Leica M 240 what is going on

[lct]

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The thing I'd be most concerned about when shipping such gear around internationally is that you might get back a clean sensor, but a misaligned rangefinder due to all the bumps and drops in transit.

Exactly. Happened to me twice already.

[janki]

I'm also with cars as a hobby.

 

Today it is quite common that eg all types of oils and filters are delivered in completely sealed containers or plastic packaging.

On the label of a bottle of oil, it is currently quite common to read something like: "refuse this can if seal is broken."

 

Japanese oil filters are completely sealed in shrink plastic, - U.S. filters are often delivered without any kind of protection.

I have also read horror stories on the Internet about American oil filters delivered straight from the shelf, full of dirt.

 

I have been witness to photo retailers who treat their shelf goods as if it was shingle and gravel they sold.

Seeing a Leica Dealer brush new Leica lenses with his usual dirty handkerchief, make me shocked.

 

No one would even think of choosing an opened carton of milk from the fridge in the supermarket.

 

Leica should deliver all their cameras and lenses in sealed package. It is not asking too much for such costly products.

 

“Refuse this Leica product if seal is broken.”

[algrove]

Balifoods, I feel for you. It IS frustrating to have spots on your images. I change lenses often and have created my own problems when doing that. I have had my share of spots. I thought about cleaning my sensors and opted for someone else to do it. Since I cannot cook worth a damn I also go out to eat. Good comparison for me.

 

However, for me, I find the M sensor spots to be less than on my M9's or Monochrom.Your explanation sounds like a disaster and perhaps Stephen is correct that your camera was opened and used a bit before you took possession of it.

 

Maybe this is a good opportunity to find someone locally who can clean your sensor.

[lct]

Or an opportunity to learn sensor cleaning for good.

[MirekE]

I use Canon and Leica and in fact, I clean the Canon's sensor more frequently, despite it's built-in sensor cleaning function. In the film days, removing dust was an inevitable part of every printing and was more of a PITA in both cleaning and retouching.

 

Even though the camera should have arrived clean, dust removal is usually trivial operation and can be done quicker than writing a post on a forum.

[balifoods]

To add yet one more analogy in car terms, this would be like living with your Jeep in the remote outback, 3 hours away from the nearest village with a garage.

 

In the real world, you'd probably find most people in such conditions able and willing to do basic maintenance and repairs of their car themselves, instead of whining about the inconvenience of getting their own hands dirty.

 

In the old Hasselblad V days, packing a screwdriver and learning how to resolve shutter jams was commonplace and not worth further mentioning. Yes, expensive high-end Hasselblads with frequent shutter jams! I wonder how many photographers in the field chose to wrap up, go home, and write to the president of Hasselblad, instead of reaching out for their screwdriver and fixing the jam in a minute?

 

If you feel so burdened by the prospect of having to clean your M yourself, maybe you should question whether the M is the right camera for your current living conditions. Maybe a self-cleaning DSLR would be a wiser choice if the next capable dealer is so far away? Note that in the above car analogy, most people would probably decide to buy a Jeep for the countryside, and not a Mercedes or a Lamborghini.

I also have a D5 mark 3 and Nex 7. Both cameras no dust problems

[balifoods]

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There is always a detailed report with the camera of the repairs carried out.

 

Thank you for this, there must be many out there with the same problems

[lct]

My 5D has no dust problems either. It just needs sensor cleaning from time to time like other DSLRs.

[JDP]

I haven't read all the post, so please forgive me if I've repeated anothers' comments, but here's my pennies worth regarding this issue.

 

I also had similar problems with my M, albeit not as severe as you describe. Having had it for a few days and shot perhaps a 100 images with it I noticed some dust spots on the sensor when images were opened in LR. I used the 'dust detection' function which indeed showed several 'spots'. A couple cleaning swabs and the sensor was confirmed clean by the detection system and test shots opened in LR.

 

Even cameras with in built 'sensor cleaning' are unable to remove 'wet/sticky' spots which can be a problem with DSLR's I own.

 

Bottom line is if you want to have a clean sensor, regular wet cleaning is your only option, so well worth learning to do yourself both from a cost and time perspective. I check my sensor 'cleanliness' about once a week depending on how much I'm using it, and probably clean it on average once a month when spots appear, or more regularly if needed. I tend to try the blower first to dislodge any 'dry dust', re-check and do a wet clean for any stubborn remaining dust.

 

I use Eclipse solution and the associated pads that I purchase in a bulk 100 pack, but there are numerous options available. The eclipse is a fast drying solution so do follow the instruction for use to avoid swabbing the sensor with a dry swab. I have found this to work best for me on both Leica and DSLR sensors and it cleans and dries quickly meaning the shutter is not left open for as long, which leads to less dust being able to adhere to the sensor while cleaning.

 

Do bear in mind that it can take several swabs and passes to get the sensor fully clean so the bulk packs can save you quite some money if you're prepared to outlay for them.

 

Anyway, best of luck, and don't be afraid to give it a try yourself, it really is very easy and will save you a ton of time and expense over getting it done 'professionally'.

 

James.

[wlaidlaw]

I use Eclipse solution and the associated pads that I purchase in a bulk 100 pack, but there are numerous options available. The eclipse is a fast drying solution so do follow the instruction for use to avoid swabbing the sensor with a dry swab. I have found this to work best for me on both Leica and DSLR sensors and it cleans and dries quickly meaning the shutter is not left open for as long, which leads to less dust being able to adhere to the sensor while cleaning.

 

James.

 

There was a rumour going round that Leica no longer recommends Eclipse, possibly due to white deposits being left on the sensor. I still have half a large bottle of E2, bought when that was what Leica recommended. E2 and E1 have now been replaced just by Eclipse E I believe. However, having had sensors replaced on my M8 and M9, not due I would add to cleaning issues, I am now sensitive about what liquid to use on my swabs. I therefore bought a tiny bottle of Visible Dust "Smear Away," which from the price must be distilled from platinum, frankincense and myrrh. Others have suggested using high purity Iso Propyl alcohol, which if correct is a very cheap option. I have a half litre can of this stuff, which I use for multiple cleaning purposes, e.g. getting grease off my Arctic Butterfly sensor brush.

 

Does anyone know if there is an official Leica line on what liquid to use for wet cleans?

 

Wilson

[jaapv]

Afaik not; I use the same products you do and I use the rest of the Eclipse for other cleaning purposes like fingerprints on the viewfinder windows. Btw I saw the Eclipse residue with the microscope - it is really there. I think it is some softening agent that is leached out of the plastic of the bottle.

I have recently discovered Eyelead and I must say that the products work as advertised. Even the lollipop is quite effective and it lifted a surprising amount of black gunk (that I didn't even know was there) from my M(typ240) sensor.

[thighslapper]

I suppose the poster will be returning his lenses as well when he spots the invitable few specks of dust that will appear as if by magic as time goes by.......

 

In my experience dust seems to appear in 'spates' rather than gradual accumulation and is clearly related to environmental conditions and usage.......

 

It's a fact of life and just needs to be got over and dealt with.

 

As Jaap says, the camera leaves assembly and QC spotless..... so any muck is either rattled free from the camera body in transit or dumped in the camera when the first lens is used......

 

If the former, the owner should be happy that he has probably got rid of all the potential crud in the camera body right at the start of ownership

[wlaidlaw]

Btw I saw the Eclipse residue with the microscope - it is really there. I think it is some softening agent that is leached out of the plastic of the bottle.

 

I am surprised that Eclipse don't use polyethylene for their bottles, where you don't need to add phthalate plasticisers rather than the polypropylene I think they are made of. We all know how difficult it is to remove these when they have evaporated from the insides of cars and recondensed on the inside of the glass. Time to bring back glass bottles with ground glass stoppers?

 

Wilson

[wlaidlaw]

I cannot get dust detection to work on my replacement M240. It keeps telling me that dust detection is not possible as the object is inhomogeneous. My previous M240 was not at all fussy and a pale bed sheet worked just fine. I have gone as far as getting a brand new sheet of A3+ matte white photo-paper out of the box but it still will not work. I have tried the lenses at f22/16/11 and focussed at infinityI have tried with my Zeiss Vario Sonnar at 85mm and Vario Elmar at 200mm, both of which lenses worked fine for dust detection on my previous M240. Any ideas or is this another faulty camera. I will give a try using the sky instead but I did not have a lot of success with this on the previous camera.

 

Wilson

 

PS. This is obviously a sky and not bed sheet camera as the sky worked fine.

[jaapv]

I have exactly the same. It was not really interesting to me but now that you mention it it may well be a bug.

[MirekE]

I am surprised that Eclipse don't use polyethylene for their bottles, where you don't need to add phthalate plasticisers rather than the polypropylene I think they are made of. We all know how difficult it is to remove these when they have evaporated from the insides of cars and recondensed on the inside of the glass. Time to bring back glass bottles with ground glass stoppers?

 

Wilson

 

 

Both PE and PP use small amounts of stabilizers and lubricants and the white color of the bottle comes from added titanium dioxide. In addition, PP can contain residues of atactic polypropylene, which is a sticky matter similar to the glue that is used to attach credit and other similar cards to paper. Obviously, production of plastics is not super clean and the material can get contaminated from containers, carts, pipes, shovels etc.

[farnz]

Perhaps the spots appear because the Leica M is still in its adolescence, they're a result of hormone imbalance and will disappear as the camera ages.

 

Pete.

[wlaidlaw]

Perhaps the spots appear because the Leica M is still in its adolescence, they're a result of hormone imbalance and will disappear as the camera ages.

 

Pete.

 

.....and eating too much chocolate?

 

Wilson

[thighslapper]

I cannot get dust detection to work on my replacement M240. It keeps telling me that dust detection is not possible as the object is inhomogeneous. My previous M240 was not at all fussy and a pale bed sheet worked just fine. I have gone as far as getting a brand new sheet of A3+ matte white photo-paper out of the box but it still will not work. I have tried the lenses at f22/16/11 and focussed at infinityI have tried with my Zeiss Vario Sonnar at 85mm and Vario Elmar at 200mm, both of which lenses worked fine for dust detection on my previous M240. Any ideas or is this another faulty camera. I will give a try using the sky instead but I did not have a lot of success with this on the previous camera.

 

Wilson

 

PS. This is obviously a sky and not bed sheet camera as the sky worked fine.

 

Yes...... very fussy since they upgraded my firmware......

 

White paper with uniform illumination and no partial shadowing works ok, although the usual selection of white walls gets the thumbs down.......

 

An expodisk against the sun will probably ok ..... will try it when I can locate where I have put it.....

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[viramati]

Afaik not; I use the same products you do and I use the rest of the Eclipse for other cleaning purposes like fingerprints on the viewfinder windows. Btw I saw the Eclipse residue with the microscope - it is really there. I think it is some softening agent that is leached out of the plastic of the bottle.

I have recently discovered Eyelead and I must say that the products work as advertised. Even the lollipop is quite effective and it lifted a surprising amount of black gunk (that I didn't even know was there) from my M(typ240) sensor.

 

Looks interesting I found the lollipop here

Eyelead sensor cleaning kit SCK-1

which is I suppose is a bit like the Dust-Aid Platinum.

You mentioned that uses some of their other products, which ones?

Thanks