matlep Posted July 19, 2013 Share #81 Posted July 19, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Guess I'm still missing something. If I keep my cam by my side and see a shot, I'll depress the shutter slightly to wake the camera and raise it to my eye to frame and shoot. That takes a couple of sec. Unless the cam goes to sleep immediately after, I don't see the issue. Jeff Well. Different needs and ways of working for everybody. Fore some even 5 seconds is not a problem... But the M9 never felt sluggish. It was advertised by Leica at 0.8 seconds startup. And I think it held up to that pretty good. 2 seconds for the M works in most cases, far better than 5 seconds which was my starting point. But I have gotten the occasional "sluggish" feeling with the M. And it doesn't feel right. What other camera company than Leica would get away with their top-model being slower that the previous one, and people still applauding them? Sometimes I shoot with zone focusing and if the camera has gone to sleep, 2 seconds is 1 second to long... In my opinion anyway. If the rumoured Sony NEX FF would have a 2 second startup time, it would be a laughing matter. My new Ricoh GR isn´t that slow. It is about 1 second. And it still have to push out a lens when it starts up. Im confused what makes the Leica this slow and I have e-mailed Leica Customer Service about it. Still awaiting a reply. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Hi matlep, Take a look here M Typ 240 startup time. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted July 19, 2013 Share #82 Posted July 19, 2013 ... If I keep my cam by my side and see a shot, I'll depress the shutter slightly to wake the camera and raise it to my eye to frame and shoot... Doesn't work if the camera is turned off. I turn it on while raising it, i frame, i shoot and nothing happens. Too slow. To avoid this i must think not to switch the cam off or to half press the shutter release just after turning the cam on. No good for distracted people like me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share #83 Posted July 19, 2013 I guess Im just asking if we are all measuring the same thing. When I first got the card I came up with 1 second. It wasn't until I used a stopwatch and followed the same procedures repeatedly did I determine the actual time was two seconds. I just find it hard to believe there are variations in cameras. If there are, I would be disappointed.I think we are both measuring different things. I'll post a video as a point of reference to compare to what you are doing. Im not even looking at the lights in my test. If you look at my earlier post, my test is quite simple. It does not make a difference. If I use your method (which is not a realistic test as it is unusual to press the shutter release, switch on and bring your camera to your eye, normally one would switch on, raise the camera and shoot) the result is the same; just under 1 sec by the stopwatch. We need Bert here who has gear to measure these things exactly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 19, 2013 Share #84 Posted July 19, 2013 Most M240s are out of specs anyway. The next firmware update will address that for good hopefully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted July 19, 2013 Share #85 Posted July 19, 2013 Doesn't work if the camera is turned off. I turn it on while raising it, i frame, i shoot and nothing happens. Too slow. To avoid this i must think not to switch the cam off or to half press the shutter release just after turning the cam on. No good for distracted people like me. I never turn my camera off. I turn it on in the morning and leave it on until the end of the day I select auto off in setting to 2 min. The battery lasts all day, and the camera is always ready to shoot. I also just get in the habit of touching the shutter to wake it up...been doing this for many years since the M8 days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
satureyes Posted July 19, 2013 Share #86 Posted July 19, 2013 I never turn my camera off. I turn it on in the morning and leave it on until the end of the dayI select auto off in setting to 2 min. The battery lasts all day, and the camera is always ready to shoot. I also just get in the habit of touching the shutter to wake it up...been doing this for many years since the M8 days. Actually I mistakenly left my camera switched on overnight. I don't think the % dropped at all. Perhaps 1 or 2 % max. R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted July 19, 2013 Share #87 Posted July 19, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) It does not make a difference. If I use your method (which is not a realistic test as it is unusual to press the shutter release, switch on and bring your camera to your eye, normally one would switch on, raise the camera and shoot) the result is the same; just under 1 sec by the stopwatch. We need Bert here who has gear to measure these things exactly. No its not normal...but its the only way to compare accurately between two cameras. This is precisely my point, the differences in times is not the cards, but rather the methods of the tests. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 19, 2013 Share #88 Posted July 19, 2013 I don't think so. Bert (Lindolfi) did count the same way as i do IIRC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
insomnia Posted July 19, 2013 Share #89 Posted July 19, 2013 Most M240s are out of specs anyway. The next firmware update will address that for good hopefully. Like they fixed the M9 SD-Card issues? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted July 19, 2013 Share #90 Posted July 19, 2013 I don't think so. Bert (Lindolfi) did count the same way as i do IIRC. call me skeptical, but I don't believe it until I see it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 19, 2013 Share #91 Posted July 19, 2013 In such matters, i would trust Lindolfi more so than i trust myself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 19, 2013 Author Share #92 Posted July 19, 2013 In such matters, i would trust Lindolfi more so than i trust myself. The same here. After all he has a whole lab available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted July 19, 2013 Share #93 Posted July 19, 2013 Doesn't work if the camera is turned off. I don't turn it off; no need when the whole purpose of having it on my shoulder is to use it. With my M8.2, I just leave it on and slightly depress shutter before raising to eye. Simple. And the M battery is even better. Different strokes, so to speak. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 19, 2013 Share #94 Posted July 19, 2013 Yes indeed but the cam is off specs anyway and it is too times slower than your beloved M8.2 (one second) so i find it very hard to defend it here even if i think that it is the best digital M ever made otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted July 20, 2013 Share #95 Posted July 20, 2013 Well, good to know you like it otherwise. My strategy has always been to wait for the bugs to get sorted, have one or two firmware upgrades, etc. But I played with one at the somewhat local boutique store recently....sweet machine. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted July 20, 2013 Share #96 Posted July 20, 2013 In such matters, i would trust Lindolfi more so than i trust myself. Yes, I agree with both you and jaapv, but I'm sure that Lindolfi would agree that good science dictates that we question his results and ask him to turn in his lab book for review. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindolfi Posted July 20, 2013 Share #97 Posted July 20, 2013 Yes, I agree with both you and jaapv, but I'm sure that Lindolfi would agree that good science dictates that we question his results and ask him to turn in his lab book for review. Yes, I agree. In fact, I would be even more strict than that: I should exactly describe how I got the results and other observers should be able to replicate the experiment. So here is the setup: 1] Place the camera on a tripod 2] Select classic metering, no LiveView 3] Prefocus the camera on the screen of an iPad (or a regular digital stopwatch) 4] Find the correct exposure (ISO and aperture) for an exposure time of 1/125 sec 5] Switch the camera off 6] Screw on a cable release and fix the cable to already engage the shutter 7] Start up "StopWatch" application on the iPad, that has a digital resolution of 0.1 sec. 8] Switch the camera on with your right hand to the S mode, while tapping the start button on the iPad (or the regular digital stopwatch) with your left hand 9] Switch off the camera 10] Release the pushed state of the cable release 11] Check the elapsed time on the photograph I posted the results earlier: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/277048-m240-sd-cards-associated-camera-function-7.html#post2435847 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted July 20, 2013 Share #98 Posted July 20, 2013 Although this thread will no doubt run and run I find the lack of comparison to real world usage rather amusing ....... This is a manual focus camera....... Usually it is dangling from my neck or hand ...... If I see something I want to photograph I switch on or tap the shutter whilst raising it to my eye ...... then have to focus and/or set the aperture..... and compose..... then take a picture.... I defy anyone to do this in less than 2 seconds Ok, for shots in hurry without focussing or any other setting then it may be an issue... but you would have to be a very strange photographer if you habitually did this.... and if you did you would leave the auto-off disabled and have the camera permanently on (although the battery discharges about 5% per hour). As almost everyone seems to be able to get to 2 secs or less by changing cards/ re-formatting then that is perfectly adequate...... and even if Leica to make it quicker it will not realistically change the usability of the camera. With 'auto everything' including autofocus on a Nikon or Canon sub 1sec start-up might be handy for sports reportage or papparazzi......... but not on an M Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 20, 2013 Share #99 Posted July 20, 2013 No more zone focussing with Leica? One missed shot is one too many. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matlep Posted July 20, 2013 Share #100 Posted July 20, 2013 With 'auto everything' including autofocus on a Nikon or Canon sub 1sec start-up might be handy for sports reportage or papparazzi......... but not on an M The M9 is 0,8 seconds startup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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