rosuna Posted June 15, 2009 Share #261 Posted June 15, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Leica is definitely not going to build this "solution" themselves. I think they cannot. A mirrorless reflex camera is a video camera, to some extent. Leica cannot do that by themselves. They would need a video partner. Dalsa has experience in cinema digital cameras. Panasonic can do that too. Maybe Arri. Red One? I don't know... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 Hi rosuna, Take a look here Hessenpark News: Official - No R10: no FF M9 (yet). I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted June 15, 2009 Share #262 Posted June 15, 2009 Looks like I've missed announcements from Carl Zeiss - does anyone have a link? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chkphoto Posted June 15, 2009 Share #263 Posted June 15, 2009 Leica is best at glass. The company gains most when it plays to its strengths. So do customers but we are a divided lot. Some are mostly into camera systems. Others love the glass and would use it on any system that gets the best out of the glass – even with electronic viewfinders. Then there’s a third group, which would buy into a whole new camera system if meets the needs of a project. I suspect that is where the S2 is being targeted. GREAT GLASS Leica profits from its expertise in glass by creating and updating lenses. The question is: does it need to build camera systems to do that? You don’t need a crystal ball to know that developing camera systems is risky. If it is not going to compete with the Japanese DSLRs, what system could match even the M8 in production numbers? Coproduction with other system producers has a logic only if there are enough customers out there who appreciate what you gain from great glass. Regards, Mark Agree totally that lens design was their strongest suit. This is realistic for Leica in today's marketing, manufacturing, R&D, and economic environment. The M although a legendary camera, was only and ever a slice of the total photography market. At this point, make great lenses for the various camera makers. There would be a demand for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted June 15, 2009 Share #264 Posted June 15, 2009 Looks like I've missed announcements from Carl Zeiss - does anyone have a link? If you mean Jaap's summary, I am not sure myself if that was a Zeiss or a Cosina summary Jaap? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 15, 2009 Share #265 Posted June 15, 2009 :D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted June 15, 2009 Share #266 Posted June 15, 2009 Erm... I'll try again: Jaap, what company laid off 400 employees, etc.? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 15, 2009 Share #267 Posted June 15, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dseelig Posted June 15, 2009 Share #268 Posted June 15, 2009 I do not want to believe that leica thinks those g1 type of cameras are anyway to replace an r camera . I tried one and the beauty of the rangefinder and even a good slr is a nice viewfinder. Those g1 types of cameras are the worst junk I have ever looked through. Cameras are about feel and results. yes they are nice and small but shooting photos with them my god what a terrible time. I think the s2 is a terrible think for leica hopefully I will be wrong, but now I am seeing used 28 mp leaf backs being sold for $6700. How are people in this economy going to afford a whole new system at leica prices. M lenses a lot bigger to cover the s 2 frame will be double the price and the leaf shutter ones even higher. I hope we see a full frame m body soon fixing the m8 problems better low light no uvir filters and that will be how leica makes it back to the black. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Thawley Posted June 16, 2009 Share #269 Posted June 16, 2009 By the way, has anyone noticed that the R System is still featured on the German Leica website? This company really has become pathetic beyond belief... So is the "Digilux" - ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Thawley Posted June 16, 2009 Share #270 Posted June 16, 2009 Sorry... for me, this all indicates a company that can't see the forest for the trees. Put out a killer "M" style digital rangefinder at a price that "serious photographers" would go for ($3K) - and start selling that wonderful glass. If you consider Canon's approach to glass... consumer lenses and "L" Series pro lenses, Leica could have Panasonic make a "consumer" set of "Leica spec" lenses, thereby relegating the German Leica lenses as "pro" lenses. Just seems to me for all the people that are dropping $800 for the D-Lux 4 point n' shoot, there are a bunch more that would drop $3000 - $4500 for a pro-sumer rangefinder along the lines of the "M" while the company continued to pursue and market a full frame M. One thing is for sure... the company has a phenomenal brand that still carries a strong residual value related to quality. Their inability to capitalize on it is becoming a little bit silly. Point n' shoot high-end consumer Rangefinder high-end pro-sumer Rangefinder traditional high end professional and collector S2 Studio / professional. Set your sites and and take aim. Regarding DSLR for Leica.... sorry... I think that train has left the station. They've missed it. JT Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 16, 2009 Share #271 Posted June 16, 2009 It would be eminently sensible, John - for a company that has the resources - both human and financial - to sustain all these lines at one time. But Leica has not. I think it is a very smart appraisal to determine the field that is least likely to be successful, i.e. the David-Goliath situation in the DSLR world and opt out. Not squandering resources on potential disasters is good business sense- especially if those resources are needed elsewhere and are in short supply. And putting out a "killer rangefinder for 3000$" that would cost 5000$ to build does not seem very productive either. You would need to be able to absorb the initial loss. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted June 16, 2009 Share #272 Posted June 16, 2009 Could be Panasonic - I had not heard about this €20m funding It's in the last published annual report. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted June 16, 2009 Share #273 Posted June 16, 2009 On the other hand, we were told that the court-case of Lee vs Leica seems to be heading Leica's way, with the judge making Leica-favorable comments, which is rather unusual. That might free some reserved capital, if all goes well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spylaw4 Posted June 16, 2009 Share #274 Posted June 16, 2009 I have to correct (?) one small point that cropped up on a dim and distant page in this thread re the M8 upgrades. As far as I gathered, what was meant was that the existing upgrades would continue to be done, but that there would be no more options provided. You can also see from my update from the factory tour thread that the downturn could well be having an effect on production planning and phasing. Do I detect the new CEO's hand in this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted June 16, 2009 Share #275 Posted June 16, 2009 .......You can also see from my update from the factory tour thread that the downturn could well be having an effect on production planning and phasing. Do I detect the new CEO's hand in this? Almost certainly, I would guess. Probably part of the handover brief from Dr. Kaufmann though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Thawley Posted June 16, 2009 Share #276 Posted June 16, 2009 And putting out a "killer rangefinder for 3000$" that would cost 5000$ to build does not seem very productive either. You would need to be able to absorb the initial loss. Actually, it is not uncommon in the electronics business to get longevity from "older" technology by repackaging it and trimming back on the "build" materials. In other words, as we move to an M9, the M8 internals could be repackaged into a cost effective build and enjoy a second life to a new price point in the market. If Panasonic has come up to spec enough to produce the lenses sold with the original Digilux series cameras, they could kick some serious "ass" with pro-sumer priced M mount lenses. I know this idea sticks in the craw of a lot of Leica die-hards, but the company needs to ramp up a larger core base of users and generate increased revenues. These products need not cut into the existing base and, in fact, should help grow a new generation of Leica users. Let's face it, hobbyists are spending ridiculous amounts of money on Canon / Nikon pro-sumer bodies and pro lenses. I don't think the market of people that think these cameras actually take the picture for you will ever shrink. LOL JT Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted June 16, 2009 Share #277 Posted June 16, 2009 Put out a killer "M" ..... would go for ($3K)... JT Ha, ha! What a day dream! The dollar, you see, is not quite what it was. I would be very sceptical about any digital rangefinder camera from Leica bellow 5 - 6,000 $ - at least. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John66 Posted June 16, 2009 Share #278 Posted June 16, 2009 One thing is for sure... the company has a phenomenal brand that still carries a strong residual value related to quality. Their inability to capitalize on it is becoming a little bit silly. Probably one of the most sensible and astute comments I've read in a long time. Perhaps Leica will survive by making lenses for the new Olympus Pen - a camera style and size in the modern digital age that Leica was born to make... but didn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted June 16, 2009 Share #279 Posted June 16, 2009 Glad I bought a Nikon instead of holding my breath. EVF is simply not acceptable. Nor is manual diaphragm. I could live with stop down metering like my old Pentax Spotmatic had. I have collected 12 or 15 Nikkor lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
veraikon Posted June 16, 2009 Share #280 Posted June 16, 2009 I´ll draw you attention to this thread: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-kundenforum/89481-fragestunde-forumstreffen-die-zusammenfassung.html#post936807 (seulement en allemand) Andreas summarised the answers of Stefan Daniel out of his video records. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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