Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 10, 2008 Share #41 Posted September 10, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) But bear in mind that when (and if) a full frame M becomes available, Leica will have a range of f1.4 lenses from 21 to 50mm. Pretty impressive I'd say. I'm assuming we'll see a 28mm Summilux before too long - I'm guessing the reason it's missing from the new set of lenses is because the existing 28mm Summicron is a stop faster than the current 21/24mm options so it wasn't deemed as urgent. Agree completely here Steve. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 10, 2008 Posted September 10, 2008 Hi Guest guy_mancuso, Take a look here 21 & 24 Summilux?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted September 10, 2008 Share #42 Posted September 10, 2008 Can someone explain to me this sudden fascination with super-wide angle lenses all of a sudden? Is it just because "we can"? A 12mm, even on an M8, gives a 35mm equivalent of about a 16mm. When I were a lad, a 16mm lens was one for very specialist uses only, and would never have been used by "normal" people... Hehe! when i was a lad i had a 50 that's all. But we got spoiled with inexpensive lenses like CVs 12 and 15 that we had not then. Now i don't use wider than 21 myself, even on cropped bodies, so when i say that 'we' miss 12-18 i mean 'they' to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitnaros Posted September 10, 2008 Share #43 Posted September 10, 2008 Isn't a wide, fast lens on a M8 at least as valuable as on a future FF M? The M8 sensor crops, so the 21mm are double-welcome to give me a wider FOV... Not sure why some folks think that a wide lens like a 21mm only make sense on a FF camera... Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiisaka Posted September 10, 2008 Share #44 Posted September 10, 2008 I agree with you Andy but a 16mm would lend itself to the M8. That would be about 24mm on 35mm film. Still a WIDE lens. Right now the widest fixed FL lens Leica make is the 21 which is a 28 on film. I'd like something a little wider and faster then the Zeiss 18 or the WATE or the CV 15. A 16mm is an equivalent of a 21mm lens. Pretty wide. I know it's fashionable among photojournalists to use super-wides these days, but to be honest, I'd rather see good photographs taken with a "normal" lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 10, 2008 Share #45 Posted September 10, 2008 I agree with you Andy but a 16mm would lend itself to the M8. That would be about 24mm on 35mm film. Still a WIDE lens. Right now the widest fixed FL lens Leica make is the 21 which is a 28 on film. I'd like something a little wider and faster then the Zeiss 18 or the WATE or the CV 15. Yes, but a 12mm? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted September 10, 2008 Share #46 Posted September 10, 2008 "When I were a lad, a 16mm lens was one for very specialist uses only, and would never have been used by "normal" people." This is a Leica forum - no "normal people" here! (wink!) Seriously - the single biggest money-making lens for me, in any system I've used since 1980, including Leica M - has been the 20-21 equivalent. Which is a 15/16 on the M8 (Shootist: 18mm=24mm on the M8). The Summiluxes are obviously the big news in the M line**, and the ones grabbed by CH. d'I. as headlines, but there may still (I hope) be at least one 16-to-18 prime lurking out there to be announced Monday or whenever. Then again, KM25 is also likely correct that these lenses indicate Leica is intent on getting to a 24x36 digital M once the technology is there, and perhaps it is just going to let C/V and Zeiss hold the fort until then. Sigh! (**I think the HUGE news is going to be where Leica plans to go with the non-RF system camera - my own suspicion is something almost view-camera-like (but smaller) - a "middle format" as opposed to medium-format, with a camera fully divorced from the "35mm" model that Leica pioneered 80 years ago and has never strayed from. Something that they can charge Leica prices for with image quality to make it worth it - something not even on the same planet as Nikon/Canon/Sony SLRs - and yet simpler (cheaper) to build in a small european workshop than those fiddly complex motor-focus, motor-mirror cameras.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 10, 2008 Share #47 Posted September 10, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hmmm . My bet on that Andy is lenses for Sinar and Leaf camera's owned by none other than Jenoptik. I know Sinar is but not sure on leaf but they take the same Rollie lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted September 10, 2008 Share #48 Posted September 10, 2008 Yes, but a 12mm? Andy you need to get out and spread your wings. LOL There a barrel of fun. I do love wide angles Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackal Posted September 10, 2008 Share #49 Posted September 10, 2008 my dream has come true... i use the 24 a lot on the M8 and a summilux version will be fantatsic.. i was banging on about that rumour of a 24 1.4 some time ago and im gald it looks to have come ture but when the M8 goes full frame it will too wide so I'll probably then sell it Surely these lenses indicate that the crop factor is going to around for quite a while longer ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted September 10, 2008 Share #50 Posted September 10, 2008 Guy (getting a bit off the Summilux topic): I ssume you have at least checked out the "S1" from a decade ago. Now imagine what Leica could with that now that there are big image sensors and they can skip the scanning method. It could use M lenses, R lenses, Hasselblad lenses - no flipping mirror to leave room for. Big square image. Presumably it could be a bit more compact today, also, since one could do away with the need to slide the viewing system out of the way for exposures. Personally I think EITHER a 28 or a 24 equates to roughly a 35mm on the 1.33x crop M8 - the 24 is a "32" - the 28 is a "38" - 3mm either way from "35mm". By the same token 21 AND 24 'luxes seem a bit duplicative to me - I'd have done a 21 and 28 lux and tossed the 24 focal length. But everybdy has their own preferences for microscopic differences.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted September 10, 2008 Share #51 Posted September 10, 2008 Aiming? I would say they've been perceived as such for quite some time now. Getting into an M system with 3 basic lenses has always been prohibitve for the average person when they compared the price of entry to what Nikon or Canon offered. Professional grade equipment has always been pricey - and I'm in the camp that views the M system as professional grade stuff for the most part. Yes - the new M lenses are expensive, but when you start getting into the higher echelons of what Nikon & Canon offer (think 400/2.8 or 600/4) - none of this stuff is cheap. Indeed, but in fact for many years the well-heeled(but not madly rich) and enthusiastic amateur has been the majority purchaser of the M-system; lose that market at your peril. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted September 10, 2008 Share #52 Posted September 10, 2008 I wonder how many people are going to fork out $11,223.00 for a lens? Seems rather absurd to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldie Posted September 10, 2008 Share #53 Posted September 10, 2008 The M8 is the last camera that Leica should be building a system around. The crop factor is simply a limitation, not an intended design feature. So in a way, they are where Nikon was not too long ago, stuck with stop-gap technology until a proper format sensor can be made. So with this in mind, why spend R/D money on lenses that are going to get your favorite focal length lenses in cropped fashion? I will say just what I said in the other thread. These new lenses show that not only is Leica committed to the M system, it is committed to the release of a full frame M, however long it needs to take. In a few years, the M8 will be in the annals of Leica history and pale in comparison to a proper digital M. It is getting us by, but with outstanding Leica glass, it is truly a shame it crops them and Leica knows this is far from optimal. So instead of complaining about what Leica is not making for the M8, why not try to understand the bigger picture, a proper M system that uses the lenses correctly? The Next digital M might not be full frame, but it will be darn close, so why waste money on making Leica "DX" lenses? Well we agree then on the ultimate goal of the M-system! My concern is not so much the lenses per se ( I might well buy one of them), but the commercial viability of the system both in the short and long term. Leica may be privately owned but how deep are Herr Kaufmann's pockets and how tolerant are his banks. Given the present loss making status, expanding the user base of the M8 would seem to be a high priority; lense sales would then follow on organically. I can't see the M8.2 doing much to drive M8 sales up. Then the future may prove me completely wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Leung Posted September 10, 2008 Share #54 Posted September 10, 2008 I wonder how many people are going to fork out $11,223.00 for a lens? Seems rather absurd to me. not much. I think people who would buy it mostly treat as a toy or collector items and money is not an issue to them. A friend of mine have a pair of speakers that costs over 100K ( not to mention the costs for the rest of the system ) and he hardly listen to it. it is "to show" only. he works in wall street. DL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted September 10, 2008 Share #55 Posted September 10, 2008 They are too close in price to mint used examples of something more interesting. I could have bought a new 35 Summarit in the Spring, but bought a mint (coded, even, so it must have been less than two years old) Summicron instead, for not much more money. Fine, Andy... EXACTLY what me too did...late in the Spring. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted September 10, 2008 Share #56 Posted September 10, 2008 not much. I think people who would buy it mostly treat as a toy or collector items and money is not an issue to them. A friend of mine have a pair of speakers that costs over 100K ( not to mention the costs for the rest of the system ) and he hardly listen to it. it is "to show" only. he works in wall street. DL If the top people at Leica think their future lies in products at this price point, maybe they should consider bringing Steven Lee back to run the place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manolo Posted September 10, 2008 Share #57 Posted September 10, 2008 These new lenses show that not only is Leica committed to the M system, it is committed to the release of a full frame M, however long it needs to take. Amen brother. How about the R line? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 10, 2008 Share #58 Posted September 10, 2008 Andy you need to get out and spread your wings. LOL There a barrel of fun. I do love wide angles It's not something that's going to pay for your kids to go through college though, is it? Not at these prices... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 10, 2008 Share #59 Posted September 10, 2008 Fine, Andy... EXACTLY what me too did...late in the Spring. You kind of feel guilty, though... A NEW lens adds revenue directly to Leica's bottom line. But, buying second hand doesn't. On the other hand, if someone pays for a coded 35 Summicron ASPH and doesn't like it, and I buy if from his dealer (which I did), it encourages said person to buy something even more exotic. It's his loss, not Leica's. So, vicariously, I AM adding to Leica's coffers, by buying used. It has often been said that Leica don't need to release a "bargain" lens line, because the used market provides that. True. If you can buy a nice, clean 1960s Summaron, or a 2006 Summicron, and stick it on your new £3,000 M8 with nice results, so what? Today's 1960 Summaron buyer, will be tomorrow's 21 Summilux buyer. (Or something like that...) Long live Leica! Long live the second hand Leica market! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manolo Posted September 10, 2008 Share #60 Posted September 10, 2008 It has often been said that Leica don't need to release a "bargain" lens line, because the used market provides that. True. Long live Leica! Long live the second hand Leica market! Amen brother. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.