Mystic Posted April 19, 2009 Share #1 Posted April 19, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi, Im thinking about buying another lens in the near future and I guess it will be a wide angle lens. Last week I took a closer look at the Super Angulon 21mm f/4 and the Elmarit-R 24mm. There was an article about the super angulon that said that this is a Schneider lens and that it is very sharp - which is good because Im looking for a sharp lens with nice colors. So how do you compare those two lenses? or which would you recommend? Best regards Daniel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 19, 2009 Posted April 19, 2009 Hi Mystic, Take a look here Leica Super Angulon R 21mm f/4 or Leica Elmarit-R 24mm - best choice?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest Xing Posted April 19, 2009 Share #2 Posted April 19, 2009 The 21mm is indeed a Schneider lens (computation and glass). It dates from about 1968. Like most of the Leica-R optics they were the best of the best at the time, compared to other brand's contemporary lenses, but those other brands have caught up in the ensuing years. There are some of the later R lenses that still claim the blue ribbon, but the 21 S/A isn't one of them. It's a decent lens but don't expect miracles. It's not terribly sharp in the corners, or in the close range, or contrasty until f/8 or f/11, and it flares easily. It's a darn sight more portable than the 1st-version 19mm though. But if you want a wide and can afford it, the 2nd-version 19mm is the one to get. The 24mm is Minolta glass and design set in a Leica-quality mounting. Years ago a friend of mine with an optical bench ran a very precise test of that lens along with the Minolta-mounted version and found that they were indeed identical. Again, it was a good if not great lens for its time, and still performs quite well. The late-AIS Nikkor 24 f/2.8 is a sharper and more contrasty lens by a good margin, but otherwise the Minoltaleica 24 is hard to beat. It will probably boil down to your preference for each focal length. Seems like 3mm shouldn't be such a big deal, but in reality it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest liesevolvo Posted April 19, 2009 Share #3 Posted April 19, 2009 As far as I know, Schneider had quite a variety in quality with the 4/21. Mine is good, hand-selected by a Leitz-worker from a batch of six. It has been a good lens at the time, but it's not to compare with other Leitz-lenses. Don't be surprised: four aperture-blades produce a square-aperture from 8 to 32! Regards! Lenn Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_d Posted April 19, 2009 Share #4 Posted April 19, 2009 I have a late version 24mm and I think it is a fine lens although I didn't do any comparison testing with other 24mm lenses. The image results wide open aren't as sharp as the 35mm Summilux but build quality is definetly leica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard Posted April 20, 2009 Share #5 Posted April 20, 2009 Don't underestimate the 24mm Elmarit-R lens. I recently bought a used one for my SL2 to complement a 35mm lens, and frankly I am positively surprised at how good this lens is. All my other R-lenses are more modern, but there is no reason for the 24 to hide somewhere. I have often read about this lens being "only" a Minolta copy, and so did not think very highly of this lens, but the results are superb. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 20, 2009 Share #6 Posted April 20, 2009 It will probably be too long for the OP, but I think the 28 is the best R wideangle around, and the late-version 19. The choice between the 21 and the 24 are imo a matter of subject, not of lens quality. They are really both very decent lenses, but not the best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyp Posted April 20, 2009 Share #7 Posted April 20, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) My 21 4.0 is one of my never sell lenses. I have no experience with the others. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted April 20, 2009 Share #8 Posted April 20, 2009 Ever used the S-A 21/4 on a 5D gents? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wls.shanghai Posted April 20, 2009 Share #9 Posted April 20, 2009 I use my SuperAngulon 4:21 very very often and I'am very very happy with the result!!! With the 2.8/24 I have no experience. Regards wls Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted April 22, 2009 Share #10 Posted April 22, 2009 It is well known the 24 2.8 has some strange optical traits. I found mine to be way out of debth of field off axis when on axis it was quite fine. If you go back far enough, others have reported exactly the same problem. It is a result of floating elements or not having them, don`t remember. I sold mine for the 21 4.0 which I have had for decades now. Center is good at 4.0. Corners clean up from 5.6 to 8.0 somewhere. Modern designs will out perform it, but it is good enough for what I use a 21 for. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystic Posted April 24, 2009 Author Share #11 Posted April 24, 2009 Very interesting what you write there. Somehow I think that the 21mm Super Angulon is an interesting lens, despite its four blade aperture. My only thought is that those 21mm are probably a little bit too special for "everyday use", thats why I also think about the Elmarit 24mm. @Jaapv....is the 28mm Elmarit way better than those two contenders? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsh Posted April 24, 2009 Share #12 Posted April 24, 2009 You might want to look at the 21-35 Vario Elmar. It is compact and the images are wonderful. Used one in Italy last year along with my 80 Summilux and my 180- Apo Elmarit. I liked it so much that I recently purchased one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
masjah Posted April 24, 2009 Share #13 Posted April 24, 2009 You might want to look at the 21-35 Vario Elmar. It is compact and the images are wonderful. Used one in Italy last year along with my 80 Summilux and my 180- Apo Elmarit. I liked it so much that I recently purchased one. Entirely agree. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystic Posted April 24, 2009 Author Share #14 Posted April 24, 2009 rsh - you are absolutely right, the 21-35 is wonderful and in my opinion the best universal wide angle lens but the price of this thing is.....not bad too. So sadly though it wont be my lens for the future . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlancasterd Posted April 24, 2009 Share #15 Posted April 24, 2009 You might want to look at the 21-35 Vario Elmar. It is compact and the images are wonderful. Used one in Italy last year along with my 80 Summilux and my 180- Apo Elmarit. I liked it so much that I recently purchased one. The 21-35 Vario-Elmar is generally reckoned to deliver images as good as, or better than, the equivalent primes. I'd be reluctant to part with mine. They can be found secondhand at very reasonable prices. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted April 24, 2009 Share #16 Posted April 24, 2009 The 21-35 Vario-Elmar is generally reckoned to deliver images as good as, or better than, the equivalent primes. I'd be reluctant to part with mine. They can be found secondhand at very reasonable prices. Not sure if the 21-35 works with the 5D though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsh Posted April 24, 2009 Share #17 Posted April 24, 2009 Check out Leicashop. About $2,400.00 and you take care of several main focal lengths. https://www.leicashop.com/vintage/leica-lenses-varioelmarr-3542135-asph-c-1000_1007_100765.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loretdem Posted April 25, 2009 Share #18 Posted April 25, 2009 Not sure if the 21-35 works with the 5D though. If you remove the shroud at the rear of the lens (three tiny screws, very easy to do, no consequences) then it works from 35mm to at least 23 or 22mm. My particular 5D2 does not allow me to use it at 21mm, but almost. So I'm able to use all my Leica R lenses down to about 22mm focal length. I would very much like to go wider but short of performing radical surgery on my R lenses or the Canon body, I do not see any practical way of doing so (other than using Canon L ultrawide zooms or primes and even the latest iterations of these leave much to be desired). FWIW, my 21-35 Vario-Elmar on my DMR is great, but on my 5D2 it is AMAZING! God, I hope they'll make the R10 or whatever they'll call it. -Carlos Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted April 25, 2009 Share #19 Posted April 25, 2009 Thank you Carlos. How does the 21-35 vignette at full aperture on your 5D2? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loretdem Posted April 25, 2009 Share #20 Posted April 25, 2009 Thank you Carlos. How does the 21-35 vignette at full aperture on your 5D2? I'm not a consummate lens tester, but this lens does not vignette noticeably at 35 and only slightly at 22-23. The corners are sharp at 35 even at f4 but you have to stop down for truly sharp corners at the wide end. This lens is now always on my 5D2. The focal length range is optimum for me and the high ISO performance of this camera makes the f4 maximum aperture (almost) a non-issue. I'll be getting an AF confirmation adapter soon that I hope will make this combination even better. I decided to go the Leica R lens/Canon FF DSLR route when Leica announced the current demise of the R-system. I'm extremely hopeful that the digital R will appear sooner than later, but I had to make sure I could continue using my preferred lenses regardless. This experiment has been a revelation! Even though my M8.2 and DMR still deliver top quality images, the ability to use these R lenses with a "full frame" 24x36mm sensor at cleanish speeds up to ISO3200 (and beyond if need be) and over 20MP has been an eye opener to say the least. The 5D2 is no Leica (build quality, design, ergonomics, etc) and the files require more effort in post to fully exploit them, but I can shoot in lower light and make larger prints and still keep the image quality high. -Carlos Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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