S120mm review

[eronald]

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Is there any way to hi-speed sync with studio flash? Me, Elinchrom.

 

Edmund

[plevyadophy]

Is there any way to hi-speed sync with studio flash? Me, Elinchrom.

 

Edmund

 

I don't qute know what you mean by "hi-speed sync"?

 

If you mean the ability to use the HSS/FP modes of on-camera speedlights, then I think the answer is no, with possibly one exception. The possible exception being the Quantum lighting system, but then it is only really fully compatible with Canon, Nikon, and Olympus TTL modes (manual flash for all other camera systems). To tell the truth, I know that it is fully compatible with the Nikon CLS lighting feature set but I am not too sure if it can also do HSS/FP mode, you will have to check. In any event, it will probably be the only studio type flash system that can do it (hopefully someone will correct me if I am wrong).

 

On the other hand, if by "hi-speed sync" you mean the ability to use flash at very fast shutter speeds with the flash at full power, then yeah that is possible. However, like most things in photography, there is a cost/penalty. The cost/penalty is that you will have to buy a very powerful and expensive head and pack lighting system from your preferred manufacturer. The likes of Profoto and Broncolor are well known for their fast flash/powerful kits (I would hazard a guess that Elinchrom too have similarly powerful kits in their catalogue).

 

When looking up flash sync/duration data of various lighting manufacturers be aware of the "lie" that they nearly all tell (some notable exceptions being Quantum, Lencarta and Metz). That is to say, they quote the flash speed/duration according to the t0.5 standard (for photography the t0.1 standard is more realistic). This way of quoting flash duration makes the flash appear approximately three times faster than it actually is.

 

I hope that all helps?

 

Regards,

 

plevyadophy

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[eronald]

I guess if you set flash power down on a studio flash unit, then the flash lasts longer; one would still need to trigger the flash a bit before running the shutter - any device that can do that?

 

Edmund

 

I don't qute know what you mean by "hi-speed sync"?

 

If you mean the ability to use the HSS/FP modes of on-camera speedlights, then I think the answer is no, with possibly one exception. The possible exception being the Quantum lighting system, but then it is only really fully compatible with Canon, Nikon, and Olympus TTL modes (manual flash for all other camera systems). To tell the truth, I know that it is fully compatible with the Nikon CLS lighting feature set but I am not too sure if it can also do HSS/FP mode, you will have to check. In any event, it will probably be the only studio type flash system that can do it (hopefully someone will correct me if I am wrong).

 

On the other hand, if by "hi-speed sync" you mean the ability to use flash at very fast shutter speeds with the flash at full power, then yeah that is possible. However, like most things in photography, there is a cost/penalty. The cost/penalty is that you will have to buy a very powerful and expensive head and pack lighting system from your preferred manufacturer. The likes of Profoto and Broncolor are well known for their fast flash/powerful kits (I would hazard a guess that Elinchrom too have similarly powerful kits in their catalogue).

 

When looking up flash sync/duration data of various lighting manufacturers be aware of the "lie" that they nearly all tell (some notable exceptions being Quantum, Lencarta and Metz). That is to say, they quote the flash speed/duration according to the t0.5 standard (for photography the t0.1 standard is more realistic). This way of quoting flash duration makes the flash appear approximately three times faster than it actually is.

 

I hope that all helps?

 

Regards,

 

plevyadophy

[plevyadophy]

I guess if you set flash power down on a studio flash unit, then the flash lasts longer; one would still need to trigger the flash a bit before running the shutter - any device that can do that?

 

Edmund

 

 

No, in actual fact when one turns down the flash unit, whether speedlight or studio strobe, the duration of the flash is shortened.

 

There is no need for a device of the kind you are asking of. A flash will either trigger at/near the beginning of a shutter's opening (front/first curtain sync) or near the end (rear/second curtain sync), and this is dependant upon the settings you choose on your camera body. Whether a flash duration is slow or quick has no bearing on whether or not you use first or second curtain sync; that choice is dependent on your own ceative/technical preference.

 

Regards,

[eronald]

No, in actual fact when one turns down the flash unit, whether speedlight or studio strobe, the duration of the flash is shortened.

 

There is no need for a device of the kind you are asking of. A flash will either trigger at/near the beginning of a shutter's opening (front/first curtain sync) or near the end (rear/second curtain sync), and this is dependant upon the settings you choose on your camera body. Whether a flash duration is slow or quick has no bearing on whether or not you use first or second curtain sync; that choice is dependent on your own ceative/technical preference.

 

Regards,

 

I think we are on different technical sides of this debate. I got my info from the gentleman who designed the original Elinchrom compact units, in Switzerland when I went to visit him, but it's obvious you are more knowledgable about flash than he is.

 

Edmund

[mwilliamsphotography]

Lots of confusion here ... a language issue perhaps?

 

HSS (High Speed Sync), isn't actually true sync as we normally think of it ... if I recall correctly, it is multiple cumulative bursts at shorter durations ... shorter duration allows use of a faster shutter speed. Actual level of light from a speed-light is always relatively the same ... the difference in amount of light reaching the sensor is determined by how long the light is on ... not volume of light.

 

Likewise, when using any studio strobe, the lower the setting, the shorter the duration relative to maximum setting. In conditions where the ambient light is considerably lower than that of the strobe, shutter speed doesn't matter as much, the camera/aperture is only recording the flash burst.

 

What does matter is that shutter speed determines the level of ambient. If the slow shutter speed allows to much ambient while using flash, you are in effect capturing two images, and a double blurred image can happen ... one crisper frozen image from the flash, and a second blurred one from the slow shutter speed that recorded the ambient.

 

Second shutter settings for flash allow for the shorter duration flash to fire at the end of the shutter travel rather than at the beginning ... so a moving car at night shot with a slow shutter speed will record the smeared ambient tail lights behind the car rather than over it.

 

When slower shutter speeds and flash are well combined in darker conditions, so there is little or no double image, but the ambient is also recorded instead of a wall of black behind the subject, it is commonly referred to as "Dragging the Shutter." Once mastered, dragging the shutter can almost eliminate the more obvious tell-tale signs that flash was used.

 

It should be noted that most radio controls only allow sync speeds to 1/250th with a focal plane shutter, and 1/500th with a leaf shutter camera. Faster ones are coming on the market, but most existing ones are limited. To get full use of my Hasselbald H camera's 1/800th full sync speed, I would have to hard-wire the camera to the strobe.

 

Blah, Blah, blah ... I probably have something backwards here ... LOL!

 

-Marc

[peterv]

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Found some test shots with the 120 mm on Flickr:

 

Leica S2 S + 120mm F2.5 macro - a set on Flickr

[JMacD]

Glad to see we are back to discussing the 120 instead of flash on the S2. But I suppose Andy would have preferred our discussing any lenses on the Customer forum in the future?

[Constable]

This lense is sweet! Highland cattle in low mist on the Swiss French border. Low light, sun about 20° above the horizon. Hand held, ISO 160, f 6.8 1/1500 s

 

Ed

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[Nick Rains]

Glad to see we are back to discussing the 120 instead of flash on the S2. But I suppose Andy would have preferred our discussing any lenses on the Customer forum in the future?

 

I have been shooting some focus stacked flowers with the 120 macro.

 

Focus Stacks

 

It's a fine lens, as good as the 70mm, if not a bit sharper. It's not easy to use as a macro lens, very unforgiving, but when it does nail it, it is awesome. Love the bokeh too.

 

I shot some portraits too, a few months back and some are quite ruthlessly sharp.

 

My flower pics are shot on full manual, but I did try out the 180 on AF and found no issues around accuracy - it simply focussed where I pointed it.

[peterv]

Nick, very interesting, thanks. I like the colors in the garden-flower very much.

 

In your article you mention 1:1 capability of the 120mm Macro.

 

LEICA Camera AG - LEICA APO MACRO SUMMARIT-S 1:2,5/120 mm (CS)

 

Largest image scale 1:2

 

Am I missing something?

 

Still very nice with regard to the sensor size

[mwilliamsphotography]

First shots with the 120 ...

 

-Marc

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[Anthony Flores]

First shots with the 120 ...

 

-Marc

 

Jesus, that's some seriously shallow DOF. But amazing Mark, some of the nicest macro shots I've ever seen with the S2 ....

[Nick Rains]

In your article you mention 1:1 capability of the 120mm Macro.

 

LEICA Camera AG - LEICA APO MACRO SUMMARIT-S 1:2,5/120 mm (CS)

 

Largest image scale 1:2

 

Am I missing something?

 

 

Oops, my bad - you are correct, 1:2 it is. Minimum field size is about 92mm as measured on a ruler at min focus. That's almost 1:2, as near as makes no difference.

[stephan_w]

The real question, is what the 180 is for. At a 142 mm SLR equivalence it is not really long enough for nature photography. I have been using it for architectural and art work and am exceptionally pleased. But for nature, I reach for the D3x (or increasingly the D7000).

 

sorry to jump in here, but this statement captured my attention. Owning a D3x I'm actually considering an S2 for portraiture and Landscape, and try actually to find out if it's woth to take the jump. Can you tell me why you take the D3x for nature?

[Constable]

Also jumping in....

 

Reach purely and simple

 

I couldn't have put it better .. D3x and increasingly D7000

 

but macro is a different matter although I still think in the field (insects) that it will be the D3x

 

Everything else ... S2

 

Ed

[JMacD]

Stephan,

It's worth it.

Get a 35mm plus a 120mm and you will be set.

You don't have to dump your Nikon, keep it and see how much you use it.

 

Regardiing the 120mm in macro, focus stacking gives you a great option, but the limited DOF is a great creative tool. For portraits, I prefer the limited DOF.