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Leica Tri Elmar 28-35-50 and 6 bit coding

mvravr

By mvravr
in Leica M Lenses

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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Wilson. Tried your suggestions, but no luck so far. I have 10 coded Leica lenses. Eight primes plus MATE and WATE. All eight primes register correctly. The WATE brings up only 4/16mm, no matter what focal length lens is set at. The MATE always shows as uncoded. The MATE also shows correct frame lines for all three focal lengths.

 

Rafe,

 

Have you checked that some of the paint has not come out of coding slots on lens. Otherwise as Olaf says - off for a holiday in Solms. Just to check if the coding slots are misplaced, set lens recognition to automatic, release bayonet latch, press info and wiggle lens backwards and forwards to see if coding pops up.

 

Wilson

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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Tried releasing the bayonet latch and giving the lens a wiggle and still shows as uncoded. Paint also looks fine.

 

Then I suspect the problem may lie in your M not the lens.

 

Wilson

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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Rafe,

 

I have now seen other posts on different threads, where the M detects some lenses but not others. When the cameras have been returned, Leica have changed the bayonet to cure the issue, due to one or more of the LED detectors not working properly. I suspect this may be your problem.

 

Wilson

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algrove

algrove

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Wilson. Tried your suggestions, but no luck so far. I have 10 coded Leica lenses. Eight primes plus MATE and WATE. All eight primes register correctly. The WATE brings up only 4/16mm, no matter what focal length lens is set at. The MATE always shows as uncoded. The MATE also shows correct frame lines for all three focal lengths.

 

My WATE has only ever brought up the 16/4 on about 5 different digital M cameras so for me this is par for the course with this lens.

 

Re your MATE-has it been coded? Forgot to go back in the threads to see your comments. As for my MATE, it was coded by Leica and works beautifully and better than my newer WATE.

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jdlaing

jdlaing

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My WATE has only ever brought up the 16/4 on about 5 different digital M cameras so for me this is par for the course with this lens.

 

Re your MATE-has it been coded? Forgot to go back in the threads to see your comments. As for my MATE, it was coded by Leica and works beautifully and better than my newer WATE.

 

Mine too. I suspect the FOV being read by the camera is related to the frame lines brought up by the lens and cam. I think it reads the lens as a single 16mm.

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algrove

algrove

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Mine too. I suspect the FOV being read by the camera is related to the frame lines brought up by the lens and cam. I think it reads the lens as a single 16mm.

 

You are correct, but since the WATE is more modern (?) than the MATE I do not see why it cannot behave like the MATE for EXIF data. Strange design I guess. Some of you must have a good reason why the WATE behaves only as a 16.

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jdlaing

jdlaing

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You are correct, but since the WATE is more modern (?) than the MATE I do not see why it cannot behave like the MATE for EXIF data. Strange design I guess. Some of you must have a good reason why the WATE behaves only as a 16.

 

I wonder if the frame line selection by the lens mount/cam has something that interacts with the lens.

 

IE: No 16/18/21 frame line selection.......no read by the body?

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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You are correct, but since the WATE is more modern (?) than the MATE I do not see why it cannot behave like the MATE for EXIF data. Strange design I guess. Some of you must have a good reason why the WATE behaves only as a 16.

 

Lou,

 

The WATE is a relatively simple wide angle zoom lens with click stops but usable between the click stops. The zoom mechanism is not joined into the mount, which was what one cause of the manufacturing problems of the MATE and presumably which Leica wished not to repeat.

 

The MATE is really quite different and is an incredibly complicated lens with multiple concentric sleeves moving the various elements around and the framelines cam on the mount. When I left my MATE (one of the last ones made in 2007 as a 30% discount lens and I suspect, assembled from spares) for correction of some of its problems during a visit to Solms in early 2008, I was told that Leica had stopped making them as they were losing hundreds of Euro on each lens, before they even costed the high warranty costs.

 

Mine eventually took three visits to Solms before it was nearly right and still sticks on the framelines tab, changing from 28mm to 50mm, necessitating going a bit beyond 50mm and back again.

 

Wilson

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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Here is a picture of a cutaway of the Tri-Elmar 28-35-50 prepared I believe by Leica apprentices. This shows the complexity of this lens.

 

Wilson

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

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jaapv

jaapv

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You are correct, but since the WATE is more modern (?) than the MATE I do not see why it cannot behave like the MATE for EXIF data. Strange design I guess. Some of you must have a good reason why the WATE behaves only as a 16.

 

Because frameline selection makes no sense when there are no framelines for the focal lengths. Nor is there a need for different corrections for different settings. To complicate the lens mount considerably and expensively just to get the focal length into exif would be overdesigning it.

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jaapv

jaapv

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Lou,

 

The WATE is a relatively simple wide angle zoom lens with click stops but usable between the click stops. The zoom mechanism is not joined into the mount, which was what one cause of the manufacturing problems of the MATE and presumably which Leica wished not to repeat.

 

The MATE is really quite different and is an incredibly complicated lens with multiple concentric sleeves moving the various elements around and the framelines cam on the mount. When I left my MATE (one of the last ones made in 2007 as a 30% discount lens and I suspect, assembled from spares) for correction of some of its problems during a visit to Solms in early 2008, I was told that Leica had stopped making them as they were losing hundreds of Euro on each lens, before they even costed the high warranty costs.

 

Mine eventually took three visits to Solms before it was nearly right and still sticks on the framelines tab, changing from 28mm to 50mm, necessitating going a bit beyond 50mm and back again.

 

Wilson

The reason for discontinuation was explained by Stefan Daniel at the LUF meeting in 2008. The production of front element blanks was discontinued by the original supplier. Leica found another supplier, but it turned out that they were unable to achieve consistency in manufacturing quality. In the end Leica was rejecting nine out of ten blanks, making lens production nearly impossible and thus more expensive than the price of the lens.

As a redesign was not feasible economically the decision was taken to stop production.

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MarkP

MarkP

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Such a shame really.

 

Accepting it's maximum f-stop of 4.0, some barrel distortion at 28mm, and that it's not quite as sharp as the latest lenses, it is a fantastic lens and so very convenient to have the three standard focal lengths in the one package.

 

Taking it with one fast lens such as a 35 or 50 Summilux makes for a very practical combination.

 

The lens signature is also gentler than that of the latest lenses, especially on the Monochrom.

 

Waiting for mine to come back from being 6-bit coded.

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wlaidlaw

wlaidlaw

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The M240 is showing up the resolution limitation and softness of the MATE at 28mm. The 28 ASPH Summicron at f4 is a different world to the extent I tend to leave the MATE on my M9 and either use the Summicron or the Zeiss Vario Sonnar 28-85, which seems to suit the CMOS sensor better than the MATE does.

 

Wilson

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wda

wda

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I have always largely ignored the MATE/28, right from its time on the M8 and M9. I treat MATE as a Bi-Elmar (35-50) and that covers at least 80% of my travel needs. If I know I shall need something wider, I take a 21 or 28 prime lens, either giving me extra speed as a bargain, particularly indoors.

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01af

01af

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I treat MATE as a Bi-Elmar (35-50) ...

So do I ... mostly. I am using it approx. 70 % at 50 mm, 25 % at 35 mm, and maybe 5 % at 28 mm—so I could do well without the 28 mm option altogether. What I would pre-order immediately as soon as it would be announced is a Dual-Elmarit-M or Dual-Summarit-M 35-50 mm Asph. Hey, Leica Camera, are you listening ...!? ;):)

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