ho_co Posted September 21, 2010 Share #1 Posted September 21, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Okay, we've already got a thread on the lack of thread in the M9 Titanium's shutter release button. What about the missing frame preview lever? Mike Johnston says he never used it. I use it often. I think the M9 Titanium is luscious. I like the flat top plate. The front of the top plate looks less frilly without the frame illumination window. And the camera looks great without the frame preview lever. Would loss of the frame preview lever bother anyone else? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 Hi ho_co, Take a look here frame preview lever. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
aymoon Posted September 21, 2010 Share #2 Posted September 21, 2010 it would bother me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted September 22, 2010 Share #3 Posted September 22, 2010 Hello Howard, I think the issue is not whether or not a lever will be there aesthetically speaking but rather whether or not there will be an equivalent (possibly better) device/mechanism for doing the same previewing which is equivalently accessable and operable. Best Regards, Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted September 22, 2010 Share #4 Posted September 22, 2010 Howard. Years ago I used it and I thought it was a good idea, I'd have missed it back then. Now, I know where 28 is about, and I know where 35 is about and so on. So, now I would't miss it much at all. Less is more on this one. As for the cosmetics of the m9t, its ok. Neither here nor there for me. My eye likes the classic look but, I could go for the titanium look if that was it. What I actually would like is a hand grip to be an integrated bump-out on the body. It could house a larger standard battery and one of those fancy toothpicks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chanyr Posted September 22, 2010 Share #5 Posted September 22, 2010 I think it'll look less like a classic M without the frame-preview lever. The missing rewind tab already makes the M8/M9 look slightly different. I like having the frameline preview lever because it allows us to see different framelines without having to attach a lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjames9142 Posted September 22, 2010 Share #6 Posted September 22, 2010 If you want the Titanium look, there seems to be only one lens. I don't think this camera is going to be anyone's working tool. My M9 lever fell off, which is strange because I never even use it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 22, 2010 Author Share #7 Posted September 22, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Years ago I used it and I thought it was a good idea, I'd have missed it back then. Now, I know where 28 is about, and I know where 35 is about and so on. So, now I would't miss it much at all. Less is more on this one.... Rick, seeing it put that way, I think that pretty well fits me as well. I'll have to pay more attention to my actual usage. I can't imagine an M camera without it, but I don't know how much I actually use it these days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 22, 2010 Author Share #8 Posted September 22, 2010 If you want the Titanium look, there seems to be only one lens. I don't think this camera is going to be anyone's working tool. My M9 lever fell off, which is strange because I never even use it. Gee, James, I think you've scored on three points. First, who cares, since the camera is going to be on a shelf. Second, I certainly wouldn't want to use my titanium body with anything other than a titanium lens. And since there's only one of those, the preview lever is unnecessary. Third, "I never even use it" may be the pivotal point. Even though I agree with the folks here who say they'd miss it, that may be more nostalgia than anything else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 22, 2010 Author Share #9 Posted September 22, 2010 ... whether or not there will be an equivalent (possibly better) device/mechanism for doing the same previewing ... Very good thought, Michael. My thinking is in a rut. It used to be a selling feature ("can't do that with Contax"). Leica makes use of the bayonet lugs as part of the lens recognition process, and the frame preview lever makes it easy to see whether that process is working mechanically. But the question is: Do I still use it? If not, it may not be necessary. If so, must it be done the old way, or is there a better way? Quite interesting, the ideas that come to mind from this "design exercise." And it's good to get input from different viewpoints to help sort through the issues. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
india42 Posted September 22, 2010 Share #10 Posted September 22, 2010 I think it'll look less like a classic M without the frame-preview lever. The missing rewind tab already makes the M8/M9 look slightly different. I like having the frameline preview lever because it allows us to see different framelines without having to attach a lens. Hmmm, My M3 from 1954 doesn't have a frame preview lever, and it's certainly a classic M!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo_Lorentzen Posted September 22, 2010 Share #11 Posted September 22, 2010 For practical use I don't think the lack of preview lever means a lot. But I find the comment that the lack of levers make the camera look less like the original cameras interesting. Maybe part of the issue here is " do I want to be being enamored with the original look" or "do I want to use a Modern functional camera based on the classical leica principle" Please note Im not saying in any way that the old camera style is not functional, just that for those users who have to go make a living with the camera again tomorrow, there may be room for re-thinking some of the leica-ness ? Personally I like the concept and if it was a 9.2 I would probably purchase one. I don't like straps much, and pretty much pick the lens I want to use without "preview" and 90% of my long exposures start with the self-timer... so as much as I like those features, they might not really be helping me much, Im open for the concept that a camera with reorganized features could be a rangefinder which might help me focus more on the image.. (though Im not saying my photography is good enough that anyone would actually be able to notice the improvement.) . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted September 22, 2010 Share #12 Posted September 22, 2010 The preview lever is a feature that has sold very many lenses for Leica. It still does. And even if the outside lever is removed, the inside coupling does still serve a purpose in identifying the lens mounted, even with the six-bit coding. And then there's the framelines, of course. Since some bright person got the idea of adding the lever to the M3 in 1955, it has not been absent from any M produced in series except the M1--MD technical cameras; and the MD models lacked even finders, in any case. Mental inertia is not why it is still there. The old man from 1954 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted September 22, 2010 Share #13 Posted September 22, 2010 Was useful for the Leicameter as well and is still more ergonomic than that of the R-D1. Rules are made to be broken. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 22, 2010 Share #14 Posted September 22, 2010 Gee, James, I think you've scored on three points. First, who cares, since the camera is going to be on a shelf. Second, I certainly wouldn't want to use my titanium body with anything other than a titanium lens. And since there's only one of those, the preview lever is unnecessary. Third, "I never even use it" may be the pivotal point. Even though I agree with the folks here who say they'd miss it, that may be more nostalgia than anything else. There are plenty of titanium lenses on the market used. (Not solid of course, but who will see the difference) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpattison Posted September 22, 2010 Share #15 Posted September 22, 2010 It would be interesting to know whether the correct frame shows, if you have a non 6bit lens on, using the manual selection feature, say a 50 'lux. Then change lenses in a hurry and forget to reset the manual selection. Does the bayonet coupling overide it, like in a standard camera? John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted September 22, 2010 Share #16 Posted September 22, 2010 It's available, but at a price. I use my frame lever frequently, so I'll want one on my Titanium. Has anybody got an image of the M9Ti with a black lens on it, please. Just want to make sure the aesthetics are right before she plonks my money down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlesphoto99 Posted September 22, 2010 Share #17 Posted September 22, 2010 I wouldn't miss it. But I still think RED illuminated frame lines could be very distracting/overbearing. Of course none of us will probably ever get to see whether they are or not.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aymoon Posted September 22, 2010 Share #18 Posted September 22, 2010 My reason for wanting a frame preview lever has absolutely nothing to do with the look of the camera or nostalgia. If i'm only using one lens, then yes, it is absolutely redundant. But if I'm using a selection of lenses, it helps to be able to have a quick look to check which lens might be best to switch to next. I have a plethora of lenses for my nikon (all primes), and have had a few moments (not regularly) when I've switched to another lens only to realise that my judgement was slightly off, and I'd need to switch again. This costs time and can be a pain in the ............ Yes, I'd like to say that I can look at a scene and guess with absolute certainty which lens I need to capture what I want; I'm almost there, but not quite.The preview lever simply adds a level of certainty that is convenient without being complicated or providing feature overload. It's also one of the many reasons that I prefer a rangefinder over an SLR. As a parallel, we could say that we don't need an exposure meter, as we should be able to train ourselves to judge the exposure without an electronic gadget assisting us; sunny 16 and all that. This is true but, for the vast majority of us, I would say it's an unrealistic expectation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Negative Posted September 22, 2010 Share #19 Posted September 22, 2010 The frame preview is one of the great benefits of the M (and RFs) IMO! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted September 22, 2010 Share #20 Posted September 22, 2010 It would be interesting to know whether the correct frame shows, if you have a non 6bit lens on, using the manual selection feature, say a 50 'lux. Then change lenses in a hurry and forget to reset the manual selection. Does the bayonet coupling overide it, like in a standard camera? John Unfortunately, no. I am not certain that this deficit is actually a technical necessity. I once shot a 21mm Summilux ASPH while the camera was still set to my dear old 35mm Summicron v.4 (that was before I had it coded). But inexplicably, the pictures came out just fine. This experience should of course not be generalized: Coding is a very good idea. So all my lenses shorter than 90mm have been retro-coded. The only Leica lens I have that I actually bought coded is the 35mm Summilux ASPH v.2! The old man from the Days of the Enigma Codes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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