IWC Doppel Posted September 18, 2012 Share #81 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) The M ist still an RF camera and the EVF therefore an add-on which might be an absolute must for some and an absolute no go for others. An new Leica without an RF would have been quite a disappointment for many at this point in time. I must confess, though, that I had hoped for exactly such a thing at a still lower price than the ME. However, it's not a thing I actually need. Â If they were able to integrate the peaking in the VF then you could always turn off and personalise, the beauty of electronics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 18, 2012 Posted September 18, 2012 Hi IWC Doppel, Take a look here Leica's New Cameras . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Advertisement Posted September 18, 2012 Posted September 18, 2012 Hi IWC Doppel, Take a look here Leica's New Cameras. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaques Posted September 18, 2012 Share #82 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Why? Not everyone wants all the bells and whistles or video in a camera......some of us are very happy with what the M9 delivers as it is. I'm not even remotely tempted by the new M. Â Â I agree- it's not as if the M9 is no good anymore. But I think the price will drop because whether they need it or not- a lot of folks are going to WANT this new M camera. In fact I think we have already seen the price of the M9 dropping rapidly over the last few months as people tried to offload before this announcement... Â givent hat the camera is priced lower than many expected- and has a host of nice new features- many more will now decide that now is the time to sell their m9... Indeed I may be one of them. I am going to wait until we hear more about how this high ISO looks- how good the files look- and other aspects like battery life, processor speed, live view and focus peaking performance.... But overall I must say this new camera is very tempting to me.... One of my few gripes with the M9 is the ISO performance. I found that I really could have used better ISO in quite a range of low light situations where a fast lens and narrow depth of field is not wanted. Also long lenses- I have a Visoflex but it really isn't that practical for some situations... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted September 18, 2012 Share #83 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Well done leica. Only real non issue I have is that they have put the red dot back on the front but hey they can then offer us an upgrade in a year or so for a few hundred pounds not to have it!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuck.kenney Posted September 18, 2012 Share #84 Â Posted September 18, 2012 maybe someone has asked this question already: will M-E's screen be made of sapphire glass? what about the new M's? Thanks~ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted September 18, 2012 Share #85 Â Posted September 18, 2012 If they were able to integrate the peaking in the VF then you could always turn off and personalise, the beauty of electronics. Â How do you propose handling the parallax? The image in the EVF is taken through the lens, the image in OVF through the small window above and to the left of the lens. Double countours will be the norm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted September 18, 2012 Share #86 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Leica who may just possibly know a little more than we do about what the market can take, clearly believe that there's life left in the M9 line. Otherwise why introduce the new entry level range finder camera? And by introducing the M nothing they're also catering to those who want/need all the bells and whistles. The 2 cameras are however not necessarily mutually exclusive.... Â I think this is an important point... Â Leica have probably done better with the M9 than they ever thought possible. Certainly evidenced by their selling 3.5 lenses per M9 body sold than the anticipated 1.1 (or whatever). Â With the R&D already done on the M9 (which is still an outstanding camera) they can now afford to drop the price, increase the customer base, increase lens sales, etc....a whole generation of new customers to get a very severe attack of GAS:D Â I'm glad I already have all of the lenses I need AND want;). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted September 18, 2012 Share #87 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) I thought Leica would drop the M9/P, and introduce an M10 (the M) at a much higher price, effectively moving the brand further up the price scale and out of reach of many. Â I'm pleased that they have decided to create an 'economy' model in the ME. Â Lots here will say they have no need for live view or video, and they don't have to pay for features in a new M camera which they won't use. Â Good strategy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted September 18, 2012 Share #88  Posted September 18, 2012 I am wondering how they are able to offer the M at a price that is lower than the Monochrom M. The latter was introduced at £6120 (7600€) and is currently sold for 6800€ (5500£).  Will there have been compromises in build quality (with resulting "issues" to come) or is this a result of past investments in the full frame M architecture which are now paying dividends?  In light of all the furore over the lofty pricing of the MM and, in particular, the 50 APO I am positively surprised. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted September 18, 2012 Share #89  Posted September 18, 2012 I am wondering how they are able to offer the M at a price that is lower than the Monochrom M. The latter was introduced at £6120 (7600€) and is currently sold for 6800€ (5500£). Will there have been compromises in build quality (with resulting "issues" to come) or is this a result of past investments in the full frame M architecture which are now paying dividends?  In light of all the furore over the lofty pricing of the MM and, in particular, the 50 APO I am positively surprised.  Because costs of production are not the only thing that determine prices. In fact they are not even the major factor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted September 18, 2012 Share #90 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Because costs of production are not the only thing that determine prices. In fact they are not even the major factor. Â True. The price point may also be dependent on brand impression. Wonder if that's formed part of their decision-making. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gravastar Posted September 18, 2012 Share #91  Posted September 18, 2012 maybe someone has asked this question already: will M-E's screen be made of sapphire glass? what about the new M's? Thanks~  The new M is Corning®Gorilla®Glass.  Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted September 18, 2012 Share #92 Â Posted September 18, 2012 How do you propose handling the parallax? The image in the EVF is taken through the lens, the image in OVF through the small window above and to the left of the lens. Double countours will be the norm. Â Any mechanicial system could be replaced by measurement and electronics, the lens still moves by the same amount, sufficient for levers and mirrors to work, it's only reading and mapping electronically. It should make adjustement easier and provide greater accuracy potentially. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWC Doppel Posted September 18, 2012 Share #93 Â Posted September 18, 2012 I thought Leica would drop the M9/P, and introduce an M10 (the M) at a much higher price, effectively moving the brand further up the price scale and out of reach of many. Â I'm pleased that they have decided to create an 'economy' model in the ME. Â Lots here will say they have no need for live view or video, and they don't have to pay for features in a new M camera which they won't use. Â Good strategy. Â Whilst as a 'customer' lowering prices is a good thing, but the messaging is somewhat confusing, suddenly the M9 has moved from the premium camera to essence, reminds me of 'essentials' in the supermarkets, which is not a good thing. Â If I was being negative the DSLR with video, live view, bells and whistles was and is the 'right product', with a bolt on approach the M is getting there... Where is the differentiation, with viewfinder, R adapter, multifunction handgrip and a flash it looks every bit as big as a DSLR. I do hope there won't be an addition that attaches to the lens, that reads the liveview and with a small closed loop computer in the handgrip adjusts the focus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sblitz Posted September 18, 2012 Share #94 Â Posted September 18, 2012 does it take 25mp and maestro to make a CMOS sensor to produce what the 18mp CCD produces -- aside from video and live view and longer battery life? IF the new sensor is dramatically better (how come no shots, DNG examples ala MM?) does this effectively make the MM moot once would turn new M photos into monochrome? i am beginning to think the CMOS will produces images about on par with the CCD but having the CMOS allows for video, live view, and all the other bells and whistles many user want and many pros need (focus, better lcd, for example). Should this be the case, the M has no real appeal to me and am happy the ME is being made as it suggest there will be CCD sensors to replace the M9 at some point in the future, if necessary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted September 18, 2012 Share #95 Â Posted September 18, 2012 am happy the ME is being made as it suggest there will be CCD sensors to replace the M9 at some point in the future, if necessary. Â Or Leica could be burning off their stock of CCDs on this "new" model. Only time will tell if they will support the M9/M9P or simply offer their "upgrade solution". At this point, Leica's actions will speak louder...and with more veracity...than their words. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 18, 2012 Share #96 Â Posted September 18, 2012 I have been playing with the M including the EVF and the accessory bottom plate/grip this afternoon. Â This is the first digital M that has got me properly interested and it could well be my next camera. They have done a fantastic job on this. There are loads of new features and I can see lots of people upgrading. People were on the phone to their dealers throughout the hall. Â I want to see some results but I can see myself using one of these in the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 18, 2012 Share #97 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Or Leica could be burning off their stock of CCDs on this "new" model. Only time will tell if they will support the M9/M9P or simply offer their "upgrade solution". At this point, Leica's actions will speak louder...and with more veracity...than their words. Â The M9P and the M-E are current models and they have continued new stock of new sensors into the future. This is not a run out situation. The only model dropped is the base M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 18, 2012 Share #98 Â Posted September 18, 2012 does it take 25mp and maestro to make a CMOS sensor to produce what the 18mp CCD produces -- aside from video and live view and longer battery life? IF the new sensor is dramatically better (how come no shots, DNG examples ala MM?) does this effectively make the MM moot once would turn new M photos into monochrome? i am beginning to think the CMOS will produces images about on par with the CCD but having the CMOS allows for video, live view, and all the other bells and whistles many user want and many pros need (focus, better lcd, for example). Should this be the case, the M has no real appeal to me and am happy the ME is being made as it suggest there will be CCD sensors to replace the M9 at some point in the future, if necessary. Â Why am I getting a "Life of Brian - What have the Romans ever done for us?" moment here? Â Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted September 18, 2012 Share #99 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Hi Andy, Â Is the M body thicker overall than the M9? or is the 5mm extra due to the thumbwheel protrusion? Â Seen anything else interesting at Photokina? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 18, 2012 Share #100 Â Posted September 18, 2012 Or Leica could be burning off their stock of CCDs on this "new" model. Only time will tell if they will support the M9/M9P or simply offer their "upgrade solution". At this point, Leica's actions will speak louder...and with more veracity...than their words. Quite unlikely, as they obviously tend to order the sensors in smallish batches. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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