skimmel Posted March 31, 2007 Share #1 Posted March 31, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am new to the M8, but not digital, having been shooting Canon DSLRs for about 3 years. It took me a while to get my sharpening levels to where I liked them with my DSLRs and I suspect it's going to take a while with the M8. I realize that there are many ways to sharpen and a lot depends on the image, but I was wondering, somewhat qualitatively, how much sharpening people are using with their M8's relative to DSLRs (given the lack of antialias filter, Leica lenses, etc) to get good *prints.* (I am not talking about sharpening for the screen.) So, here are a few questions to try to get things rolling: - Are you applying sharpening within your RAW converter? (I never did this with Canon files, but wondering what the M8 experience is). - Are you, in general, sharpening Leica files less than other cameras? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 31, 2007 Posted March 31, 2007 Hi skimmel, Take a look here Sharpening Experience with M8. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
AlanJW Posted March 31, 2007 Share #2 Posted March 31, 2007 I am new to the M8, but not digital, having been shooting Canon DSLRs for about 3 years. It took me a while to get my sharpening levels to where I liked them with my DSLRs and I suspect it's going to take a while with the M8. I realize that there are many ways to sharpen and a lot depends on the image, but I was wondering, somewhat qualitatively, how much sharpening people are using with their M8's relative to DSLRs (given the lack of antialias filter, Leica lenses, etc) to get good *prints.* (I am not talking about sharpening for the screen.) So, here are a few questions to try to get things rolling: - Are you applying sharpening within your RAW converter? (I never did this with Canon files, but wondering what the M8 experience is). - Are you, in general, sharpening Leica files less than other cameras? I'm sure there are a hundred answers to this, and you will need to find your own comfort level. But here goes: I use CS2, with ACR 3.7. I do no sharpening in the raw developer -- just WB , etc. In Photoshop I use Nik Sharpener or Photokit to add some sharpening. ("raw sharpening"in Nik). The Leica files take (need) less sharpening than the Canon 5D images. If I go past 50% in Nik, they look oversharpened. With the 5D I would sometimes go as high as 75% or 80%. I like Nik because if you add to much you can back off ("fade") right from the PS menu. Nik also allows for sharening to a particular printer and size of print but I rarely use this feature. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sm23221 Posted March 31, 2007 Share #3 Posted March 31, 2007 I have to sharpen my Canon 1Ds2 images quite a lot. It takes very little sharpening with unsharp mask to sharpen Leica images. I mostly use Nik and always end up with consistently sharp, but not oversharpened, images. My Leica JPEG images do not need any sharpening for printing (I have it set to moderate sharpening). The very last stage of my workflow is sharpening and I do not sharpen RAW images. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjmcsu Posted March 31, 2007 Share #4 Posted March 31, 2007 I don't sharpen or de-noise the RAW file but rather do it in PS using PhotoKit Sharpener.Very consistent results which are fully editable since they are in layers with masks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted March 31, 2007 Share #5 Posted March 31, 2007 I don't sharpen in the RAW converter (ACR), but I sharpen before output for internet using the Photokit sharpeners. I'm finding with the M8 that I have to reduce the opacity of the Photokit sharpeners to 50% or less - i.e the images need less sharpening than my Canon 5D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted March 31, 2007 Share #6 Posted March 31, 2007 About half or less of what I sharpen my D200 files. But I do use about the same radius if not a little more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjmcsu Posted March 31, 2007 Share #7 Posted March 31, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I don't sharpen in the RAW converter (ACR), but I sharpen before output for internet using the Photokit sharpeners. I'm finding with the M8 that I have to reduce the opacity of the Photokit sharpeners to 50% or less - i.e the images need less sharpening than my Canon 5D. most definitely agree c/w my D2x especially somewhat reminiscent of my old Kodak14nx(had other issues of course) in terms of detail & need for less sharpening Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted April 1, 2007 Share #8 Posted April 1, 2007 I only use the sharpening tools available on PSCS, and with the M8, I do less sharpening than with the Canon 5D simply because the image is sharper to begin with. So, I suspect you will be doing less sharpening regardless of what your comfort level is. Cheers, Wilfredo Benitez-Rivera Photography Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradhusick Posted April 1, 2007 Share #9 Posted April 1, 2007 Guys, here is a comparison of an 800x800 pixel 100% crop of an M8 RAW file with no sharpening applied, and with RAW Presharpening done with Nik Sharpener Pro 2.0, both saved as JPEG. No other changes were made. -Brad Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/20271-sharpening-experience-with-m8/?do=findComment&comment=217269'>More sharing options...
Iron Flatline Posted April 1, 2007 Share #10 Posted April 1, 2007 Nik Sharpener Pro just before finishing the file to be printed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted April 1, 2007 Share #11 Posted April 1, 2007 The M8 raw files are pretty darn sharp to begin with. I do no sharpening when processing in ACR. I use Smart Sharpen in CS2 in the output. It is no more than 50% though at the max. My Nikon raw files need considerably more obviously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted April 1, 2007 Share #12 Posted April 1, 2007 Hey--back from a virtual Internet blackout in Vegas (mostly my fault--I left my laptop adapter at home and couldn't bring myself to spend the exorbitant prices they wanted for a replacement at the stores).... Sharpening depends on so many variables, like internal contrast, final output and a ton of other things. In general, though, I apply capture sharpening in RAW (yeah, some--the M8 shots take way less) unless I'm going to be manipulating the shot a lot (and then I leave sharpening till the end). Then I usually luminance sharpen for microcontrast in PS (using a high pass filter or luminance contrast layer). For critical sharpening I'll switch to LAB and sharpen only the L. Finally, I like Photokit Sharpener for output too. Sharpening for print on the screen though is a bit hit and miss--usually you can "oversharpen" for print (in other words, the print looks bad on screen) and get great results. So you need to get used to the idea that your screen won't show you the print results--only a test print can do that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
skimmel Posted April 1, 2007 Author Share #13 Posted April 1, 2007 Thanks everyone for the advice. Jamie's point is a very good one -- sharpening for print is, for me, a bit empiric. I am not good at determining how much sharpening I need, based on looking at the screen, to get well-sharpened (but not too sharpened) prints. I have figured this out for my other cameras so will figure it out as well for the M8 -- I find there's always a period of experimentation I have to go through with each new digital camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted April 1, 2007 Share #14 Posted April 1, 2007 .......usually you can "oversharpen" for print (in other words, the print looks bad on screen) and get great results...... Particularly if you are sharpening your sized file for printing at 100% on screen. Try sharpening at 50% file size on screen for a better impression of how it will appear in print. It's amazing how file horrors, including crude sharpening, when viewed at 100% can disappear when printed. ...........................Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradhusick Posted April 1, 2007 Share #15 Posted April 1, 2007 (I don't work for Nik...) One of the things I like about Nik Sharpener Pro is that you sharpen based on the type of printer, the size of the print and the viewing distance. Nik calculates the rest for you. -Brad Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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