leicaaddict Posted July 27, 2010 Share #121 Â Posted July 27, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Leica's history with this sort of thing would suggest that they will certainly fix it even if it's out of warranty. Â That give me some security, thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Baptiste Posted July 28, 2010 Share #122  Posted July 28, 2010 Very nice, but I'm not sure that it's very interesting how long thy last. I would have thought a bar chart of when the cracked cameras were purchased would be most interesting. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it just 1 in September, October, November, December and one in January i.e. none from purchases for the last six months.  Well actually, you can see both on the graph: the starting point is the purchase month, and the ending point is the cracking month. The bar gives you the "life" of cracked sensors.  On the month axis, 1 is standing for september. Then I plotted the bars for people that have provided the purchase & cracking info (some have only reported the SN). So right now, I only plotted the case of 6 people (out of 11 reports).  My remarks are: - not enough statistics: it might be that indeed, the phenomenon is negligible (no offense for those who encounted it!) - yes, no crack on camera purchased during the last 6 months - BUT: this is still interesting to measure the life of cracking sensors: you can see that they crack after 10 months of use... So the fact that no camera of the last 6 month shew the issue is absolutely not ensuring that the issue is solved - 2 cracked sensors on fresh camera, due probably to the shipping -> means that the sensor is sensitive to drops & so on... Trivial maybe, but it means that M9 (same with M8?) are not the war-proof MP or other electronic-less M... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 28, 2010 Share #123 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Due to shipping? Was the RF out on both or either of the cameras? That is the first thing that happens when you drop a Leica M.There is no proof of that, so the conclusion is a bit wobbly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bman Posted July 28, 2010 Share #124 Â Posted July 28, 2010 The stats so far... does not suggests that its any particular batch. s/n and no. reported. 3804=1 3809=1 3810=5 3811=2 3834=1 3836=1 I presumed those s/n 3834-3836 are the grays. With more data, the probability of your sensor cracking can be calculated (if we have a normal distribution). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted July 28, 2010 Share #125  Posted July 28, 2010 Due to shipping? Was the RF out on both or either of the cameras? That is the first thing that happens when you drop a Leica M.There is no proof of that, so the conclusion is a bit wobbly. Didn’t someone describe the cover glass of his M9 cracking when it was basically just sitting there? It was a few months ago if I remember correctly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptiste Posted July 28, 2010 Share #126 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Due to shipping? Was the RF out on both or either of the cameras? That is the first thing that happens when you drop a Leica M.There is no proof of that, so the conclusion is a bit wobbly. Â Okay, I have less feedback about Leica RF, didn't know that in case of hurt, the first thing that shows up is RF misalignment. Nevertheless, I guess that people who got a cracked M9 are not pushing the analysis to FR alignment, did they? Â More seriously, I find hard to believe that broken sensors M9 may get out of the production line without notice from the quality guys. I fairly believe it happened during shipping... And fair enough we have a poor statistic, but sensor crack seem to happen after some months, it doesn't seem o be a matter of days... So I suppose that something occured during shipping so that the crack appears. Â This let me run to the previous shortcut... Doens't it make sense? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 28, 2010 Share #127 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm not saying it doesn't make sense, I'm saying insufficient data - no conclusion about mechanical reliability possible. I can say I dropped my M9 hard enough to get the RF seriously out of whack - twice. And that did not crack the sensor. Nor did vibrating it hard enough to -again - get the RF out of adjustment in a light aircraft crack the sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptiste Posted July 28, 2010 Share #128 Â Posted July 28, 2010 I'm not saying it doesn't make sense, I'm saying insufficient data - no conclusion about mechanical reliability possible. I can say I dropped my M9 hard enough to get the RF seriously out of whack - twice. And that did not crack the sensor. Nor did vibrating it hard enough to -again - get the RF out of adjustment in a light aircraft crack the sensor. Â That's a good news for other M9 users, you made the benchmark for us Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 28, 2010 Share #129 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Well- these are things - don't try this at home Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted July 28, 2010 Share #130 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Well mine didn't crack during hard use, it was after three or four frames into a sixty shot afternoon. And during that time it was around my neck. I don't buy the hard use or shipping idea. And nothing else was unusual, not a hot or cold day (its been out in both extremes), not wet, not humid, no lens change, and it always has focused perfectly, so nothing. Â Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted July 28, 2010 Share #131 Â Posted July 28, 2010 Well actually, you can see both on the graph: the starting point is the purchase month, and the ending point is the cracking month. The bar gives you the "life" of cracked sensors. Â On the month axis, 1 is standing for september. Then I plotted the bars for people that have provided the purchase & cracking info (some have only reported the SN). So right now, I only plotted the case of 6 people (out of 11 reports). Â My remarks are: - not enough statistics: it might be that indeed, the phenomenon is negligible (no offense for those who encounted it!) - yes, no crack on camera purchased during the last 6 months - BUT: this is still interesting to measure the life of cracking sensors: you can see that they crack after 10 months of use... So the fact that no camera of the last 6 month shew the issue is absolutely not ensuring that the issue is solved - 2 cracked sensors on fresh camera, due probably to the shipping -> means that the sensor is sensitive to drops & so on... Trivial maybe, but it means that M9 (same with M8?) are not the war-proof MP or other electronic-less M... No, but this story broke in October or November, and there were a number of sensors which were cracked then, some out of the box, but most were shortly thereafter. So although your statistics suggest a longish wait before cracking, there were a number then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted July 28, 2010 Share #132 Â Posted July 28, 2010 The stats so far... does not suggests that its any particular batch.s/n and no. reported. 3804=1 3809=1 3810=5 3811=2 3834=1 3836=1 I presumed those s/n 3834-3836 are the grays. With more data, the probability of your sensor cracking can be calculated (if we have a normal distribution). Â But you're assuming that serial numbers are sequential within batches, which we all know not to be the case. Added to which, unless we see the spread of serial numbers over a period you can't see how many batches that covers. Furthermore, if you postulated that a batch of sensors/ cover glasses etc. was affected, they may have been in a 'bin' with another batch, and could easily have been spread over a fair period of camera batches. Â I'm sure that Leica have full traceability, but, believe me, trying to extrapolate from a particular period is tough enough . . . to extrapolate from the serial number engraved on the hotshoe is really pushing it. Â When this first happened back in October/November/December, it was serious enough for Stefan Daniel to chip in with reassurance. Since then there have been a few examples, and recently a few more(hot weather perhaps?), but so far, as far as I can see, it's only happened to cameras purchased prior to February. That isn't proof of anything, but it does suggest to me that they had a problem, they fixed it in production, and now they'll fix it quickly and without complaint in older cameras where it turns up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 28, 2010 Share #133 Â Posted July 28, 2010 That is reassuring. I have an old one, but it got a new sensor a few weeks ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baptiste Posted July 28, 2010 Share #134 Â Posted July 28, 2010 I hope... I got mine late February, sn 3837 xxx. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bman Posted July 29, 2010 Share #135 Â Posted July 29, 2010 I hope... I got mine late February, sn 3837 xxx. Â Hoping the same... My mid-may sn is 3838xxx, gray. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
reventlow Posted July 31, 2010 Share #136 Â Posted July 31, 2010 3810825 Bought 12/2009 Cracked around April 2010 Repair took 4 weeks. Leica repair ladies helped to get it moving. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted August 1, 2010 Share #137 Â Posted August 1, 2010 3810825 Bought 12/2009Cracked around April 2010 Repair took 4 weeks. Leica repair ladies helped to get it moving. Â Those ladies are great aren't they - Andrea is my favorite I'm sorry you had a problem. I bought my gray one in December as well, so I guess that I'm in the frame. It hasn't broken yet though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted August 1, 2010 Share #138 Â Posted August 1, 2010 Those ladies are great aren't they - Andrea is my favoriteI'm sorry you had a problem. I bought my gray one in December as well, so I guess that I'm in the frame. It hasn't broken yet though! Â Very clever of Leica. When you phone up with steam coming out of your ears, after yet another "muck up", they are always so nice and helpful, it completely disarms you. Â Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobrudolph Posted August 2, 2010 Share #139 Â Posted August 2, 2010 Here is another: #03809781 silver. The glass breaking happened today (August 1, 2010) mid-afternoon. Had made about seven images, took a coffee break and then ten more. Saw the crack at once in checking the images. I'll check with Sean at Camera West but I think I send the camera to Solms, I'm afraid of the huge delays I hear about with NJ service, and other issues. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bman Posted August 2, 2010 Share #140 Â Posted August 2, 2010 The stats so far (taken from cracked S/N) if members dont mind: M9 cracked sn.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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