The Sony A7 thread [Merged]

[flyalf]

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I'm very happy with the A7R - I think the key is to stop thinking of it as an alternative to the Leica M - once you see it as complimentary to it, doing some things better and some things worse, it makes a lot of sense. I'm so glad the M is a better camera in so many respects as otherwise I would be beating myself up for spending so much on it!

 

Thanks for information! Would you care to elaborate on what kind of scenarios you would choose one or the other? Street, landscape, studio, etc...

 

I was in some of the same situation by owning M9 and NEX-7. I always ended up choosing M9 for all my photography, but I did not do any macro, nor sport/tele.

[jaapv]

[ATTACH]413448[/ATTACH]

OOC JPG, Sony A7R + Leica Vario-Elmar-R 1:4.2/105-280, wide open

 

[ATTACH]413449[/ATTACH]

The above image was taken in the same light with the Universal Lens Calibrator from Capture One Complete.

 

The intensity and fidelity of the colors are truly amazing IMHO.

I also get excellent skin tones with the A7R + FE 35/2.8.

 

More here: The GetDPI Photography Forums - View Single Post - A7r - and why I'm keeping it ..., The GetDPI Photography Forums - View Single Post - A7r - and why I'm keeping it ...

Sorry, Karl-Heinz, that one is too Technicolor for me....

[naturephoto1]

Since Lloyd Chambers was brought up, has anyone a comment on his discovery that the a7r with an APO 180 R lens shows considerable definition loss when used in the vertical position. Camera shake?

 

Hi Lou,

 

I have shot some vertical shots in the field with my A7r and my Leica 100mm f2.8 Apo Macro Elmarit. These were on my RRS TVC-24L Versa Series 2 Tripod with RRS Leveling Base, Markins M20 head etc. The lens was attached via my Novoflex Leica R to NEX adapter and tripod mounted using my Novoflex ASTAT-NEX rotating collar.

 

See the links below; the last one shows the 100% crop of the full frame image and both images were taken with Sony A7r, Leica R 100mm f2.8 Apo Macro Elmarit, f5.6, 1/3 sec. Images worked and processed through LR5.3RC.

 

Sony A7r shutter vibration - FM Forums

 

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/ufiles/83/897883.jpg

 

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/ufiles/84/897884.jpg

 

I have also run tests with my same tripod set-up with my A7r with my Leica 280mm f4 Apo Telyt in the horizontal orientation. I have been able to control some of the vibration through the usage of a bean bag and I could quite possibly use other techniques available to me to possibly still improve the performance for even lower shutter speeds.

 

Sony A7r shutter vibration - FM Forums

 

Plus the following 2 postings after that.

 

Let me take delivery of my RRS L bracket for the camera and run some tests in the vertical orientation with an assortment of lenses including the 280mm f4 Apo Telyt, 180mm f3.4 Apo Telyt, and my 100mm f2.8 Apo Macro Elmarit lenses. I will use a number of things to try to combat the vibration including Bean Bags, clamping the camera down, etc.

 

Rich

[Nick De Marco]

Thanks for information! Would you care to elaborate on what kind of scenarios you would choose one or the other? Street, landscape, studio, etc...

 

I was in some of the same situation by owning M9 and NEX-7. I always ended up choosing M9 for all my photography, but I did not do any macro, nor sport/tele.

 

Thanks

I do mostly street, portraits, but also architecture, travel and occasional landscape.

 

For street, especially fast stuff, the Leica M (or a film M) will always remain my first choice, usually with a wide lens. But I don't see the A7R as useless in that situation. Maybe I want to catch some detail/use a longer lens without changing lenses.

 

For portraits, with some time, I can see the A7R being as good and sometimes better, depending on the lens.

 

The same is true for landscape/ architecture.

 

I keep meaning to do a generally architectural problem (new NY resolution I guess), which will be mainly static photography in relatively low light conditions. I plan to use both the M and A7R for that.

 

Nick

[chrismuc]

The poor performance of Leica wide angle lenses on the A7r and even on the M is not a matter of the camera(s) but due to the fact that Leica - even being in digital M camera business since 2006 (market release, development maybe since 2003) - did not develop and release a single wide angle lens for digital but all their wide angle lens releases in the last ten years where still for film cameras! In contrary, Zeiss designs their lenses for Sony as well as for Fuji and Nokia especially for digital sensors: Excellent corner sharpness, no corner color shifts, very low CA. Their lens IQ is at and above Leica level for a fraction of price. I can't wait for perfectly for digital mirror-less flange distance designed Sony Zeiss 21 and a 85 lenses, that 4 lenses set-up 21/35/55/85 will make the A7/A7r system a really strong competitor to the M.

[drstefanlenz]

well i am extremely happy using the 7r with the noctilux 1.0. i have much more keepers compared to M8 with 1.4 viewfinder. shooting entire xmas-events at aperture 1.0 would have been impossible before like that

[3D-Kraft.com]

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The poor performance of Leica wide angle lenses on the A7r and even on the M is not a matter of the camera(s) but due to the fact that Leica - even being in digital M camera business since 2006 (market release, development maybe since 2003) - did not develop and release a single wide angle lens for digital but all their wide angle lens releases in the last ten years where still for film cameras!

 

Except WATE...

[k-hawinkler]

Sorry, Karl-Heinz, that one is too Technicolor for me....

 

Thanks Jaap, no problem, that's okay with me.

I am just blown away by the fidelity of these OOC JPGs.

My M9 OOC JPGs suck big time by comparison.

 

Of course I could start with the RAW images and muck around.

But I wanted to show the OOC JPGs and I am impressed very positively.

 

I guess we have to agree to disagree then.

 

PS: I suppose the same argument that was made for M9 and M240 colors can be made here as well. One has to build the right profiles so that the color is to ones liking and start with the RAW files. Certainly the A7R skin colors look more natural to me right out of the camera without having set up profiles.

[k-hawinkler]

Except WATE...

 

Thamks. I agree, my WATE is an exceptional good performer on the A7R.

[mmradman]

The poor performance of Leica wide angle lenses on the A7r and even on the M is not a matter of the camera(s) but due to the fact that Leica - even being in digital M camera business since 2006 (market release, development maybe since 2003) - did not develop and release a single wide angle lens for digital but all their wide angle lens releases in the last ten years where still for film cameras! In contrary, Zeiss designs their lenses for Sony as well as for Fuji and Nokia especially for digital sensors: Excellent corner sharpness, no corner color shifts, very low CA. Their lens IQ is at and above Leica level for a fraction of price. I can't wait for perfectly for digital mirror-less flange distance designed Sony Zeiss 21 and a 85 lenses, that 4 lenses set-up 21/35/55/85 will make the A7/A7r system a really strong competitor to the M.

 

Yeah, blame it on Leica wides, poor design choices by Leica, didn't consider 18mm registry distance, LOL.

 

Sony/Zeiss will come eventually with good native primes for A7/R platform but those lens want be small, do you think otherwise?

[Guest polygamer]

Hi, Ernst Leitz Tele-Elmar 4/135, f8, SONY A7, ISO 2000, 1/60sec, JPEG ooc.

 

Not too bad...

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[k-hawinkler]

Yeah, blame it on Leica wides, poor design choices by Leica, didn't consider 18mm registry distance, LOL.

 

Sony/Zeiss will come eventually with good native primes for A7/R platform but those lens want be small, do you think otherwise?

 

Thanks. I suppose you meant "won't be small".

I agree. Luckily they don't have to (as they need to be small out of necessity on a rangefinder).

I don't mind somewhat larger lenses on non-rangefinder cameras provided they are performing exceptionally well.

[JimKasson]

Sony/Zeiss will come eventually with good native primes for A7/R platform but those lens want be small, do you think otherwise?

 

I dunno. You could say the same thing about the lenses for the NEX-7, but the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 is 36mm flange to filter ring, while the Leica 24mm f/3.8 Elmar ASPH and the M-to-E adapter is 26mm. The Leica 24mm f/2.8 Elmarit ASPH and the M-to-E adapter is 31mm.

 

If you look at the rear element of the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8, it is a ways in front of the rear flange. The rear element of the 24mm f/2.8 Elmarit ASPH is close to being in the plane of the back flange of the adapter ring. Same with the 24mm f/3.8 Elmar ASPH.

 

It appears in the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 case, the lens designers sacrificed compactness in order to achieve better image quality, and decided not to build a small lens and to try to fix it up in firmware.

 

Jim

[mmradman]

Thanks. I suppose you meant "won't be small".

I agree. Luckily they don't have to (as they need to be small out of necessity on a rangefinder).

I don't mind somewhat larger lenses on non-rangefinder cameras provided they are performing exceptionally well.

 

Hi K-H,

 

You were right what i thought Zeiss/Sony primes will be big and not likely to be manually focused.

 

Once Sony NEX FF eventually get's off the ground with full range of lenses than systems can be compared against each other rather than grafting M lenses onto A7/R and getting all cross about unfullfilled expectations - I don't mean you but there is a community of M bashers out there.

[mmradman]

I dunno. You could say the same thing about the lenses for the NEX-7, but the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 is 36mm flange to filter ring, while the Leica 24mm f/3.8 Elmar ASPH and the M-to-E adapter is 26mm. The Leica 24mm f/2.8 Elmarit ASPH and the M-to-E adapter is 31mm.

 

If you look at the rear element of the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8, it is a ways in front of the rear flange. The rear element of the 24mm f/2.8 Elmarit ASPH is close to being in the plane of the back flange of the adapter ring. Same with the 24mm f/3.8 Elmar ASPH.

 

It appears in the Sony/Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 case, the lens designers sacrificed compactness in order to achieve better image quality, and decided not to build a small lens and to try to fix it up in firmware.

 

Jim

 

Jim, Zeiss NEX lenses are designed for APS-C size sensor 16 x 24mm.

 

Find your dimension for M lenses with adapter confusing tube is about 9-10mm and lens are about 40-50 mm flange to filter ring.

[k_g_wolf ✝]

Hi, Ernst Leitz Tele-Elmar 4/135, f8, SONY A7, JPEG ooc.

 

Not too bad...

 

 

Very good indeed!

 

What about f4, do you have any sample photos taken with this aperture ?

 

 

Best

GEORG

[Guest polygamer]

Very good indeed!

 

What about f4, do you have any sample photos taken with this aperture ?

Not on the a7. I typically use f8 on the Elmar, however it also works beautifully at f4.

 

Presently, I have the Elmar R 4/180 fitted to the a7. But maybe tomorrow I can show something from the 135mm Elmar at f4...

 

Until then,

 

greetings Immo!

[ModernMan]

The poor performance of Leica wide angle lenses on the A7r and even on the M is not a matter of the camera(s) but due to the fact that Leica - even being in digital M camera business since 2006 (market release, development maybe since 2003) - did not develop and release a single wide angle lens for digital but all their wide angle lens releases in the last ten years where still for film cameras! In contrary, Zeiss designs their lenses for Sony as well as for Fuji and Nokia especially for digital sensors: Excellent corner sharpness, no corner color shifts, very low CA. Their lens IQ is at and above Leica level for a fraction of price. I can't wait for perfectly for digital mirror-less flange distance designed Sony Zeiss 21 and a 85 lenses, that 4 lenses set-up 21/35/55/85 will make the A7/A7r system a really strong competitor to the M.

 

I think its more likely that Sony and Leica will continue improve the angle-of-incidence uniformity of their full frame sensors to the point where it becomes a non-issue. And I expect that will happen before there is a set of fast Zeiss primes in FE mount available. Then we may be looking back at the brief era where Zeiss designed special lenses to accommodate the deficiencies of early full frame sensors.

 

Further, if the Zeiss Otus is emblematic of the eventual range of fast Zeiss primes with wonderful IQ, they may be too big for enjoyable everyday use.

[k-hawinkler]

Thanks Jaap, no problem, that's okay with me.

I am just blown away by the fidelity of these OOC JPGs.

My M9 OOC JPGs suck big time by comparison.

 

Of course I could start with the RAW images and muck around.

But I wanted to show the OOC JPGs and I am impressed very positively.

 

I guess we have to agree to disagree then.

 

PS: I suppose the same argument that was made for M9 and M240 colors can be made here as well. One has to build the right profiles so that the color is to ones liking and start with the RAW files. Certainly the A7R skin colors look more natural to me right out of the camera without having set up profiles.

 

 

Hi Jaap,

 

To expand on this.

Could you please describe what you object to specifically?

Also in what way would you like to see the colors changed?

 

If anyone wants to play with this image I could make the .ARW file available via DropBox.

Thanks.

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[dwbell]

You're being very gracious K-H. I didn't read a request for artistic critique. Did I miss that?

Of course it would be easy to obfuscate the technical merit of the test images you posted by using a different, subjective criteria. But what reason would any individual have for doing that...