron asph on the M240 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Chen Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4704 Posted December 27, 2014 And M lenses loose their brilliance when used on a A7 body, including the 35 and 50 asph Summiluxes. Besides Leica R lenses, I'm quite satisfied with the combination of A7R + Leica M WATE 16-21 + Leica M MATE 28-35, in terms of compactness and image quality and the purpose for travel. Leica M 90 Cron APO works very well too if adds to the team (Leica 90/4 could be a smaller and lighter option), not to mention the Leica M 135/3.4. A7R also matches Leica 35 Lux pre FLE ans 50 Lux pre ASPH, in my own experience. I agree with you that Leica lenses are superb products and respect your selection of system. Let's enjoy taking pictures in our own ways. All the Best, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4705 Posted December 27, 2014 Thinking about I see Ecaton is talking about the M9 which is of course is smaller and lighter than it's 'bloated' successor the M240 and as it is an unfortunate tendency for cameras to get bigger and heavier when they are upgraded it will be interesting to see what happens to the next generation of cameras if they bring in such things as sensor cleaning mechanisms and god forbid IBIS in a leica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4706 Posted December 27, 2014 I'm afraid the 28 cron is unfortunately one of the worst performing leica lenses on the A7 with quite severe smearing in the outer areas and vignetting. Even stopped down it never gets to a level that I would find acceptable. It really is no better on the A7s. It doesn't surprise me to read this because, in my (no doubt controversial) opinion, the 28 Summicron isn't all that great on full frame Leica digitals either (at least the ones I've owned which, perhaps significantly, doesn't include the M240). Far too much vignetting and I'm not convinced by the sharpness across the frame. On the cropped frame M8 it was excellent but I've never been fully persuaded by the lens on the M9 or Monochrom. I've even tried other examples of the lens to rule out mine being a duff example but that doesn't appear to be the case. On a film body, however, the lens is sensationally good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4707 Posted December 27, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) It doesn't surprise me to read this because, in my (no doubt controversial) opinion, the 28 Summicron isn't all that great on full frame Leica digitals either (at least the ones I've owned which, perhaps significantly, doesn't include the M240). Far too much vignetting and I'm not convinced by the sharpness across the frame. On the cropped frame M8 it was excellent but I've never been fully persuaded by the lens on the M9 or Monochrom. I've even tried other examples of the lens to rule out mine being a duff example but that doesn't appear to be the case. On a film body, however, the lens is sensationally good. I suppose I tend to agree as it does indeed vignette quite bit on the M240 and is not totally sharp corner to corner wide open but all the same it is wonderful lens with lovely colours, great contrast and extremely resistant to flare. It also easy to focus on the M (not so on the A7) and has been my go to reportage lens for many years. Another problem with the M is that it's frame lines essentially fill the frame which makes it hard to really get an idea of the whole image without hunting around the viewfinder. so all in all a slightly flawed masterpiece Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4708 Posted December 27, 2014 How many 28s are sharp corner to corner below f/5.6 folks? Zero or less? Among others, the Summicron is one of the sharpest if not the sharpest there IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturephoto1 Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4709 Posted December 27, 2014 How many 28s are sharp corner to corner below f/5.6 folks? Zero or less? Among others, the Summicron is one of the sharpest if not the sharpest there IMHO. The R 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2 is probably the sharpest 28mm lens that I have seen on an A7r and pretty darn sharp into the corners by around f5.6 or f8. I like mine a lot. I had hoped to get one of the smaller M 28mm lenses for my A7r, but the R 28mm which is larger and heavier than the M 28mm lenses will have to do. https://scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t31.0-8/10631063_755306877864593_4582406927051921377_o.jpg The above may have been shot at f11 for DOF Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4710 Posted December 27, 2014 How many 28s are sharp corner to corner below f/5.6 folks? Zero or less? Among others, the Summicron is one of the sharpest if not the sharpest there IMHO. Quite possibly but all I'm saying us that I don't find the lens as convincing on full frame digital as I do on a film body. On the latter it is great, no question. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4711 Posted December 27, 2014 How many 28s are sharp corner to corner below f/5.6 folks? Zero or less? Among others, the Summicron is one of the sharpest if not the sharpest there IMHO. Have no idea about the others but my summicron is okay in the corners at f2, pretty good at f2.8 and I would say sharp across the frame by f4 in normal viewing conditions Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyoung Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4712 Posted December 27, 2014 Gerry, 3 pcs. of images at Dropbox, A7R + 50 Lux preASHP on Gitzo aluminum tripod, 2 second self timer, focusing at the building that the overhanged crane points to. Other image data are attached to files. The scenes are not so contrasty, weather not permmitting. Sorry! https://www.dropbox.com/sh/6kj46fi2krxksg1/AAA89zb_WoK5rKXdVkygZrl7a?dl=0 All the Best, Thanks Thomas, looks ok stopped down, much as I remember it on film last time I did any 'tests'! Best Wishes, Gerry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4713 Posted December 27, 2014 The R 28mm f2.8 Elmarit V2 is probably the sharpest 28mm lens that I have seen on an A7r and pretty darn sharp into the corners by around f5.6 or f8... I own it as well (11259) and liked it almost as much as the Oly 28/2 on my 5D but at f/5.6 or f/8 all Leica lenses are pretty well sharp from corner to corner fortunately. F/2 or f/2.8 is another story and the Summicron 28/2 is the sharpest 28 i've ever used there i must say. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturephoto1 Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4714 Posted December 27, 2014 I own it as well (11259) and liked it almost as much as the Oly 28/2 on my 5D but at f/5.6 or f/8 all Leica lenses are pretty well sharp from corner to corner fortunately. F/2 or f/2.8 is another story and the Summicron 28/2 is the sharpest 28 i've ever used there i must say. Pretty much any of us on FM that own and use the R 28mm f2.8 V2 have found the lens to exemplary on the A7r cameras and are all extremely enthusiastic about its performance on the camera. Most have come to the conclusion that it is probably the best performing 28mm lens available for the A7r and A7 cameras. By the way, don't forget that f5.6 is stopped down 2 stops from maximum for the R Elmarit V2 and I believe that it also pretty sharp in the corners even at f4. Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4715 Posted December 27, 2014 Good to know if i come to replace my old 5D one day or another thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4716 Posted December 27, 2014 Pretty much any of us on FM that own and use the R 28mm f2.8 V2 have found the lens to exemplary on the A7r cameras and are all extremely enthusiastic about its performance on the camera. Most have come to the conclusion that it is probably the best performing 28mm lens available for the A7r and A7 cameras. By the way, don't forget that f5.6 is stopped down 2 stops from maximum for the R Elmarit V2 and I believe that it also pretty sharp in the corners even at f4. Rich Thanks Rich. How does the Vario-R 28-90/2.8-4.5 compare at f/5.6? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturephoto1 Posted December 27, 2014 Share #4717 Posted December 27, 2014 Thanks Rich. How does the Vario-R 28-90/2.8-4.5 compare at f/5.6? K-H, I don't have an R 28-90mm Vario Elmar so I can not say. My only R zooms are the 35-70mm f4 Vario Elmar, the 80-200mm f4 Vario Elmar, and the 70-210mm f4 Vario Elmar. Sorry, I just can't help on that question. Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Chen Posted December 28, 2014 Share #4718 Posted December 28, 2014 Most have come to the conclusion that it is probably the best performing 28mm lens available for the A7r and A7 cameras. By the way, don't forget that f5.6 is stopped down 2 stops from maximum for the R Elmarit V2 and I believe that it also pretty sharp in the corners even at f4. Rich Here are some OOC jpeg images created by A7R + Leica R 28/2.8 (V2, 1994 version)at f5.6 or f8, a couple of weeks ago. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kbslp0z4j5wjnjc/AACj_yL9bgNaQ9sQguX_bcGTa?dl=0 From my own perception the performance of R 28/2.8 is by no means inferior to that of M 35/1.4 ASHP pre FLE at the same aperture setting. Perhaps a bit superior to the latter, in terms of 3D popping and color rendering. R 28/2.8 comes with floating elements to enable 30cm close focusing, making itself a more versatile lens than the 35 Lux in this regard. Fortunately the price of a second-hand R 28/2.8 is less than 25% of a M 35/1.4 ASPH pre FLE, at least in the market here. It could be an idea lens for those who seek for an affordable excellent Leica WA lens suitable for A7x cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted December 28, 2014 Share #4719 Posted December 28, 2014 Here are some OOC jpeg images created by A7R + Leica R 28/2.8 (V2, 1994 version)at f5.6 or f8, a couple of weeks ago. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kbslp0z4j5wjnjc/AACj_yL9bgNaQ9sQguX_bcGTa?dl=0 From my own perception the performance of R 28/2.8 is by no means inferior to that of M 35/1.4 ASHP pre FLE at the same aperture setting. Perhaps a bit superior to the latter, in terms of 3D popping and color rendering. R 28/2.8 comes with floating elements to enable 30cm close focusing, making itself a more versatile lens than the 35 Lux in this regard. Fortunately the price of a second-hand R 28/2.8 is less than 25% of a M 35/1.4 ASPH pre FLE, at least in the market here. It could be an idea lens for those who seek for an affordable excellent Leica WA lens suitable for A7x cameras. Thank you Thomas. Great images with High IQ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Helm Posted December 28, 2014 Share #4720 Posted December 28, 2014 The A7ii has in-house image stabilization and takes Leica M and R lenses read more about it www.stevehuffphoto.com/tag/sony-a7ii/ In shops now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.